# Flooring Is Split Again...



## jetjane (Feb 8, 2007)

Just a heads up for people who's warranty may run out this winter. We checked our flooring out since we have had the extreme temperature changes again this winter (-30's C the week before last, then above zero last week and now -30's again) and the flooring is split again. It has splits at every floor vent and we can also see that there must be a giant split under the carpet at the foot of our bed. This happened on our 2007 model (built in spring 2008) that we just traded last spring as well. Seems like either the material or the way they install it doesn't work for our climate. I hope Keystone plans on extending the flooring warranty because we plan on asking for that.


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## ember (Jan 17, 2008)

That is rotten luck!! Since our temps did the same, I'll be going to check on The Abi-one tomorrow!!


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## battalionchief3 (Jun 27, 2006)

Unbeliveable.....we pay so much and get so little. Cant someone make something that will just last. I have my grandmothers friggin blender and it still works!!!! Its older then dirt and it wont die. Good luck on the fix.


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## huntr70 (Jul 8, 2005)

There was a major topic about that ob RV.NEt not long ago because of the temperatures hitting so low again this year.

The main conclusion is that they do that because the flooring is only glued at the edges, not all over. There has been instances of this happening in peoples homes also.....Typically summer homes or cabins that are not heated all the time in winter.

Steve


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## Holmes On The Road (Jan 23, 2009)

Thank you for this information.

I will be checking our 2008 30RLS unit as well.


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## Ghosty (Jan 17, 2005)

battalionchief3 said:


> Its older then dirt and it wont die.


Man I hope your talking about the Blender .....


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## battalionchief3 (Jun 27, 2006)

yes the blender....


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## rdvholtwood (Sep 18, 2008)

Ghosty said:


> Its older then dirt and it wont die.


Man I hope your talking about the Blender .....








[/quote]

Now thats funny....


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## CRZ (Feb 3, 2009)

My floor split this year aswell. My dealer told me the floor is covered under the 1 year warranty but labour will cost $800.00-$900.00. I'm from Alberta so is there a good chance this will happen again after new the new Vinyl is in with edge trim? I have heard of people going with laminte but no outcomes if there are problems. Also I'm guessing the laminate would add some weight, should I worry about it? I find it funny that the Vinyl splitting has been around for 4 years now with no intentions to resolve the problem. Any info on what I should do would be great.


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## jetjane (Feb 8, 2007)

CRZ said:


> My floor split this year aswell. My dealer told me the floor is covered under the 1 year warranty but labour will cost $800.00-$900.00. I'm from Alberta so is there a good chance this will happen again after new the new Vinyl is in with edge trim? I have heard of people going with laminte but no outcomes if there are problems. Also I'm guessing the laminate would add some weight, should I worry about it? I find it funny that the Vinyl splitting has been around for 4 years now with no intentions to resolve the problem. Any info on what I should do would be great.


Are you saying your camper is still under the 1 year warranty and that therefore the cost of the flooring is covered but they won't cover the cost of the the labour???


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## huntr70 (Jul 8, 2005)

If they are going to replace the vinyl, I would request that they glue the whole thing down, and not just the edges.

That is why it splits in the first place.


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## CRZ (Feb 3, 2009)

jetjane said:


> My floor split this year aswell. My dealer told me the floor is covered under the 1 year warranty but labour will cost $800.00-$900.00. I'm from Alberta so is there a good chance this will happen again after new the new Vinyl is in with edge trim? I have heard of people going with laminte but no outcomes if there are problems. Also I'm guessing the laminate would add some weight, should I worry about it? I find it funny that the Vinyl splitting has been around for 4 years now with no intentions to resolve the problem. Any info on what I should do would be great.


Are you saying your camper is still under the 1 year warranty and that therefore the cost of the flooring is covered but they won't cover the cost of the the labour???
[/quote]

Yes, The dealer told me they can collect $400.00 for the vinyl only. Labour is not being covered anymore. The dealer will not cough up the money for the labour, even though they know they should. I have some laminate left over from home reno so I'm thinking of installing it and pocketing the $400.00. I do not want to worry about the floor again, shrinking, cracking whatever. The trailer is a 2008 with 10 days left of warranty I'm sitting on fence on what to do.

EDIT- It's not a Keystone's RV different manufactor. My next RV will be.


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## jetjane (Feb 8, 2007)

CRZ said:


> My floor split this year aswell. My dealer told me the floor is covered under the 1 year warranty but labour will cost $800.00-$900.00. I'm from Alberta so is there a good chance this will happen again after new the new Vinyl is in with edge trim? I have heard of people going with laminte but no outcomes if there are problems. Also I'm guessing the laminate would add some weight, should I worry about it? I find it funny that the Vinyl splitting has been around for 4 years now with no intentions to resolve the problem. Any info on what I should do would be great.


Are you saying your camper is still under the 1 year warranty and that therefore the cost of the flooring is covered but they won't cover the cost of the the labour???
[/quote]

Yes, The dealer told me they can collect $400.00 for the vinyl only. Labour is not being covered anymore. The dealer will not cough up the money for the labour, even though they know they should. I have some laminate left over from home reno so I'm thinking of installing it and pocketing the $400.00. I do not want to worry about the floor again, shrinking, cracking whatever. The trailer is a 2008 with 10 days left of warranty I'm sitting on fence on what to do.

EDIT- It's not a Keystone's RV different manufactor. My next RV will be.
[/quote]

Wow! That is crazy! Please do tell which manufacturer this is so we all can know from whom to never buy from and whom we should all tell our friends not to buy from!!! Have you tried phoning the manufacturer yourself about this (just to confirm your dealer's story)? That is so not right. If that doesn't work then maybe you should mention how you will be posting about this on many RV forums on the internet and that maybe you should try and get a class action law suit started. What does your warranty state exactly...does it mention the exclusion for labour costs on a warranty repair? I bet it doesn't.

I actually haven't talked to my dealer yet about mine so Keystone better not try and pull that bullsh*t. I have no intention of forking over 1 cent for my repair.

About the repair itself....my dealer mentioned last year that what they do is cut the flooring at the wall, glue the entire new piece down (not just the edge) and cover the edge with trim like you mentioned. I have heard of people using laminate in their trailer...in fact I believe there was someone on this forum who have it in theirs.

Good luck and please do let us know how it goes. BTW, welcome to the forum!


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## corbyrs (Feb 17, 2009)

I heard about this yesterday as well. As i'm also in Canada I will be heading out to check on mine ASAP.... I think that if mines split, It will be going back to the dealer ASAP. I wonder if that is the case and if they will replace it if they will in fact glue the entire thing, not just the edges...?


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## jetjane (Feb 8, 2007)

OK, I guess my DH popped by the dealership the other day and spoke to them about the floor. I guess they are getting someone in from Alberta to fix a bunch of them. My DH got the impression it might be nearly all of their campers on their lot that need new flooring. You'd think that it would be cheaper for the manufacturers to install it properly the 1st time or else find a different product that is more suitable to the climate.


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## CRZ (Feb 3, 2009)

Well I talked to the dealer several more different times, and no change. I ended up taking the $400.00 and going to put my extra laminate in. I also heard of someone puting in the sticky wooden patern vinyl planks for cheap. I might do that in the future. My trailer is made by dutchman. I seen a trailer at the RV show that had the vinyl redone. The edges had the 1/4 molding but the vinyl was not all glued down there was bubbles in the middle area. I'm the kind of guy that wants stuff done right so I do it myself. If it doesn't turn out the first time to my liking it will the second time.


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## jetjane (Feb 8, 2007)

That is too bad. It is surprising to see such poor customer service from a manufacturer in this economy. I think your situation would make for a very good case in a small claims court or even get a class-action lawsuit started.

As for the flooring....have you ever heard of Trafficmaster Allure from Home Depot? It is a floating vinyl plank flooring that sticks only to the other planks' edges. It is waterproof and easy to install apparently. Several people have used it in their campers on the RV.net forum if you want to do a search there. Some people have their own webpages with pics of it too. There are a few different choices in "wood" patterns available in-store for $1.99/sq ft. There are other special orders ones as well for a bit more. I just read a thread on there the other day (except now I can't seem to find it!) where the guy used that flooring and instead of covering the edges with trim, he used a colour coordinated flexible caulking. It looked very nice. I'm not sure how it would fair in our climate but it may be worth investigating. Good luck.


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## rgauvin (Apr 9, 2009)

CRZ said:


> Well I talked to the dealer several more different times, and no change. I ended up taking the $400.00 and going to put my extra laminate in. I also heard of someone puting in the sticky wooden patern vinyl planks for cheap. I might do that in the future. My trailer is made by dutchman. I seen a trailer at the RV show that had the vinyl redone. The edges had the 1/4 molding but the vinyl was not all glued down there was bubbles in the middle area. I'm the kind of guy that wants stuff done right so I do it myself. If it doesn't turn out the first time to my liking it will the second time.


I am the Guy that put on the stick on plank flooring.I also live in Alberta[Calgary].Beleive it or not it has been 2 winters and it looks great!I also believe in doing it right,but didnt want to speed the $1000 the dealer wanted to charge me!The only thing I noticed is that with the temp changes you can see some small spaces between some of the planks.If you do this you have to prime the subfloor and have it clean.It took a full day but turned out great.{I know some dont beleive it}


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## Grandeken (Feb 16, 2004)

My floor split this winter also. Our camper is a 2004 that has gone through a few winters now no problems also the front of my 5th wheel bottom panel cracked in 7 places when we moved it this spring. The 5th wheel has been only used 6 times in its life so far. We started a company and found that there is less time to camp. Going to start camping again as the company is up and running now but the camper is cracking apart. It looks like the Outback is just a junk wagon on wheels. 
Grandeken


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## jetjane (Feb 8, 2007)

Grandeken said:


> My floor split this winter also. Our camper is a 2004 that has gone through a few winters now no problems also the front of my 5th wheel bottom panel cracked in 7 places when we moved it this spring. The 5th wheel has been only used 6 times in its life so far. We started a company and found that there is less time to camp. Going to start camping again as the company is up and running now but the camper is cracking apart. It looks like the Outback is just a junk wagon on wheels.
> Grandeken


Ya we are starting to get the same impression though not just about our OB but about all campers in general these days. Our camper is still at the dealer but when we go to pick it up, I'll be sure to check out that front panel a little closer. They have fixed our floor now but I haven't seen it yet. My DH stopped by there to chat with them about it and was told that they to fix 300 floors after this winter. Obviously, there is something wrong with Keystone's (and other manufacturers) products they choose to use and the way they install them in the colder climates. Mine cracked at every vent opening. My brother has a Starstream and has no problem with split flooring but the vents are in the cupboards and not the in the floor.....coincidence? I think not!


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## CamperAndy (Aug 26, 2004)

jetjane said:


> Ya we are starting to get the same impression though not just about our OB but about all campers in general these days. Our camper is still at the dealer but when we go to pick it up, I'll be sure to check out that front panel a little closer. They have fixed our floor now but I haven't seen it yet. My DH stopped by there to chat with them about it and was told that they to fix 300 floors after this winter. Obviously, there is something wrong with Keystone's (and other manufacturers) products they choose to use and the way they install them in the colder climates. Mine cracked at every vent opening. My brother has a Starstream and has no problem with split flooring but the vents are in the cupboards and not the in the floor.....coincidence? I think not!


It will crack again if it gets cold enough unless your dealer cut the vent outlet with a wide radius corners and secured the flooring very securely around the vents. This relieves the stress when the flooring shrinks in the cold. Of those 300 trailers you DH heard about they were not all Keystone trailers so it is not a Keystone issue per say but an installation issue with the flooring. Other then cutting the openings different there are ways to prevent this but that means you would have to do some modifications to the way the flooring is installed. Would or could the dealer do these mods? Yes they can but they most likely think it is cheaper to replace flooring then to worry about installing it in such a way that limits the ability of it to crack.

As for your brothers Star Stream I would guess it is a smaller trailer, there is no way the vents could be routed in the cabinets on a larger trailer with slides.


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## jetjane (Feb 8, 2007)

CamperAndy said:


> It will crack again if it gets cold enough unless your dealer cut the vent outlet with a wide radius corners and secured the flooring very securely around the vents. This relieves the stress when the flooring shrinks in the cold. Of those 300 trailers you DH heard about they were not all Keystone trailers so it is not a Keystone issue per say but an installation issue with the flooring. Other then cutting the openings different there are ways to prevent this but that means you would have to do some modifications to the way the flooring is installed. Would or could the dealer do these mods? Yes they can but they most likely think it is cheaper to replace flooring then to worry about installing it in such a way that limits the ability of it to crack.
> 
> As for your brothers Star Stream I would guess it is a smaller trailer, there is no way the vents could be routed in the cabinets on a larger trailer with slides.


Our dealer hired someone to come and do all the affected floors since there were so many. I assume the new flooring will be glued down based on previous conversations with my dealer about the subject. We will have to wait and see I guess. We should be getting it back in a week or 2. Since our warranty is now over, we will be checking out those corner cuts closely. I agree they should be rounded and not cut to points (or beyond like some places on mine







) Could this be done with a Dremel type tool?

My brother's Starstream is one of the smaller models. I believe Heartland does it the same way on their North Trails. A member of this forum had mentioned that after buying one so I checked on their website and the photos show this to be true for the 5th wheels as well (which are larger and have slides). There must be others that do this. I wonder if they had the same split flooring problems. I agree it is likely much easier to go with floor vents and that is why they do it but I sure wouldn't miss them if they changed that. They collect dirt and always seem to be right in places that I step....like at the top and bottom of my stairs!

By the way, I never said that this was a Keystone issue only, though that is mainly what my dealer sells. They had problems with other manufacturers' flooring as well. So did a previous poster on this thread who owns a Dutchmen (so does my cousin and his split too) and I have read about this problem on other forums with other manufacturers as well. I just think that maybe something different needs to be done with RV's to be sold to places with cold climates because I have a hard time believing it is cheaper to fix under warranty than to correct the problem in the first place.


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## CamperAndy (Aug 26, 2004)

jetjane said:


> I agree they should be rounded and not cut to points (or beyond like some places on mine
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Use a template over the vent hole and use a router, dremel or rotozip tool to cut to match the template. The corners should have at large radius, about 1/2" (13mm). This would significantly reduce the number of split floors.


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## Carey (Mar 6, 2012)

CamperAndy said:


> I agree they should be rounded and not cut to points (or beyond like some places on mine
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Use a template over the vent hole and use a router, dremel or rotozip tool to cut to match the template. The corners should have at large radius, about 1/2" (13mm). This would significantly reduce the number of split floors.
[/quote]

Very true... Square corners will split easy... Round corners are much stronger... That goes for many things other than vinyl flooring too..

Carey


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## Nathan (Jan 2, 2007)

For anyone wanting registers in the cabinets, remember it's the register in the floor that frees up more cabinet space AND keeps the underbelly a bit warmer (I'll restrain from calling it heated...







). IMO, floor registers are a nice advantage to the bigger trailers, although a poorly installed floor could make them feel more like a liability.


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