# Miata Mayhem



## wolfwood

Yes, she did....although we are hoping that she will be brought back to life soon.

Left work early today to get to an unplanned Dr's appt ('nother story). 95* at 1:30PM / cruising down the Interstate, far left lane, top down, radio blasting..... When - BAM! - right speaker went out <that's odd>. Maybe 5 minutes passed and <BAM> left speaker went out - Radio's gone. What's going on? Electrical problems? Could be - guess I should at least move to the center lane.....start to move over....NO POWER! Get to center lane - give her gas - odd grabby feeling...hmmmmmm Think I'll move to the right lane....just in case (of what? I don't know but I'm not liking the feel of what's going on). Each time I shift I've slowed a bit....now at ~50, give it gas - NOTHING. THIS is not good, I think....as I watch the speedometer drop and feel all power go out of the car! So I shift it up & down just to see if there's something wierd there....nothing more than I keep dropping speed....can maintain it once it drops....but can't get it back. Speed has now dropped to 40 and shows every sign of continuing down so I pull way off onto the grassy shoulder of I95 and call KB. Maybe I can get a bit further...I'm only 15 minutes from the Dr's office.... I get about 1/4 mile, now the power drops dramatically and the accelerator seems to be disconnected to anything...NO effect. I'm now driving in the breakdown lane at ~25mph, speed is dropping, and the car starts shaking..... WHAT'S GOING ON????!!!!! Shake gets bad enough and speed is, essentially gone, so I decide I maybe shouldn't be driving it (maybe shouldn't even be in it!) and coast to a stop. Where am I? At the top of a rise, kissing the guardrail...no way to get out of the breakdown lane. I'm sitting on blacktop with 1000s of Friday summer cars & trucks ripping past me, its 95 degrees out, my car is dead, (and I'm not gonna make it to that appt). I call AAA - yes, maam, you're in a very dangerous situation, we'll expedite the dispatch (45 min later he STILL wasn't there). Called KB to come get me (that's a 45 min. drive of its own) and....KB and the tow get there at the same time. Of course, before they got there, my 4-ways quit, the A/C quit (95* and sitting on blacktop), and the bottle of water that was cold ...well, its not anymore...but it was wet). Someone had called in a person slumped over in a green car on the interstate...so FireRescue showed up - lights, sirens...the whole works). ....and as the tow truck with Phooey, and the TV with KB & I, are pulling away from the site...the only State Trooper I'd seen for an hour shows up.







Sure could have used his A/C 1/2 hr before that!!!

Sooooooo - the Miata is now at a Mazda dealer that we've never been to and it looks like it may be the alternator....but no one's really committing to that....with alot of luck, it will be the alt.belt and we'll get off without a huge bill....won't know until Mon or Tues at the soonest.

Sooooo - here it is, summer (finally) and I'm back to driving a mini-van







while my baby is in the shop(yard) with a currently unknown affliction. Think good thoughts for her, Outbackers. She needs you now.... AAAAARRRRRRGGGGGG


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## Oregon_Camper

That doesn't sound like a good way to spend your afternoon.

At least it is Friday night you DESERVE an ice cold brew for all you've been though. (heck..make it 6-8...you really earned it)


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## Katrina

That'll teach you to not buy a Corvette.


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## HootBob

Sorry to hear about your Miata
I hope it's just something simple

Don


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## shake1969

Sounds like the alternator or the battery.

Same issue with my Gator on our last trip. Alternator died. Car ran awhile on the battery until voltage dropped below 10 volts. Then, it died.

Couple hundred bucks and you'll be cruising topless in no time.


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## Camping Fan

Wolfie, say it isn't so!














What an awful feeling that had to be, I know I would have been reeaallly bummed.







Hopefully it will be something relatively easy (and not tooo expensive) to fix and you'll be cruising again in no time.







Lots of positive thoughts coming your way from a fellow Outbacker/Miata afficianado. sunny


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## PDX_Doug

Never fear Wolfie... The professor is here!

Your problem is electrical, and sounds like a text book Miata issue, at least the early Miatas. Bottom line, if it is what I am suspecting, is you toasted a spark plug wire. That's good news, because they are cheap!









What happens is this: The clearence between the top of the engine - where the spark plug wires are - and the hood is very tight. Consequently it tends to get very hot. Over time, the heat will cause the spark plug wire to get brittle and break. I'm sure the extreme heat conditions you were in played right into this.

Once one of the plug wires breaks, that plug stops sparking and the related cylinder stops firing. But, the fuel injection contiues to pump gas into the offending cylinder which passes through unburned, and causes an over-rich condition in the exhaust. Now here is where it gets fun! The over-rich condition is detected by the engine management computer, which in turn starts to try to lean out the mixture to compensate for this condition. Basically it is 'learning' what is going on. Now, as the computer continues to lean out the mixture, the engine starts to run worse and worse (it's getting less and less gas). Over a period of time, usually about 20 minutes or so, the engine will continue to reprogram itself to the point it is delivering no gas, and just plain stops! Sound familiar?

Fortunately, the fix is easy. Replace the spark plug wires, and over about an equal span of time, the engine will reprogram itself back to normal, and away you go! Good as new!









The only thing in all of this that has me puzzeled, is the stereo going. I have not seen that before. It could be that the bad spark plug wire actually melted through it's insulation, shorted out against the engine, and drew the power down that way. But that's a guess.

In any case, Judi, I would not get to worried about your baby at this point. If I am right - and I hope I am - the fix will be quick and cheap. More importantly, you will have done no lasting damage to the engine.

Happy Trails,
Doug


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## Katrina

PDX_Doug said:


> Never fear Wolfie... The professor is here!
> 
> Your problem is electrical, and sounds like a text book Miata issue, at least the early Miatas. Bottom line, if it is what I am suspecting, is you toasted a spark plug wire. That's good news, because they are cheap!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What happens is this: The clearence between the top of the engine - where the spark plug wires are - and the hood is very tight. Consequently it tends to get very hot. Over time, the heat will cause the spark plug wire to get brittle and break. I'm sure the extreme heat conditions you were in played right into this.
> 
> Once one of the plug wires breaks, that plug stops sparking and the related cylinder stops firing. But, the fuel injection contiues to pump gas into the offending cylinder which passes through unburned, and causes an over-rich condition in the exhaust. Now here is where it gets fun! The over-rich condition is detected by the engine management computer, which in turn starts to try to lean out the mixture to compensate for this condition. Basically it is 'learning' what is going on. Now, as the computer continues to lean out the mixture, the engine starts to run worse and worse (it's getting less and less gas). Over a period of time, usually about 20 minutes or so, the engine will continue to reprogram itself to the point it is delivering no gas, and just plain stops! Sound familiar?
> 
> Fortunately, the fix is easy. Replace the spark plug wires, and over about an equal span of time, the engine will reprogram itself back to normal, and away you go! Good as new!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The only thing in all of this that has me puzzeled, is the stereo going. I have not seen that before. It could be that the bad spark plug wire actually melted through it's insulation, shorted out against the engine, and drew the power down that way. But that's a guess.
> 
> In any case, Judi, I would not get to worried about your baby at this point. If I am right - and I hope I am - the fix will be quick and cheap. More importantly, you will have done no lasting damage to the engine.
> 
> Happy Trails,
> Doug


Or it could just be an alternator.......


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## PDX_Doug

It could very well be, Jim. But I went through the same thing three times with my Miata, and as I said, it's textbook. In any case, I hope it's just plug wires. Cheaper than a new alternator!









Happy Trails,
Doug


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## Camping Fan

PDX_Doug said:


> Never fear Wolfie... The professor is here!
> 
> Your problem is electrical, and sounds like a text book Miata issue, at least the early Miatas. Bottom line, if it is what I am suspecting, is you toasted a spark plug wire. That's good news, because they are cheap!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What happens is this: The clearence between the top of the engine - where the spark plug wires are - and the hood is very tight. Consequently it tends to get very hot. Over time, the heat will cause the spark plug wire to get brittle and break. I'm sure the extreme heat conditions you were in played right into this.
> 
> Happy Trails,
> Doug


Hmmmm, going out to the garage to look at spark plug wires now.


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## RVCarolina

Wolfie, Cheer up! I know your "adventure" was ill-timed and very unpleasant, not to mention scary, but no one was hurt, you still have another nice vehicle to drive, and the repairs shouldn't be too bad. 
I'm sure we can all recall times we had to pass-by a stranded motorist. your heart goes out to them, you want to help, but for whatever reason you have to keep going.. 
I just hope you have an honest dealer who doesn't "enhance" the repairs.
Anyway, you are safe and sound, and your Baby will be ready to ZOOM ZOOM in no time.
On the plus side, the problem may be something you can easily keep an eye on in the future.
Good luck, Fred


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## johnp

Sounds like the regulator in the alternator went south and was putting out a higher voltage and fried your speakers and then stopped putting out any voltage and you ran your battery down to the point the engine electronics shut down. But hopefully its just an alternator.

Just had to do the battery and alternator after the Avalanche stranded my wife at Dunkin Donuts. That will teach her to use my truck







I now call the Avalanche Christine









Good Luck

John


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## kjp1969

Miatae are notoriously hard on plug wires, but I don't see a sudden shutdown from that- usually you get driveability problems first. I agree its electrical though, and the alternator seems like a good culprit. Any warning lights first?

If your battery is more than 4 years old, I'd replace it as a matter of course. And if your plug wires have more than 20k miles on them, you should consider replacing those too. Oh yeah, clutch slave cylinder, just replace that no matter how old it is. Other than that, Miatas are very difficult to kill, I've spent the last 4 years racing mine trying to do just that, but it just keeps on keeping on.

(BTW, if you get a corvette, you have to get a few nugget rings and gold chains to go with it, and that's a little more of a commitment than many of us want ;-))


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## wolfwood

Many thanks to all who have sent cards, letters, technical advice/ideas & general good thoughts for the Mazda's safe return to good health. Just got the word via KB that the Dealer has confirmed that - indeed - the alternator is toast....sorry, don't know anything more than that VERY broad/general statement.

and....for those inquiring minds that need to know such things.....
Cost looks like:
Alternator + labor = ~$650 
90K check-up = ~$599 (it was time for this anyway.....)
Timing belt = ~$499 (time for this, too...)
Knowing you're car is going to run = priceless.

Should be back to us by end of the week (maybe as early as Wed)

Of course, I believe that the rain is forecasted to fall again, beginning Wed. afternoon and running 'till at least Friday. 'S Ok - as long as PHOOEY comes home....it can snow, for all I care









All in all, it could have been worse....


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## PDX_Doug

Wolfie,

Glad to hear they tracked the problem down







, but $650 for an alternator!
You're kidding, right?









The 90K check-up seems a little steep too, although the timing belt looks about right.

Happy Trails,
Doug


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## skippershe

Well, that's pretty good news, considering it could have been alot worse









Sounds like she'll be running like new in no time


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## wolfwood

PDX_Doug said:


> The 90K check-up seems a little steep too, although the timing belt looks about right.


This does include the labor and maybe is high, but gotta have it all done. All in all, we're being rather pleased that it wasn't worse (although, the higher the estimate, the closer I could have been to a new one


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## prevish gang

Well that's dealership labor prices for you. Crazy, but what cha gonna do? Glad Phooey will be back on the road and be reliable for you soon.
Darlene


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## jlbabb28

Seems very expensive for an alternator what year and what motor size?

I own a auto parts store I'll be happy to look one up for you and give a cost.

Jeff


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## NobleEagle

Please dont hate me for asking these questions









I am happy to hear your baby is gonna be okay. but for the record a corvette alternator is not anywhere near $349 and the labor would be something like 15 minutes, an hour if you take a nap. If someone that is more familiar with miatas can tell me, where is the alternator located that it takes 3 hrs to change? and can someone please tell me wouldnt they have to take the alternator off anyways to do the belt? just curious. sorry if I opened a can of worms.

P.S. Father-in-law has a 64 convertible vette and a 73 convertible vette and the 64's Chromed alternator was only $98.00.


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## johnp

For that cost I would have ripped out the drivetrain and built a "monster Miata" with a 5.0 and T-5 from a Mustang











John


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## Katrina

$650.00 FOR AN ALTERNATOR!!!!!!!!
Judi, I wanna be your mechanic from now on.......please.

already looked this up for you and it was around $189.00 if memory serves. and as was stated above, has to be removed to thange the timing belt anyways. I would complain about that.
either that or just swap out the bad one for a new one while they have it out of the car and nobodies looking.


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## HootBob

Judi glad to hear its just the Alt.
WOW!!!!! that's a chunk of change
But HA it beats having to go get a new car
Very HAppy for you Judi

Don


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## camping479

WOW!!!!!!!!! I thought I spent a lot every time the yukon went in for service









Glad you'll be back up and running though.

Mike


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## kjp1969

Yah, dealers will be expensive. But this is the first and last repair/service that car will ever see. You can drive it around at 7k rpm all day long for another 5 years!

Monster Miata kits are sold by a guy named Martin in San Marcos. Budget around $10k if you're using a rebuilt engine and a new transmission, and doing the labor yourself.

Here's a tip for Miata people: If you compete in at least 2 competition events per year (autocrosses count), and send the results to www.mazdamotorsports.com, they will give you dealer cost on all the repair parts you need. Once on a Wednesday before an event I discovered a hole in my radiator. On Thursday I called them, and on Friday afternoon the new OEM radiator arrived. Less than $200, and shipping was free. Yes, Mazda are good people.

The alternator on a Miata is buried under the intake manifold on the passenger side. You've got to take apart a bunch of ducting to get to it, but its not too tough unless you have Popeye forearms. Dealers always charge a premium for their work, and the peace of mind is worth something too.

Kevin P.


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## johnp

kjp1969 said:


> Monster Miata kits are sold by a guy named Martin in San Marcos. Budget around $10k if you're using a rebuilt engine and a new transmission, and doing the labor yourself.
> 
> Kevin P.


I was planning on building a V8 Fiero until they changed the emissions laws here (can't just buy an inspection sticker)







Then I had a 5.0 and t-5 for a mustang project. I was really considering the v8 miata but again inspections are impossible so sold the drivetrain








John


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## mountainlady56

Glad your "Phooey" will be back home, soon!! I know it seems like alot of money, but, hi, I just spent $437 on my 2003 Buick Century that has almost 90,000 miles on it. Cheap little car, but I've gotten my money's worth out of it, and it's dependable. I thought the labor charges on mine was outrageous, too, as they replaced a battery, some a/c hoses, and a couple of light bulbs!! I guess what they're losing in sales, they're trying to make up on the service dept., these days!








Darlene action


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## wolfwood

kjp1969 said:


> Yah, dealers will be expensive. But this is the first and last repair/service that car will ever see. You can drive it around at 7k rpm all day long for another 5 years!
> 
> Monster Miata kits are sold by a guy named Martin in San Marcos. Budget around $10k if you're using a rebuilt engine and a new transmission, and doing the labor yourself.
> 
> Here's a tip for Miata people: If you compete in at least 2 competition events per year (autocrosses count), and send the results to www.mazdamotorsports.com, they will give you dealer cost on all the repair parts you need. Once on a Wednesday before an event I discovered a hole in my radiator. On Thursday I called them, and on Friday afternoon the new OEM radiator arrived. Less than $200, and shipping was free. Yes, Mazda are good people.
> 
> The alternator on a Miata is buried under the intake manifold on the passenger side. You've got to take apart a bunch of ducting to get to it, but its not too tough unless you have Popeye forearms. Dealers always charge a premium for their work, and the peace of mind is worth something too.
> 
> Kevin P.


Thanks for the support, Kevin (and everyone else, too...even you, NobleEagle







). Its really good to have a few serious Miata folks here to bounce this stuff off of. Yeah - I'm sure we could find the alt. cheaper....but then it also needs to be installed. We do have a very good mechanic who takes good care of us on other matters but this is pretty fundamental to the car and *I* want a Mazda  alt. and the work done by someone who really knows the Miata. KB used to do this kind of stuff in (many) years gone by but not anymore. As for me...I know what the alt is and what it does----that's where it stops. Dealers ALWAYS cost more but they also have the expertise for the car. As Kevin says, the peace of mind that comes from the Dealer taking care of it is worth a fair amount to me. We drive our cars hard & long (I drive 3 hrs/day on the interstate just to get to & from the office) - I can't afford down time. The car doesn't owe me a thing - 2000 model, 91k miles (w/4mths off each yr), VERY fun and, to this point - NO issues - 100% reliable - with LOTS of miles yet to come. Just can't complain about that. We don't have to like the cost but figure it just hurts more 'cuz its all at once (and, yes, it could be less)....but, we haven't put more than annual service costs and "well baby care" into it over 7 years - it all balances in the end.


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## PDX_Doug

Wolfie, as long as you are confident and happy with your mechanic, that is what matters most.
Well, next to actually getting back out on the road again!

Zoom Zoom!

Happy Motoring,
Doug


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## egregg57

Uh....ummm.. I think I saw you on the side of the road. 95N? going towards Portsmouth perhaps?


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## wolfwood

egregg57 said:


> Uh....ummm.. I think I saw you on the side of the road. 95N? going towards Portsmouth perhaps?


Yep - in Greenland....1/2 mile S of Exit 3. Was that you waiving ?


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## PDX_Doug

egregg57 said:


> Uh....ummm.. I think I saw you on the side of the road. 95N? going towards Portsmouth perhaps?


And you didn't stop?









Unfortunately, I probably would not have either. shy 
Well, being a fellow Miata Maniac, I might have!









Happy Trails,
Doug


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## wolfwood

PDX_Doug said:


> Uh....ummm.. I think I saw you on the side of the road. 95N? going towards Portsmouth perhaps?


And you didn't stop?









Unfortunately, I probably would not have either. shy 
Well, being a fellow Miata Maniac, I might have!









Happy Trails,
Doug
[/quote]
Not to worry - there were several 1000 others who also didn't. ...and, btw, if there were any Stateys who passed me in that hour - well - they didn't stop either!


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## kjp1969

johnp2000 said:


> Monster Miata kits are sold by a guy named Martin in San Marcos. Budget around $10k if you're using a rebuilt engine and a new transmission, and doing the labor yourself.
> 
> Kevin P.


I was planning on building a V8 Fiero until they changed the emissions laws here (can't just buy an inspection sticker)







Then I had a 5.0 and t-5 for a mustang project. I was really considering the v8 miata but again inspections are impossible so sold the drivetrain








John
[/quote]

I keep eyeing turbo/supercharger kits- only about $3-4k, and most have a CARB EO sticker- smog legal. They put out almost the power of a v-8, (200 or so at the wheels) but nowhere near the torque. Of course, the car only weighs 2180lbs, so it doesn't really need a lot of torque.


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## Thor

Wolfie

Sorry to hear about your car. I am glad you got things working again

However can I interest you in one of these?










Thor


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## wolfwood

Thor said:


> Wolfie
> 
> Sorry to hear about your car. I am glad you got things working again
> 
> However can I interest you in one of these?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thor


Thanks, Thor. It is the alternator that fried....and they were 'sposed to have another from Mazda this week...but it didn't show up. Soooo - 'PHOOEY' spends the weekend with the newer models and (hopefully) gets released next week.

As for the "Sky"... cute but...no thanks. Have been reading too many reports that compare it (not so favorably) to the Miata. Think I'll stick with what I know (yea, yea - it'll be running again someday). Besides, I may just hold out for the reported new MG coming out of China









Glad to have you back!


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## egregg57

PDX_Doug said:


> Uh....ummm.. I think I saw you on the side of the road. 95N? going towards Portsmouth perhaps?


And you didn't stop?









Unfortunately, I probably would not have either. shy 
Well, being a fellow Miata Maniac, I might have!









Happy Trails,
Doug
[/quote]

I think I would have but I saw that it was a woman and well....... (sorry! I couldn't resist!)


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## wolfwood

egregg57 said:


> Uh....ummm.. I think I saw you on the side of the road. 95N? going towards Portsmouth perhaps?


And you didn't stop?









Unfortunately, I probably would not have either. shy 
Well, being a fellow Miata Maniac, I might have!









Happy Trails,
Doug
[/quote]

I think I would have but I saw that it was a woman and well....... (sorry! I couldn't resist!)
[/quote]














WHERE did you say you were staying for the Highland Games ?????


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## egregg57

wolfwood said:


> Uh....ummm.. I think I saw you on the side of the road. 95N? going towards Portsmouth perhaps?


And you didn't stop?









Unfortunately, I probably would not have either. shy 
Well, being a fellow Miata Maniac, I might have!









Happy Trails,
Doug
[/quote]

I think I would have but I saw that it was a woman and well....... (sorry! I couldn't resist!)
[/quote]














WHERE did you say you were staying for the Highland Games ?????















[/quote]

LOL!!!


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## wolfwood

egregg57 said:


> Uh....ummm.. I think I saw you on the side of the road. 95N? going towards Portsmouth perhaps?


And you didn't stop?









Unfortunately, I probably would not have either. shy 
Well, being a fellow Miata Maniac, I might have!









Happy Trails,
Doug
[/quote]

I think I would have but I saw that it was a woman and well....... (sorry! I couldn't resist!)
[/quote]














WHERE did you say you were staying for the Highland Games ?????















[/quote]

LOL!!!








[/quote]
Keep laughing.....


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## PDX_Doug

wolfwood said:


> Uh....ummm.. I think I saw you on the side of the road. 95N? going towards Portsmouth perhaps?


And you didn't stop?









Unfortunately, I probably would not have either. shy 
Well, being a fellow Miata Maniac, I might have!









Happy Trails,
Doug
[/quote]

I think I would have but I saw that it was a woman and well....... (sorry! I couldn't resist!)
[/quote]














WHERE did you say you were staying for the Highland Games ?????















[/quote]

LOL!!!








[/quote]
Keep laughing.....








[/quote]
Oh boy!
I hope someone is taking a camera!









Happy Trails,
Doug


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## egregg57

PDX_Doug said:


> Uh....ummm.. I think I saw you on the side of the road. 95N? going towards Portsmouth perhaps?


And you didn't stop?









Unfortunately, I probably would not have either. shy 
Well, being a fellow Miata Maniac, I might have!









Happy Trails,
Doug
[/quote]

I think I would have but I saw that it was a woman and well....... (sorry! I couldn't resist!)
[/quote]














WHERE did you say you were staying for the Highland Games ?????















[/quote]

LOL!!!








[/quote]
Keep laughing.....








[/quote]
Oh boy!
I hope someone is taking a camera!









Happy Trails,
Doug
[/quote]

There's going to be 8X10 Glossies!


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