# Stupid Question On Adjusting Wd Bars



## m2edumacated (Feb 12, 2012)

Ok, here it comes. Using eazlift round bar system. Reccomendation is to have bars parallel to ground. Would pulling the bars up to the frame pull even more weight to front axels? Or does it start to somehow have a negative effect. Just thinking and thought i would ask.


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## dhdb (Dec 14, 2009)

Keep,the bars parallel to the ground. If you feel the need to transfer more weight, tilt the ball back some more. This will add more tension to the bars. But again, keep,the bars parallel to the ground.


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## Sean Woodruff (Dec 20, 2007)

Yes, pulling the bars up more would transfer more weight to the front axle.

I've sold over 20,000 hitches in my career and would guess that less than 5% have the bars parallel to the ground when the tongue weight is properly distributed.


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## m2edumacated (Feb 12, 2012)

Sean Woodruff said:


> Yes, pulling the bars up more would transfer more weight to the front axle.
> 
> I've sold over 20,000 hitches in my career and would guess that less than 5% have the bars parallel to the ground when the tongue weight is properly distributed.


So, what your saying is that WHEN the tongue weight is PROPERLY over all axles the bars are higher than parallel?

What is the danger about going higher than parallel?


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## Gilligan (Aug 25, 2006)

Here is my $0.02 worth: I believe the "requirement" for the bars to be parallel to the frame is similar to the code of the pirates, and is more like a suggestion. By making the bars parallel, that tends to insure there is an adequate number of links in the chain to allow for plenty of slack when turning, as well as making sure the bars don't hang so low they could hit something. Not enough links means broken bars or other hardware in a tight turn, particularly when backing. So as others have said, adjust the angle of the hitch to get the desired amount of weight transfer, while trying to keep the bars somewhat parallel. And as Sean said, most bars never end up perfectly parallel anyway. As long as they are reasonably close you should be OK.

Gilligan


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## KTMRacer (Jun 28, 2010)

My opinion is that under ideal conditions you'll be able to end up with the bars parallel. And that is a good target.

That is if you can find that the exact tilt angle and force you need to counterbalance is matched. Your better off to end up with the correct weight transfer (normally getting front end back to unloaded height or slightly higher, never lower) and check the bars. if they are way off parallel you either need to add/remove head tilt or go with stiffer/softer bars. If the bars are hanging down, then remove head tilt or go with softer bars. if the bars are tilted up, stiffer bars or more tilt. if the bars are tilted way down you risk dragging them on the pavement going over bumps, up driveways which can cause damage. if the are tilted way up, you risk them hitting the frame, that is even worse.

if the bars are reasonably close to parallel, and tilt adjustment doesn't improve it, call it good.


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## m2edumacated (Feb 12, 2012)

KTMRacer said:


> My opinion is that under ideal conditions you'll be able to end up with the bars parallel. And that is a good target.
> 
> That is if you can find that the exact tilt angle and force you need to counterbalance is matched. Your better off to end up with the correct weight transfer (normally getting front end back to unloaded height or slightly higher, never lower) and check the bars. if they are way off parallel you either need to add/remove head tilt or go with stiffer/softer bars. If the bars are hanging down, then remove head tilt or go with softer bars. if the bars are tilted up, stiffer bars or more tilt. if the bars are tilted way down you risk dragging them on the pavement going over bumps, up driveways which can cause damage. if the are tilted way up, you risk them hitting the frame, that is even worse.
> 
> if the bars are reasonably close to parallel, and tilt adjustment doesn't improve it, call it good.


That's where i was at. After readjusting the hitch head that is the process i went through. After i was done, 4 links is about all i can get, maybe 5 if i really really needed too. it brought them about parallel and i was happy. And felt that it took my second season in and lots of reading over winter to figure it out then i remembered that cardinal rule about parallel and wondered. Ktm and gilligan i think you both nailed what i PROBABLY







was thinking.


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## egregg57 (Feb 13, 2006)

PS.....

There is no such thing as a stupid question on Outbackers.....ever....


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## m2edumacated (Feb 12, 2012)

Ok, time to bump this.

Just got back after a bunch of changes. This is where I'm at:

airbags at 30 psi (inflated before wd bars are put on)
head tilted with 7 washers
I belive my hitch is in holes 2 and 4 (could be 1 and 3 as i cannot see any holes above and 2 below)
I can get 4 or 5 links of chain from the free end. Either have 4 or 5 left to go to the bar.
Have Friction sway control on.

With this set up I am level. My truck's (2011 Sierra 5.3L) front end sits at 3 feet and 1/4 inch normally. With grabbing 4 links the bars are pretty much straight. My truck's front end was sitting a 1/4 inch higher at 3 feet and 1/2 inch. Rode pretty good, but i was hoping to put a little more psi into my bags. At 30 psi the trailer was sitting just a hair on the high side.

At 5 links, my front end sat a 1/4 inch lower at an even 3 feet. The ride seemed rougher. Had to grip the wheel a little tighter than at 4 links. This seemed odd to me since I thought even more transferred to the front would help more with that. Weirdest things was with the friction bar on it had a pull to the right side like my steering was off.When it was on at 4 links there was no problem.

I know I was having problems at 5 links and I think I should be happy with 1/4 higher than norm rather than 1/4 lower, but I thought about dropping my hitch head one more set of holes so i could bring the trailer down a hair and still add more psi. So? Am I going to far in tweaking? am I wasting my time moving the head down. Would getting 5 chains be different with a differetn level of hitch head? and what about that dam friction bar? Sorry for the long windedness. Thanks everyone!


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## egregg57 (Feb 13, 2006)

What is your Tow Vehicle drop in relation to the front and rear bumper? What I am asking is do you have roughly the same drop between the front and the rear bumpers..roughly?

The Blue Ox hitch I used, once set up, the bars were not parallel to the frame. They were a noticable, few degrees down, with the nose of my 31RQS a bit high. Can you snap a photo of your set up and post it? Pictures speak a thousand words..they say!

In anycase it sounds like you are close.

PS What is your RV?

Here is my old 31RQS with the Blue Ox hitch, the camper is fully loaded.


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## m2edumacated (Feb 12, 2012)

Will get a pic, promise! I have more drop on the rear as they are both equal when i have the bags on. Otherwise still more drop on the rear by an inch. I'm pulling a 0utback 300bh (2011). Your picture is pretty much where mine is. That's why i thought i could drop it one more. This would give me more air for the bags and allow me to drop the nose a little. Just a little worried after i tried to get that extra link and how it felt, along with what the friction bar started doing.


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## egregg57 (Feb 13, 2006)

m2edumacated said:


> Will get a pic, promise! I have more drop on the rear as they are both equal when i have the bags on. Otherwise still more drop on the rear by an inch. I'm pulling a 0utback 300bh (2011). Your picture is pretty much where mine is. That's why i thought i could drop it one more. This would give me more air for the bags and allow me to drop the nose a little. Just a little worried after i tried to get that extra link and how it felt, along with what the friction bar started doing.


 The Friction Type anti-sway bars are almost useless on the longer trailers...(actually they are useless) in my opinion. I had one but found out that really anything over 20-24 feet and thier ability to help is greatly diminished. I was using them with a Husky WDH because the Husky had no sway control built in to it. It was just a WDH. I burned through a couple of them quickly... Switching to the Blue ox, which had integral Sway Control, made all the difference in sway. Steering though, as you are mentioning, was another factor. The Huskey, no matter the setting I had on it always seemed to cause play in the front end. The Blue Ox eliminated it and made a big difference.

It sounds though, that you are very close to the "sweet spot" and need just a bit more tweeking! Very few set ups will find the tow vehicle and the camper perfectly level front to back. There is just too much variance in weight, load felt and the tongue, the distribution of weight in your tow vehicle and rv. A slightly nose high attitude on your rv, with your TV as level as possible is perfectly fine.

Eric


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## CamperAndy (Aug 26, 2004)

Just a note about air bags. They can dramatically affect the sway control function of the hitches that depend on the bar pressure to provide the sway control. Set the air bags for normal non towing conditions and then install and set your hitch head for the correct weight transfer. Do not adjust the air pressure once this is done.


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## m2edumacated (Feb 12, 2012)

CamperAndy said:


> Just a note about air bags. They can dramatically affect the sway control function of the hitches that depend on the bar pressure to provide the sway control. Set the air bags for normal non towing conditions and then install and set your hitch head for the correct weight transfer. Do not adjust the air pressure once this is done.


Kinda confused on that. I set the wd bars based on normal non inflated bags. The trailer still sits a little low on the back. The bags bring it up. Only keep about 10psi in them when nothing attached. From most reading 30 to 40psi seems the norm when towing. Little high when i set them there, but with less air kinda defeats the purpose of the bags doesn't it?


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## CamperAndy (Aug 26, 2004)

m2edumacated said:


> Just a note about air bags. They can dramatically affect the sway control function of the hitches that depend on the bar pressure to provide the sway control. Set the air bags for normal non towing conditions and then install and set your hitch head for the correct weight transfer. Do not adjust the air pressure once this is done.


Kinda confused on that. I set the wd bars based on normal non inflated bags. The trailer still sits a little low on the back. The bags bring it up. Only keep about 10psi in them when nothing attached. From most reading 30 to 40psi seems the norm when towing. Little high when i set them there, but with less air kinda defeats the purpose of the bags doesn't it?
[/quote]

Increasing the air pressure after the bars are set unloads them.


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## m2edumacated (Feb 12, 2012)

CamperAndy said:


> Just a note about air bags. They can dramatically affect the sway control function of the hitches that depend on the bar pressure to provide the sway control. Set the air bags for normal non towing conditions and then install and set your hitch head for the correct weight transfer. Do not adjust the air pressure once this is done.


Kinda confused on that. I set the wd bars based on normal non inflated bags. The trailer still sits a little low on the back. The bags bring it up. Only keep about 10psi in them when nothing attached. From most reading 30 to 40psi seems the norm when towing. Little high when i set them there, but with less air kinda defeats the purpose of the bags doesn't it?
[/quote]

Increasing the air pressure after the bars are set unloads them.
[/quote]

Oh, ok i get it







. I always hook the trailer to the hitch, put in my 30 psi then attach the sway bars. 4 links brings my front end down enough but it leaves my trailer a tad on the high side. I would like to keep at least 30 psi in my bags, so i think my only option is to drop the hitch one set of holes. The more im thinking i think i might leave it just a hair on the high side.


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## willingtonpaul (Apr 16, 2010)

CamperAndy said:


> Increasing the air pressure after the bars are set unloads them.


to an equilibrium point.....then as you continue higher you push too much weight back to the trailer....

my advice is to inflate the bags to a PSI level at which you want to tow (such that the TRUCK is near level with the trailer connected and the WD NOT engaged. ie: about 1-1.5" of squat in the rear end). then, adjust the hitch head and bars so that the trailer and truck are level at that given PSI level for the airbags.

then take it to the scales to confirm your weights at that point. at that point you might not be getting enough weight transfer (the airbags are masking the problem too well). so you will lower the hitch head and increase the tilt and check it again. use the same number of chain links in service each time (the ideal number is 5). the chain links are not the way to adjust the setup. the height and tilt of the head is....

said another way: remember the point of the airbags; to make up for the lack of capacity for your rear suspension. you are squatting too much, but you need to squat enough to engage the WD bars. bring the suspension up to a point that it should be, under load, and then set up the hitch. if you can't get it perfect with the height and the tilt, use only very minor PSI changes to bring it to final level, as then you are unloading the bars and defeating the purpose....


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## m2edumacated (Feb 12, 2012)

All of you truly amaze me! There is such a level of knowledge here! Looks like im bringing my hitch h head down one more hole. Figure at least 30 to 35 psi would bring my back end up enough with leaving a slight tip down for the trailer. Keep you guys informed and will post pick when i hook up again with adjustments.


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## Jewellfamily (Sep 25, 2010)

A few more brief comments. Be sure you measure at the frame rail front and rear for level. At least on my 312bh, there is something about it that "pulls my eye" and it looks level to me when in fact it is about 2" high in the front. I also use air bags with a 1/2 ton set up and an equal-i-zer brand hitch. I run about 30 psi, but that number is purely tow vehicle and trailer combination and hitch set up specific. I have my set up dialed in where the front of my trailer is about 1 1/2" below level and it handles pretty well. My front wheel measurement is within about 3/4" above of unloaded and my rear wheel measurement is about 1" below unloaded. My set up does not particularly like the trailer perfectly level or above level at all and it behaves like a different animal if it is.


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## KTMRacer (Jun 28, 2010)

m2edumacated said:


> Ok, time to bump this.
> 
> Just got back after a bunch of changes. This is where I'm at:
> 
> ...


Do NOT let the LOADED front end go LOWER than unloaded!!!!! the reason is that if you look unless your Chevy is an exception you have a set of very stiff rubber bump stops on the lower control arm that are virtually touching the frame at the normal unloaded ride height. to drop the front end lower than stock ride height means compressing that bump stop and it take (a) tremendous extra force for a little drop and (







REALLY stiffens up the ride, the bump stops are now part of the springs.

And personally I am not a fan of air bags. Newer trucks are designed to for the back to drop 1-3" under load when the front is back to stock ride height and your fine with that. Normally the ass end is a little high anyway. Ride will be fine that way. IMHO the only reason for air bags would be if your at or over the load limit at the back. In place of air bags look at the torklift spacers that fit the gap between the stock and overload spring so your always on the overloads. Keeps the back from dropping as much.


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## Red Beard (Feb 13, 2010)

Trailer LEVEL or nose down NEVER nose high....that could be a huge part of your issue/s. 
Drop the hitch head to get the trailer sitting correctly THEN adjust the bars.


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## m2edumacated (Feb 12, 2012)

So update! And I have pictures! I think I have found the sweet spot! This is where I'm at:

Hitch-7 washers
in holes 3 and 5 for height

Airbags in pic at 30 psi and nothing really in trailer. Will play around but thinking 35 ish with stuff in it...might leave it at 30.

WD bars- taken the 4th link from/including free end or 5th link from bar end.

front end of truck sits normal at 3 feet and 1/4 inch. With trailer at 3 feet and 3/8 to 1/2 inch) one more link puts me lower than stock...so not going there.

I think that is it. Take a look. Thanks everybody







hopefully this turns out to be handy for other noobs still learning. By the way, others on here have given me help and suggestions on bike racks. The last pic is what I ended up doing. Put the hitch reciever on the front omy the trailer and bolted down. Don't worry







All in, I'm still within payload and tongue with it loaded up







.







[






attachment=5570:IMG_1699.JPG]


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## CamperAndy (Aug 26, 2004)

Now that you got it level the next thing to do is throw away that hitch and get a Weight distribution with Sway control hitch (Equal-i-zer, Dual cam or even a Hensley). That trailer is going to need it. A plus is with the practice you have had you will do the install in record time.

You will also want to secure the extra pigtail cable, with it hanging that low it will get caught and destroyed.

BTW I am not being negative, I am being honest, you really do need a better hitch.


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## m2edumacated (Feb 12, 2012)

CamperAndy said:


> Now that you got it level the next thing to do is throw away that hitch and get a Weight distribution with Sway control hitch (Equal-i-zer, Dual cam or even a Hensley). That trailer is going to need it. A plus is with the practice you have had you will do the install in record time.
> 
> You will also want to secure the extra pigtail cable, with it hanging that low it will get caught and destroyed.
> 
> BTW I am not being negative, I am being honest, you really do need a better hitch.


Thanks Andy I know. I think i was taking all this time on this just to see if it was "Really" necessary. It is







. However, I have had very few white knuckle moments with what I have. Most trips so far have been pretty smooth.


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## egregg57 (Feb 13, 2006)

m2edumacated said:


> Now that you got it level the next thing to do is throw away that hitch and get a Weight distribution with Sway control hitch (Equal-i-zer, Dual cam or even a Hensley). That trailer is going to need it. A plus is with the practice you have had you will do the install in record time.
> 
> You will also want to secure the extra pigtail cable, with it hanging that low it will get caught and destroyed.
> 
> BTW I am not being negative, I am being honest, you really do need a better hitch.


Thanks Andy I know. I think i was taking all this time on this just to see if it was "Really" necessary. It is







. However, I have had very few white knuckle moments with what I have. Most trips so far have been pretty smooth.
[/quote]

Indeed, a picture speaks a thousand words. You got to be careful of junk, but Check Craigs list. I found a great deal on a Blue Ox that had been used to haul a camper from the dealer to a seasonal site. It was used once. I got it for $200.00. It looked like it just came out of the box.

After all the experience you have gotten working with this one you should be a WDH set-up pro!

Eric


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## m2edumacated (Feb 12, 2012)

Well, I thought I would resurrect this thread to give an update. Shortly after this last post I did indeed get an equalizer brand with 1200 pound bars. It has been a night and day difference. Anybody who has look at this thread and tried to get some setup based on what I went through with the help of all here, GET A BETTER HITCH







! I cannot believe what a difference it made. Literately night and day. I was able to pick it up on Craig's list when I went to the States for under 300 (A complete steal!) I have cleaned it up this spring and touched it up with some paint and a little grease. I have a couple pics below. In the pic you will notice the front end is a little low. i find it is pulling good this way. I might raise the hitch ball by one set of holes to see if that makes a difference, but overall can't truly explain how much better this thing is compared to the generic jobby.


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## MJV (Apr 19, 2012)

Yes--After several attempts at trying to use my old WDH (on our 210 RS)from my old trailer, and even trading trucks, to one similar to yours (without air bags) I went and bought a new WDH, with 800 lb. bars (appropriate for my trailer ) I followed the instruction and tried to make trailer and truck as level as possible. This worked pretty good, but as the 210RS has the water tank on the back --when full--I still felt something needed "tweeking". SO I lowered the ball by one hole adjustment (so the nose of the trailer is slightly lower) then added another washer to the drawbar to compensate for the tension on the spring bars, and now this seems to be the best. But I believe --as others have said--get a new, or more appropriate, WDH for the trailer you are pulling!


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## Leedek (Nov 28, 2010)

I read most of this thread and kept thinking.... " Go with an Equal-i-zer Hitch - The "American Original" with 4-Point Sway Control and weight distribution" .

I played with the chains and links and hole-swapping and just gave up. I bought my 2011 210RS in May of 2011. I had the Equal-i-zer 4-point added to the mix when I was at the dealership. IMHO it is the best product out there. No I have not tried all of them. No I probably won't try any different ones. It's kind of like my DW. I found her 45 years ago, I look at other models occasionally, but she is tried and true and I don't see me changing anytime soon.

Now lets get the trailer packed and go fishing!


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