# Newbies From Livermore, Ca



## coneill_rfc (May 16, 2010)

Well we are a family of 5 (two boys 8,6 and the baby girl now almost 2) out of sunny Livermore, CA.

After a little bit of looking around we picked up a 2002 25rs-s (great layout for our number) and were as happy in pigs in well you know what....

In anticipation of picking up the trailer later this week I thought I'd do some research (a little late I know) and much to my dismay I now realize after reading many posts that before even going on our maiden voyage that I am very likely pushing the limits of what is recommended both in terms of towing capacity and trailer length for our 2006 Sequoia 4X2:-( (Yes I do feel like a moron now:-( )

I think we could probably make it on the weight with the Sequoia by packing judiciously and not filling up on water etc given our trips will be mainly short weekend getaways staying 'on the grid' as it were. However, the length has me more concerned given the potential for sway I have read of with the wheelbase (118) to length ratio. Dealer will be fitting me up with an equalizer (I believe) and a brake controller (don't know the brand/model).

I believe the trailer was the right buy for us - the 25RS-S really does look to be an excellent floor-plan so it'll do us for many years of fun camping I don't doubt - anything smaller just wouldn't have given us the room we need - the double slide outs are excellent!

Thanks in advance for any and all advice folks - the good news I guess is that I am thinking of this now rather than wishing I had done so whilst slamming on the brakes...

So what do I buy next - an F250 diesel or a Hensley arrow? 

-Colin


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## hottubwilly (May 3, 2008)

Congrats on the new trailer and good luck with it! I towed a 2008 Skyline Malibu 2510 (a replica of the 25RS) with a 2001 V8 Ford Explorer. The TT was 5125lbs dry weight and my tow capacity was 6800lbs on the Expy. We were underpowered for sure but with the Equalizer and some careful driving we did fine for over a year. I'm not sure what your numbers are but I'll bet they're something similar. Just drive slow and leave lots of room between you and the guy in front. What amazes me is how these dealers don't go over this stuff with you when you buy - they just want to make a sale. You'd think they would let you know if you weren't going to be safe pulling off the lot...


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## coneill_rfc (May 16, 2010)

hottubwilly said:


> Congrats on the new trailer and good luck with it! I towed a 2008 Skyline Malibu 2510 (a replica of the 25RS) with a 2001 V8 Ford Explorer. The TT was 5125lbs dry weight and my tow capacity was 6800lbs on the Expy. We were underpowered for sure but with the Equalizer and some careful driving we did fine for over a year. I'm not sure what your numbers are but I'll bet they're something similar. Just drive slow and leave lots of room between you and the guy in front. What amazes me is how these dealers don't go over this stuff with you when you buy - they just want to make a sale. You'd think they would let you know if you weren't going to be safe pulling off the lot...


thanks for the info HTW - I think you are correct in that the numbers are pretty close although the tow capacity on the sequoia is rated a little lower at 6500 - I am thinking the wheelbase on the explorer is probably a little lower. Did you experience any real sway? Ever have any white knuckle rides? 

-Colin


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## Ridgway-Rangers (Apr 18, 2008)

Welcome to Outbackers. Good to see another CA outbacker in group. Congrats on the new TT. We looked at the 25RSS also but ended up with the 27RSDS. We go a great deal. Enjoy what you have and be safe.
I do see a new tow vehicle in your future.








Welcome again and have fun. 
Brian


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## mswalt (Sep 14, 2004)

Welcome to Outbackers and congrats on the new trailer.

I do believe a new tow vehicle is on your horizon, too. I pulled a 26RS with a 1/2 ton Suburban for less than a year before I upgraded TVs. You won't believe the difference when you put the correct one in front of your trailer.

Have fun.

Mark


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## rdvholtwood (Sep 18, 2008)

Welcome to the Outbackers - Happy Camping!!


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## Nathan (Jan 2, 2007)

The good news is that you are sking the right questions and that I don't think you'll have to have a 1 ton diesel.... unless of course you want one and then we'll fully support you as well!









BTW, don't feel stupid. I bet 1/2 the people on this board upgraded TV's AFTER buying their OB (myself included).









I'm very suprised the tow rating is that low.... must be one that was pretty realistic....









I'm betting you'll want a bigger TV after a few trips, but I would think a 1/2 ton based SUV with appropriate tow packages could handle it.


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## Up State NY Camper (Apr 7, 2010)

I have a Sequoia, but it has a tow package, 5.7 v8, and a 4.3 axle ratio. It's rated for 9600 lbs. It has plenty of power. I can accelerate up-hill with no problem. Just thought that if you really like the Sequoia and having 3 rows of seats, the larger Sequoia has the most towing capacity in it's class. Wheel base is another story. I'm new at towing a trailer that long, so I couldn't give you any advice on that. I will know more after our next trip Memorial weekend. Since your trailer is a little shorter, maybe the weelbase of a Sequoia won't be as much of an issue as it might be for me.


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## coneill_rfc (May 16, 2010)

Up State NY Camper said:


> I have a Sequoia, but it has a tow package, 5.7 v8, and a 4.3 axle ratio. It's rated for 9600 lbs. It has plenty of power. I can accelerate up-hill with no problem. Just thought that if you really like the Sequoia and having 3 rows of seats, the larger Sequoia has the most towing capacity in it's class. Wheel base is another story. I'm new at towing a trailer that long, so I couldn't give you any advice on that. I will know more after our next trip Memorial weekend. Since your trailer is a little shorter, maybe the weelbase of a Sequoia won't be as much of an issue as it might be for me.


My wife loves the Sequoia and I am quite fond of it myself so we will keep it for sure - she does very few miles per year (less than 8k) and was done with minivans - this will do us for the next 5-7 years as our family grows (only has 50k miles).

At this point I am leaning towards picking up a well used (ideally diesel) f250 or gmc 2500 as a TV. Regarding the wheelbase I had read a guy on one of the rv websites stating that the only way he believed you could be safe with a 118 wheelbase and a TT much over 24ft, is with a quality wd/anti sway device such as the hensley arrow (~2k







)


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## coneill_rfc (May 16, 2010)

Nathan said:


> The good news is that you are sking the right questions and that I don't think you'll have to have a 1 ton diesel.... unless of course you want one and then we'll fully support you as well!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


thanks for the support Nathan - I think you are right on the imminent TV upgrade - I am concerned about punishing the sequoia too much also as I see us having this as our family car for the next 5 years at least

-Colin


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## coneill_rfc (May 16, 2010)

Ridgway-Rangers said:


> Welcome to Outbackers. Good to see another CA outbacker in group. Congrats on the new TT. We looked at the 25RSS also but ended up with the 27RSDS. We go a great deal. Enjoy what you have and be safe.
> I do see a new tow vehicle in your future.
> 
> 
> ...


Thanks Brian - love Aptos btw.  The Monterey/santa cruz area is definetely one of our favourite day trip (soon to be weekend trip ) locations. How would you rate the state park camping down there whiuch is real close to the beach I believe. any others down there that oyu would recommend?

--Colin


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## garywies (Aug 23, 2007)

Welcome to Outbackers! I'm from Marin County, Ca. The folks here will steer you in the right direction, they did me! (and continue to do so)
Have fun & be safe!
Gary


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## Nathan (Jan 2, 2007)

coneill_rfc said:


> ...
> At this point I am leaning towards picking up a well used (ideally diesel) f250 or gmc 2500 as a TV. Regarding the wheelbase I had read a guy on one of the rv websites stating that the only way he believed you could be safe with a 118 wheelbase and a TT much over 24ft, is with a quality wd/anti sway device such as the hensley arrow (~2k
> 
> 
> ...


Now we're talking! You'll find a lot of members here that will recommend a 3/4 ton truck as a TV for a TT that size. Don't skimp and get a friction sway bar, but you should be able to handle it with an Equal-i-zer or Reese Dual Cam hitch as opposed to the hensley/propride route....


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## rdvholtwood (Sep 18, 2008)

Definitely would recommend a 3/4 ton with the 25RSS - We have the 250RS which is very similar and pulling it with an Dodge RAM 2500 with an equal-i-zer hitch. The combination does just fine.

BTW - we bought our TT first, then the TV - after we gathered info from the Outbackers site!


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## CdnOutback (Apr 16, 2010)

Congrats on the new Outback. I bought a new TV when we got the 5er. Figured the Mazda B4000 couldn't handle the 325FRE.







Went and bought the 2500HD with Duramax and love it.


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## Chabbie1 (Dec 3, 2006)

Congratulations and Welcome!

Great to see another Nor Cal memeber!


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## coneill_rfc (May 16, 2010)

Chabbie1 said:


> Congratulations and Welcome!
> 
> Great to see another Nor Cal member!


Thanks for the welcome! How does the sequoia tow with the 21rs? I am thinking the dry weight on that one is probably about 5-600 less than the 25 rss.... I go to pick up the trailer tonight so I guess I will soon know if the sequoia is going to struggle or not Any recommendations you have for good sites in our area are much appreciated!


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## ejr11 (Sep 9, 2009)

Congrats Colin! I live down the road from you in San Ramon. Wish I could chime in on your TV question. I will say that I pull my little 21RS with a 5.4L V8 2003 Expedition and I haven't have any trouble, even with the grades on 120 to Yosemite and 17 to Santa Cruz. I'm not sure I'd be comfortable pulling anything much larger over those two passes. Getting your brake controller dialed right for each trip is a key. Seems wherever I go includes a squirrely two lane mountain road.

If you love Santa Cruz and Aptos, like we do, then you'll love New Brighton SB. The choice spots overlook the ocean, but are HARD to get. Bring your quick mouse trigger finger, plenty of luck, and don't be late on the first of the month when trying to reserve one of those spots online. Ocean bluff sites are 73,75,76,78,79,82,87. 73 being the most private. There's a handful of electric sites which also need a quick trigger to reserve. A less wooded, less private, more Stoneridge Mall parking lot feel, is Seacliff SB. +'s for that place is electric hookups and literally the width of a sidewalk from your TT to the beach!

We like state parks more than RV parks, but one RV park we like (mainly for the location) is the KOA at Moss Landing (between Aptos and Monterey). We're trying out the Costanoa (just N. of Santa Cruz) KOA next month. If you find that you like the state parks too, a quiet generator is not an option, but a necessity. Electric hookups are hard to come by.

We also love Big Sur SP, which is surprisingly easy to get to from the Tri-Valley. Last weekend we went to Van Damme SP in Mendocino which we loved. Russian Gulch SP is another gem just north of Van Damme. Both are about 4 hours from Livermore, but worth the drive if staying three nights or so. The choices are almost endless from where you are. New Brighton will be a staple for you though.

One more suggestion is to take a session or two out to Del Valle in your backyard. They have sewer hook-ups so you can practice with the potty, and the campground isn't too bad.


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## coneill_rfc (May 16, 2010)

ejr11 said:


> Congrats Colin! I live down the road from you in San Ramon. Wish I could chime in on your TV question. I will say that I pull my little 21RS with a 5.4L V8 2003 Expedition and I haven't have any trouble, even with the grades on 120 to Yosemite and 17 to Santa Cruz. I'm not sure I'd be comfortable pulling anything much larger over those two passes. Getting your brake controller dialed right for each trip is a key. Seems wherever I go includes a squirrely two lane mountain road.
> 
> If you love Santa Cruz and Aptos, like we do, then you'll love New Brighton SB. The choice spots overlook the ocean, but are HARD to get. Bring your quick mouse trigger finger, plenty of luck, and don't be late on the first of the month when trying to reserve one of those spots online. Ocean bluff sites are 73,75,76,78,79,82,87. 73 being the most private. There's a handful of electric sites which also need a quick trigger to reserve. A less wooded, less private, more Stoneridge Mall parking lot feel, is Seacliff SB. +'s for that place is electric hookups and literally the width of a sidewalk from your TT to the beach!
> 
> ...


Thanks for the response and recommendations - my office is in San Ramon so i know where you are at. Good call with Del Valle - 20 minute ride for me, no freeway and I can even stop for some wine tasting en-route)

Thanks on the 120 and 17 too - those are the 2 I pretty much knew I was going to have to conquer take for most trips.


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## hottubwilly (May 3, 2008)

Nothing too bad as far as sway, just mainly a lack of acceleration. Found I had the pedal to the floor a lot. Getting passed by Semi trucks was always intersting...


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## Chabbie1 (Dec 3, 2006)

coneill_rfc said:


> Congratulations and Welcome!
> 
> Great to see another Nor Cal member!


Thanks for the welcome! How does the sequoia tow with the 21rs? I am thinking the dry weight on that one is probably about 5-600 less than the 25 rss.... I go to pick up the trailer tonight so I guess I will soon know if the sequoia is going to struggle or not Any recommendations you have for good sites in our area are much appreciated!
[/quote]

Our sequoia pulls the 21rs just fine. We've had no problem going to Yellowstone, Yosemite, or even up highway 17 to New Brighton or even up Highway 80 to Truckee. We just do the speed limit and enjoy the ride. DH has added a air intake and a new exhaust on the sequoia to help. I would not want to tow anything longer than our 21rs with our sequoia.
We do use the suction type mirrors on our existing rear view mirrors for better vision and have had luck with them. We usually tow with our tanks empty and fill up when we get to the park. We have on occasion towed with our fresh tank full and had no problem.

We also prefer state parks without hookups and like Bodega Bay, McKerricher State park, Donner, and Clear lake and we take our generator.

hope this helps,
chabbie1


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## coneill_rfc (May 16, 2010)

Chabbie1 said:


> Congratulations and Welcome!
> 
> Great to see another Nor Cal member!


Thanks for the welcome! How does the sequoia tow with the 21rs? I am thinking the dry weight on that one is probably about 5-600 less than the 25 rss.... I go to pick up the trailer tonight so I guess I will soon know if the sequoia is going to struggle or not Any recommendations you have for good sites in our area are much appreciated!
[/quote]

Our sequoia pulls the 21rs just fine. We've had no problem going to Yellowstone, Yosemite, or even up highway 17 to New Brighton or even up Highway 80 to Truckee. We just do the speed limit and enjoy the ride. DH has added a air intake and a new exhaust on the sequoia to help. I would not want to tow anything longer than our 21rs with our sequoia.
We do use the suction type mirrors on our existing rear view mirrors for better vision and have had luck with them. We usually tow with our tanks empty and fill up when we get to the park. We have on occasion towed with our fresh tank full and had no problem.

We also prefer state parks without hookups and like Bodega Bay, McKerricher State park, Donner, and Clear lake and we take our generator.

hope this helps,
chabbie1
[/quote]

thanks for sharing - now I need a new truck and a generator lol - I don't doubt this'll be fun but it sure is going to cost me


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## Chabbie1 (Dec 3, 2006)

coneill_rfc said:


> Congratulations and Welcome!
> 
> Great to see another Nor Cal member!


Thanks for the welcome! How does the sequoia tow with the 21rs? I am thinking the dry weight on that one is probably about 5-600 less than the 25 rss.... I go to pick up the trailer tonight so I guess I will soon know if the sequoia is going to struggle or not Any recommendations you have for good sites in our area are much appreciated!
[/quote]

Our sequoia pulls the 21rs just fine. We've had no problem going to Yellowstone, Yosemite, or even up highway 17 to New Brighton or even up Highway 80 to Truckee. We just do the speed limit and enjoy the ride. DH has added a air intake and a new exhaust on the sequoia to help. I would not want to tow anything longer than our 21rs with our sequoia.
We do use the suction type mirrors on our existing rear view mirrors for better vision and have had luck with them. We usually tow with our tanks empty and fill up when we get to the park. We have on occasion towed with our fresh tank full and had no problem.

We also prefer state parks without hookups and like Bodega Bay, McKerricher State park, Donner, and Clear lake and we take our generator.

hope this helps,
chabbie1
[/quote]

thanks for sharing - now I need a new truck and a generator lol - I don't doubt this'll be fun but it sure is going to cost me 
[/quote]

Of course your sequoia can tow a little more than ours since yours is not a 4X4.


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## MJRey (Jan 21, 2005)

coneill_rfc said:


> Well we are a family of 5 (two boys 8,6 and the baby girl now almost 2) out of sunny Livermore, CA.
> 
> After a little bit of looking around we picked up a 2002 25rs-s (great layout for our number) and were as happy in pigs in well you know what....
> 
> ...


If the power is adequate and the only concern is stability then one of the high end hitches, Hensley or ProPride, would be a good solution for much less than the cost of a new tow vehicle. Take it easy and try it out before making any big money decisions.


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## coneill_rfc (May 16, 2010)

MJRey said:


> Well we are a family of 5 (two boys 8,6 and the baby girl now almost 2) out of sunny Livermore, CA.
> 
> After a little bit of looking around we picked up a 2002 25rs-s (great layout for our number) and were as happy in pigs in well you know what....
> 
> ...


If the power is adequate and the only concern is stability then one of the high end hitches, Hensley or ProPride, would be a good solution for much less than the cost of a new tow vehicle. Take it easy and try it out before making any big money decisions.
[/quote]

thanks All for the welcome and advice - I will post anything more on this one to the relevant forum

to tie it up though I had my first experience last night and the sequoia held out perfectly - suspension hardly moved when we dropped the trailer onto the ball and then the WD bars negated the small dip there was.

Power - the sequoia handled the trailer (empty) with no problem whatsoever in the 60-65 range and then over the Altamont pass (a decent grade) without any complaints at all and never over 3000rpm -lets see how it does with some load in there

It was very windy here yesterday so I did experience some sway when i went much over 60mph on the 5 heading south from Stockton to the 205 interchange (pretty decent cross wind). This felt pretty significant to me having never towed but my buddy who has towed often reckoned the amount of movement was minimal and to be expected. Still I will be investing in an anti sway mechanism as a matter of priority.

Thanks again for the advice!


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