# Reese Dual Cam New Truck Question



## pep_ (Apr 27, 2012)

Hello folks

Last year we got back into camping as I have posted in other sections of the forum. We purchased an Outback 279RB. We were pulling it with a 2009 Ford 1/2 with towing package. I used a Reese dual cam anti sway system and it worked out well. We pulled no further than a 90 minute drive on good highways and in good conditions. One trip was windy and I could feel the system working. Now, the truck did ok and was at its max and I would not take the trailer through the mountains or force travel in nasty winds.

So this year, we broke open piggy in a worse way and bought a new 2012 F350 1 ton Lariat short box about 6 weeks ago. Love the truck so far. But here is my question. Should we still use the Reese device? We have the Round Bar WD system but I cannot remember if it was the 800 or 1200 lb bars. I strongly suspect they were the 1200 lb bars. If the recommendation is to continue using the dual cam system should I downgrade to 800 or 600 lbs due to the rear axle of the 1 ton being stronger than the 1/2 ton??

Or should I put a regular equalizer hitch/bars setup on it and if so what bar strength would be recommended?

Or do I not need any of the above anymore?

I really appreciate all thoughts and comments here.

Just for interest here is a picture of the unit last spring with the 1/2 ton and a grainy camera pic of the new truck earlier this year.


----------



## KTMRacer (Jun 28, 2010)

If the bars you had worked with the old TV no reason not to use them with the new TV. you still want to transfer the same amount of hitch weight, although with a 1 ton truck, your truck likely won't squat a much and should be an easy setup. the bar size (weight) you need is in my experience relatively constant regardless of TV and dominated by what your hitch weight is. If you liked the performance with the other truck you'll love the performance of the Reese system with the 1 ton.

I would say you likely will need to use a WD hitch. Check your reciever, but with the trailer you have I suspect your real actual hitch weight is over the weight carrying limit (hitch weigh limit with no WD hitch) even on a class V hitch and 1 ton truck. so go with what you have and see how it works out. No reason to spend more money until you try what you have.


----------



## H2oSprayer (Aug 5, 2006)

That is a great looking F-350 and should help make your towing a much less stressful event. I have been happy with my Equalizer brand hitch with the 1200 pound bars. I have always been of the mindset that just because I have a 1 ton with a heavy front end, I still should transfer some of the tongue weight to the front to help balance out the truck. If the "Round Bar WD system" that you are currently using does not have any type of sway control, I would suggest that you use the Dual Cam system that you still have.


----------



## pep_ (Apr 27, 2012)

I guess I wasn't clear. I have that problem at times The round bar WD system is the Reese Dual Cam system. They make a round bar or a trunnion bar system. Sorry. And thanks for the info


----------



## KTMRacer (Jun 28, 2010)

pep_ said:


> I guess I wasn't clear. I have that problem at times The round bar WD system is the Reese Dual Cam system. They make a round bar or a trunnion bar system. Sorry. And thanks for the info


I'd set up the roundbar DC on yournew truck and give it a try. My guess is that it will be just fine, and you won' need to spring any $$ for a new setup.


----------



## willingtonpaul (Apr 16, 2010)

well, you're gonna want to use lighter bars now that the rear end of the truck has been beefed up.

i use 600 or 800 lb bars for my setup depending on how i'm loaded. my tongue weight is over 1100 lbs, also (highly modded tongue)

you are correct in thinking that a more capable truck suspension needs a less capable (from a weight distribution perspective) weight transfer system.


----------



## CamperAndy (Aug 26, 2004)

The sway control function of the dual cam is dependant on the weight rating of the bars. The bigger the trailer the bigger the need for larger bars. The rating on the bars is roughly for the amount of tongue weight transferred and thus is closely related to the trailer weight. If you assume that just because you have a truck with a suspension that does not react much to the tongue weight and that you need less weight distribution then you are ignoring the need for sway control.

Heck if all you want is the truck to run level, get some air bags on a half ton truck and forget about the weight distribution hitch, is that not the same thing?

BTW That last statement was tongue in check.

There are sway control devices that do not depend on tongue weight such as friction bars (mostly worthless) or the Hensley system which uses tension in the hitch when towing and the geometry of the hitch linkage (effective but very expensive) to control sway. Hensley also has weight distribution function but it is not required for the sway control function to work. Since you have the Reese dual cam you need the bars that are rated for your trailer tongue weight, not based on the trucks load capability.


----------



## pep_ (Apr 27, 2012)

Interesting thought process, Andy. I have a question for you. The bars come at 800 lbs and 1200 lbs. The tongue weight of my Outback is rated at 890lbs. I am going to assume this is as max weight for the trailer?? which mine would be a bit short of by maybe 750 lbs or so. Empty weight is 6535 and Carrying capacity is 1665 lbs. I know I am not max'd out as I never have full tanks.

We bought the 1200 lb bars for the 1/2 ton because the truck was pushing its limits and needed more weight transfer than on a bigger truck. But we had a LOT more bar than tongue weight. So in that regard with the 1 ton would the 800 lb bars not make more sense since it is impossible to get bars that exactly the same amount as the tongue weight of course.



CamperAndy said:


> The sway control function of the dual cam is dependant on the weight rating of the bars. The bigger the trailer the bigger the need for larger bars. The rating on the bars is roughly for the amount of tongue weight transferred and thus is closely related to the trailer weight. If you assume that just because you have a truck with a suspension that does not react much to the tongue weight and that you need less weight distribution then you are ignoring the need for sway control.
> 
> Heck if all you want is the truck to run level, get some air bags on a half ton truck and forget about the weight distribution hitch, is that not the same thing?
> 
> ...


----------



## CamperAndy (Aug 26, 2004)

pep_ said:


> Interesting thought process, Andy. I have a question for you. The bars come at 800 lbs and 1200 lbs. The tongue weight of my Outback is rated at 890lbs. I am going to assume this is as max weight for the trailer?? which mine would be a bit short of by maybe 750 lbs or so. Empty weight is 6535 and Carrying capacity is 1665 lbs. I know I am not max'd out as I never have full tanks.
> 
> We bought the 1200 lb bars for the 1/2 ton because the truck was pushing its limits and needed more weight transfer than on a bigger truck. But we had a LOT more bar than tongue weight. So in that regard with the 1 ton would the 800 lb bars not make more sense since it is impossible to get bars that exactly the same amount as the tongue weight of course.


The thought process is based on the bars reaction to sway. When the 1200 pound bars are the best choice for a trailer it does not matter what the truck is.

BTW before I continue, anyone ever seen a hitch manufacture ever mention the truck when sizing bars?? I haven't but would love to see a reference to this if it exists.

You adjust the hitch head so the correct bars for the trailer apply the required load to transfer the weight of the tongue to the front wheels of the TV and to the trailer rear wheels. The dead weight is still on the tongue, all you are doing is leveling things out. As for the sway control function, once the bars are seated on the cams the bars response to the mass movement of the trailer is what you want. If you place smaller bars (when larger bars are a better choice) they will flex too easily off the cams when sway occurs and not provide enough centering force.

Anyway that is my two cents.


----------



## pep_ (Apr 27, 2012)

Makes sense to me actually Andy. I was trying to find on Reese's sight how you decide the tilt on the the hitch head but I couldn't find anything. The new truck has a higher hitch height over the 1/2 ton. I lowered the hitch head the last 2 holes on the shank but it is still a bit higher by 1 1/2" than the old truck and the tilt backwards looks to be a lot more in comparison.



CamperAndy said:


> Interesting thought process, Andy. I have a question for you. The bars come at 800 lbs and 1200 lbs. The tongue weight of my Outback is rated at 890lbs. I am going to assume this is as max weight for the trailer?? which mine would be a bit short of by maybe 750 lbs or so. Empty weight is 6535 and Carrying capacity is 1665 lbs. I know I am not max'd out as I never have full tanks.
> 
> We bought the 1200 lb bars for the 1/2 ton because the truck was pushing its limits and needed more weight transfer than on a bigger truck. But we had a LOT more bar than tongue weight. So in that regard with the 1 ton would the 800 lb bars not make more sense since it is impossible to get bars that exactly the same amount as the tongue weight of course.


The thought process is based on the bars reaction to sway. When the 1200 pound bars are the best choice for a trailer it does not matter what the truck is.

BTW before I continue, anyone ever seen a hitch manufacture ever mention the truck when sizing bars?? I haven't but would love to see a reference to this if it exists.

You adjust the hitch head so the correct bars for the trailer apply the required load to transfer the weight of the tongue to the front wheels of the TV and to the trailer rear wheels. The dead weight is still on the tongue, all you are doing is leveling things out. As for the sway control function, once the bars are seated on the cams the bars response to the mass movement of the trailer is what you want. If you place smaller bars (when larger bars are a better choice) they will flex too easily off the cams when sway occurs and not provide enough centering force.

Anyway that is my two cents.
[/quote]


----------



## CamperAndy (Aug 26, 2004)

You can purchase longer drop shanks but they do get expensive.


----------



## KTMRacer (Jun 28, 2010)

the 895 lb tongue weight shown in Outback brocures is with the trailer completely empty as it leaves the factory. That is with NO propane, NO batteries etc.

As an example, my 295RE has an "empty" tongue weight of around 800lbs IIRC. Actual tongue weight with 2 GC batteries, full propane and the trailer loaded but NO fresh water is 1200lbs With a full fresh water tank, tongue weight is 1450 lbs. Trailer is right near it's 8600GVW.

If your listed TW is 895, I'd guess your going to be near 1100-1200 with 2 batteries, full propane and the trailer loaded. 2 batteries and propane will add almost 180lbs by iteself since they are so close to the tongue. (120 for batteries, 60 for propane).

So I'd stay with your 1200 lb bars. If they are 800lb bars, well, give them a try as well. No reason to go out and spend $$$ until it is determined that you need to, especially if you are considering lower weight bars.

And as andy says, what bars you need is independent of TV. It's based on what your tongue weight is, nothing else. It's all based on simple static physics analysis. Your bars should be stamped with the weight rating on them.

Now the back may squat less and front rise less with a 1 ton truck vs. 1/2 ton, but the amount of weight you want to transfer to even out the load is essentially the same in either case, and the force needed to do so is again essentially the same in either case.

I run a Reese titan Class V reciever on my truck with an Air Safe Air hitch and Reese DC trunnion bar with 1700lbs bars.
Tows great, rides great, absolutely stable even in notorious Columbia gorge winds on I-84.

My experience is that when picking bars, get bars rated at least to the tongue weight, or higher, not lower. Adjustment is much easier. and in the case of the reese round bar, the design of the head tilt is such that it is often hard to even get full use of the bars since the tilt mechanism often doesn't allow enough down tilt to get enough tension. The trunnion bar has an entirely different tilt adjustment and doesn't suffer from this problem. BTW some other round bars also don't have the problem like the reese does.


----------



## Bob Landry (Apr 18, 2011)

pep_ said:


> Interesting thought process, Andy. I have a question for you. The bars come at 800 lbs and 1200 lbs. The tongue weight of my Outback is rated at 890lbs. I am going to assume this is as max weight for the trailer?? which mine would be a bit short of by maybe 750 lbs or so. Empty weight is 6535 and Carrying capacity is 1665 lbs. I know I am not max'd out as I never have full tanks.
> 
> We bought the 1200 lb bars for the 1/2 ton because the truck was pushing its limits and needed more weight transfer than on a bigger truck. But we had a LOT more bar than tongue weight. So in that regard with the 1 ton would the 800 lb bars not make more sense since it is impossible to get bars that exactly the same amount as the tongue weight of course.


The thought process is based on the bars reaction to sway. When the 1200 pound bars are the best choice for a trailer it does not matter what the truck is.

BTW before I continue, anyone ever seen a hitch manufacture ever mention the truck when sizing bars?? I haven't but would love to see a reference to this if it exists.

You adjust the hitch head so the correct bars for the trailer apply the required load to transfer the weight of the tongue to the front wheels of the TV and to the trailer rear wheels. The dead weight is still on the tongue, all you are doing is leveling things out. As for the sway control function, once the bars are seated on the cams the bars response to the mass movement of the trailer is what you want. If you place smaller bars (when larger bars are a better choice) they will flex too easily off the cams when sway occurs and not provide enough centering force.

Anyway that is my two cents.
[/quote]
[/quote]

First, you are going to have the trailer close to level by utilizing the holes in the hitch head. You can even flip the shank if you need to. Reese's instructions tell you this. There are no written instructions for specific settings of the ball tilt. Once you set the bars with the appropriate number of links under tension(Reese says 5 links minimum) that stays the same. Round bars are set pretty much parallel to the trailer tongue, trunnion bars angle down a bit. The main thing is after you set the bars, leave them alone. You aren't going to move them to adjust the WD and you are not going to "try different links" in an attempt to tweak the hitch. The ball tilt determines how much weigh gets returned to the front axle and that is determined by the toeing information in the truck owners manual. Return the proper amount of weigh to the front axle and leave it alone. As far as bar size, if the bars you were using worked on your previous rig, use them. Bars are not vehicle specific.. If your tongue weight is 900 lbs, use 1000 lb bars. Determine the tongue weight with the trailer loaded, not published weights. Those are almost always wrong. Yiu can get bars made in 600, 800, 1000, and 1200 lb increments. If you can't find what you need in Reese brand, Draw-Rite is the same hitch and you can use their bars.
Another thing, Don't tweak the WD trying to level the truck or the trailer. That's not the function of WD. The function is to return weight to eh front axle, nothing more.


----------



## pep_ (Apr 27, 2012)

Thanks for all the input everyone. I am going to use the same round bars dual cam setup after listening to everyone here. That makes perfect sense to me.

I had to buy a new longer shank for the hitch as I could only drop it 2 holes lower which gives me about 2 1/2" lower on the hitch and the new truck receiver is 4 1/2" higher than the old one. No problem, just more money to the local RV dealer for that









I will play with the hitch angle after the fact if required as on the 1/2 ton we had it at the max angle setting for the 5 links under load.


----------



## Bob Landry (Apr 18, 2011)

pep_ said:


> Thanks for all the input everyone. I am going to use the same round bars dual cam setup after listening to everyone here. That makes perfect sense to me.
> 
> I had to buy a new longer shank for the hitch as I could only drop it 2 holes lower which gives me about 2 1/2" lower on the hitch and the new truck receiver is 4 1/2" higher than the old one. No problem, just more money to the local RV dealer for that
> 
> ...


I'm still a little concerned with your last statement. You don't "play with" the hitch tilt. You adjust it to achieve a specific amount of weight transfer to the front axle and then you leave it alone unless you start loading the trailer differently. Too many people just tweak it until they think the truck "drives right" and in doing so are possibly creating dangerous towing conditions or they are introducing premature wear to their truck suspension and tires. Hitch adjustment isn't rocket science, but it does require a certain amount of attention to detail to do it correctly..

I would also get an accurate weight of the loaded trailer tongue and then select bars based on that. You want a rating that is just above the rating of your bars. You said you were maxed out on the hitch tip at 5 chain links. That makes me think that your bars may have been undersized and if by chance you need more adjustment to get the correct weight transfer, it's not going to be there.


----------



## KTMRacer (Jun 28, 2010)

Bob Landry said:


> Thanks for all the input everyone. I am going to use the same round bars dual cam setup after listening to everyone here. That makes perfect sense to me.
> 
> I had to buy a new longer shank for the hitch as I could only drop it 2 holes lower which gives me about 2 1/2" lower on the hitch and the new truck receiver is 4 1/2" higher than the old one. No problem, just more money to the local RV dealer for that
> 
> ...


I'm still a little concerned with your last statement. You don't "play with" the hitch tilt. You adjust it to achieve a specific amount of weight transfer to the front axle and then you leave it alone unless you start loading the trailer differently. Too many people just tweak it until they think the truck "drives right" and in doing so are possibly creating dangerous towing conditions or they are introducing premature wear to their truck suspension and tires. Hitch adjustment isn't rocket science, but it does require a certain amount of attention to detail to do it correctly..

I would also get an accurate weight of the loaded trailer tongue and then select bars based on that. You want a rating that is just above the rating of your bars. You said you were maxed out on the hitch tip at 5 chain links. That makes me think that your bars may have been undersized and if by chance you need more adjustment to get the correct weight transfer, it's not going to be there.
[/quote]

spot on. 
Also, the reese round bar setup has IMHO a "deficiency" in the head tilt range. For whatever reason, the cam "washer" that adjusts the tilt has a pretty limited range of tilt. Several adjustments basically will give almost no tilt, and only two give much down tilt, and often not near enough. This has been a very common complaing amongst Reese round bar dual cam users. Often you'll need much heavier bars that based on tongue weight to get enough bar tension.

Not as much an issue if you aren't using the dual cam, you can get by with fewer links without the dual cam. For my current trailer I went straight to a Reese trunnion bar setup knowing that round bar limitations and my current tongue weght, and it has a much wider range of head tilt. BTW, older reese heads for the round bar used individual washers and you could get plenty of tilt. It's the newer system that doesn't have much tilt range.


----------



## pep_ (Apr 27, 2012)

Let me clarify a bad choice of words. I should not have said "play" but adjust IF necessary. Right now on the 1 ton I have 6 links under load for the 1200 lb round bars on the dual cam. My hitch came with washers on both sides of the assembly where it bolts onto the shank. the washers are 6 sided (sounds like they are they are the newer ones) and we have them turned to incude the most tilt on the setup right now.


----------



## KTMRacer (Jun 28, 2010)

pep_ said:


> Let me clarify a bad choice of words. I should not have said "play" but adjust IF necessary. Right now on the 1 ton I have 6 links under load for the 1200 lb round bars on the dual cam. My hitch came with washers on both sides of the assembly where it bolts onto the shank. the washers are 6 sided (sounds like they are they are the newer ones) and we have them turned to incude the most tilt on the setup right now.


sounds like your at max tilt now. Yes, you have the new style round bar head. And 6 links under load with a typical outback frame, coupler setup usually gives adequate clearance for the cam arm so you won't hit the arm on off camber turns, especially if you have the newest version (2010). You could go to 5 links, but check clearance carefully on a tight turn to make sure you bar doesn't hit a cam arm. Clearance when straigh ahead is no indication that you will have adequate clearance during a turn. other than that not much you can do to increase tension since 1200lbs is the stiffest bars with a round bar.

Another option if you do have clearance issues and/or need more tilt is to get a ball with a 1" rise. Make sure it is rated for more than your towing weight. Usually a gooseneck 1" riser ball is rated for 25K lbs or so and is a pretty inexpensive way to get more clearance and more tilt. The reason it gives more tilt is that now the pivot point for tilt is 1" higher, so the bars will tilt down more.

With a top mount coupler on an A frame tongue I use a 1" riser ball as std setup, and I've found it really is worth doing, gives more clearance everywhere. If you have a bottom mount coupler then you usually don't want/need a riser ball.


----------



## pep_ (Apr 27, 2012)

Well, we hit the road for the canuck long weekend, max tilt and 6 links under load and it seemed to work very well. I didn't get any tail hopping from the truck on bumps and it felt solid at all times. We had a decent side wind on the trip out and I could "feel" the unit act as one so was very happy with it. 6 links definitely gives us enough clearance from what I could see as I put it in a tight turn, stopped and checked it out. Did a tight turn the other way and same process. Thanks for all the info and help gents.



KTMRacer said:


> Let me clarify a bad choice of words. I should not have said "play" but adjust IF necessary. Right now on the 1 ton I have 6 links under load for the 1200 lb round bars on the dual cam. My hitch came with washers on both sides of the assembly where it bolts onto the shank. the washers are 6 sided (sounds like they are they are the newer ones) and we have them turned to incude the most tilt on the setup right now.


sounds like your at max tilt now. Yes, you have the new style round bar head. And 6 links under load with a typical outback frame, coupler setup usually gives adequate clearance for the cam arm so you won't hit the arm on off camber turns, especially if you have the newest version (2010). You could go to 5 links, but check clearance carefully on a tight turn to make sure you bar doesn't hit a cam arm. Clearance when straigh ahead is no indication that you will have adequate clearance during a turn. other than that not much you can do to increase tension since 1200lbs is the stiffest bars with a round bar.

Another option if you do have clearance issues and/or need more tilt is to get a ball with a 1" rise. Make sure it is rated for more than your towing weight. Usually a gooseneck 1" riser ball is rated for 25K lbs or so and is a pretty inexpensive way to get more clearance and more tilt. The reason it gives more tilt is that now the pivot point for tilt is 1" higher, so the bars will tilt down more.

With a top mount coupler on an A frame tongue I use a 1" riser ball as std setup, and I've found it really is worth doing, gives more clearance everywhere. If you have a bottom mount coupler then you usually don't want/need a riser ball.
[/quote]


----------

