# What Really Matters In An Rv?



## PDX_Doug (Nov 16, 2004)

*What spaces matter most in an RV?*​
*Most important use of space...*

Bathroom space77.61%Cooking space11.09%Eating space11.09%Living/Entertaining space2527.17%Sleeping space5054.35%Storage space88.70%

*2nd most important use of space...*

Bathroom space2628.26%Cooking space1213.04%Eating space44.35%Living/Entertaining space1314.13%Sleeping space2122.83%Storage space1617.39%

*3rd most important use of space...*

Bathroom space1819.57%Cooking space2021.74%Eating space1111.96%Living/Entertaining space99.78%Sleeping space99.78%Storage space2527.17%

*4th most important use of space...*

Bathroom space1718.48%Cooking space2325.00%Eating space1617.39%Living/Entertaining space1213.04%Sleeping space77.61%Storage space1718.48%

*5th most important use of space...*

Bathroom space1718.48%Cooking space1718.48%Eating space2527.17%Living/Entertaining space1617.39%Sleeping space33.26%Storage space1415.22%

*Least important use of space...*

Bathroom space1010.87%Cooking space2122.83%Eating space2931.52%Living/Entertaining space1718.48%Sleeping space33.26%Storage space1213.04%


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## PDX_Doug (Nov 16, 2004)

This last weekend, I was pondering what direction the RV business, and more importantly RV buyers are going to go in this new economic world we have found ourselves thrust into. Between tight credit and high fuel costs, it seems clear to me that smaller, lighter and more efficient is going to be the look of the future in the RV universe. While there will always be a place for the bigger units, my guess is that the norm is going to trend smaller. And smaller does not have to mean cheaper (quality wise), but hopefully will bring advances in engineering and functionality.

Making the broad assumption then, that many of us will have smaller RV's in our futures, I thought it would be interesting to see what amenities are going to be most important to us, and what we will be willing to give up. If you were moving into an RV one half to two thirds the length of what you have now, what could you give up? And what are the must haves? Of course, everybody's needs are different. Families vs. empty-nesters, full-timing vs. weekend use, and maybe most importantly "RV'ing" vs. "camping" all have an impact on what our priorities will be.

So, take a few minutes, and see what really matters most to you in an RV. The answers you come up with might surprise you!

Happy Trails,
Doug


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## PDX_Doug (Nov 16, 2004)

So, I guess I will get the ball rolling on this thing...

The first question I ask myself is, am I a camper or an RV'er? What's the difference? When we were shopping for our pop-up, a salesman defined the two this way, and it's always made sense to me. Campers are those that see their rig as the end to their means. They tend to head for the woods or back country and prefer campfires to swimming pools. RV'ers on the other hand, see their rig as a means to an end. The RV is portable accommodations that provide a base for pursuing there other interests. RV'er's prefer 'parks' with many amenities (i.e.: pools, laundry facilities, lots of hookups) to dirt and long hikes. Both outlooks have their merits, and I can certainly appreciate both approaches. The common thread that binds us all together is the wanderlust to get out and experience the world!

By these definitions, our family falls squarely into the camper category. In the last 18 months we have had our first experiences with RV parks - and they were not bad - but our hearts and souls are most happy when communing with nature. Personally, the pastime has run the gamut starting with extensive backpacking, and evolving from there to tent camping, a pop-up after our son was born, and finally the Outback when we grew out of the pop-up with our second child. Through it all though, we have strived to maintain the camping spirit and atmosphere as best we can. And in that spirit, my priorities would be as follows...

*1st: Sleeping space.* This space - and the comfort it provides - is the main reason we bought our pop-up, and continues to lead the list. If it were not for this, we wouldn't need a trailer. The quad bunk room in our 28RS-DS is probably the most useful and appreciated area in our entire trailer.

*2nd: Bathroom space.* It may seem odd to have this one so high on the list, but when I compare each of these spaces as an outdoor and as an indoor activity, this is one place where I really appreciate the trailer. To that end, when looking at a new trailer I think I would gladly trade some square footage dedicated to other spaces for a bathroom that is bigger than a coat closet.

*3rd: Storage space.* Another surprise to me, until I though about it. Having the space to bring along the gear to enjoy the activities that make the camping experience fun is a big deal. We don't carry as much as many, but we still fill every nook and cranny we can find, and could always use more storage. The truck helps a lot in this regard, but in trailer storage is always in demand.

*4th: Eating space.* This was a bit of a toss up with cooking space. Both are necessities of life, but when camping especially, both are better enjoyed out of doors. What moved eating space above cooking space in my mind is the area we live and camp in. It rains a lot here! And between the two, I'd rather cook outside in the rain (under the canopy of course) and eat inside in the dry, than the other way around.

*5th: Cooking space.* Another necessity of life, but as I mentioned above, I prefer cooking outside when camping. At home too, come to think of it! The reality for us though, is that we do most of our camp cooking inside, but if I had to give up space, this is one place I could do so without too much regret. My DW may not agree!

*6th: Living/Entertaining space.* It's interesting to me that the most attention (and space) in today's RV's is given to this space. At least for ourselves and those we camp with it is really used the least. Unless the weather is really bad, we will almost always choose to be outside enjoying the fresh air to being cooped up inside. Although there are some beautiful and huge living spaces in many of today's RV's, and I too have lusted after them, when push comes to shove I would give up this space in a New York minute over any of the others.

Anyway, that kind of defines my ideal small(er) RV design. What defines yours?

Happy Trails,
Doug


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## egregg57 (Feb 13, 2006)

Good Poll Doug!

Our primary use of our Outback is enjoying weekends and vacations. But I can't help but think of the "Rolling Suite" as a life boat too. There have been a couple of situations where the 31RQS has come in handy, loss of power, loss of heating in our home coupled with loss of propane in which we use to cook.

Recently we had the ice storm up here which crippled a lot of homes. Unfortunately our 31RQS was slumbering at Wolfwoods for the winter. It may have come in handy having it in the yard. For the winter we need to store it because of the need to plow the driveway. I just can't leave it in the yard.

Anyway the camper coupled with our 7KW generator makes a comfortable place to stay. In the case of a hurricane, force of nature or other need requiring us to leave, having the Outback ensures a place to stay, regardless of where we are.

My choices fell in line with most others opinions, ie living area, sleeping area, storage area, cooking, and eating in that priority.

We have a bit more unit than necessary for our family. 99% of the time it is usually just my wife and my step-son and sometimes a Friend with our two dogs. But should thinks get bad, ie mother nature, there is room for 9 to sleep, not including the Add-A-Room.

During a previous bad storm I had put together, rather I had STARTED to put together a disaster preparedness kit. But I never finished it. After this last storm I can say I am almost done with it. 2 Rubbermaid totes with essentials to get us by for a day or two less perishables. The two containers are an easy Grab-n-Go thing that can be thrown into the bed of the truck or into the camper should we need it in an off-season time of year. During the Spring, Summer and fall months the Outback is always ready to go.

If it got that bad, we'd probably team up with Wolfwood and a few other area Outbackers and we'd be off to the hills as it were.

So to summarize, an RV must haves in order of priority for us is Living, sleeping, storage, cooking, and eating. Those priorities fall in line for the "What if" scenario too.

Eric


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## Nathan (Jan 2, 2007)

What a great topic! I could probably have my DW come on and cancel out my votes.









For us a lot comes down to storage. For me the big advantage of moving from the pop up was an increase in permanent storage. We like long vacations and the OB's storage allowed us to bring everything that we could possibly imagine and not be tripping over it. The next move up to the Silverback was done for living area (It has more storage than I could ever want). The kids are still young, so we like to keep them within eyesight and if we are inside, we were tripping over each other (especially when Noah liked to lie on the floor and play with toy trains or trucks...)

Now if we had to downsize, I would be willing to go as far as back to a pop-up, but would prefer a high wall that had a little more storage than the old one. Heck, there are some days I long for that anyway.... usually when I get stuck in a McDonald's parking lot....









Now DW has her own priorities







. She REALLY likes the convienence of a bathroom (especially the big one in the Silverback). She also wants storage, but in addition, doesn't like canvas, and likes the convienences of modern life like microwaves, etc.

So, as can be deciphered here, I'm a camper, and DW is an RV'er who is willing to "camp" if I haul the rv with us. Of course we both grew up doing our respective preference so it's probably only natural that we would gravitate in that direction.


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## gerrym (Oct 23, 2006)

I would have put living space lower than I did had we not camped for 3 weeks in PEI one year and it rained every day...................
Sleeping (thats why I bought it, otherwise I could sit in the truck all night)
Bathroom (more for the women folk, but the whower is nice)
Living (even though if its nice out we aren't in much at all)
Storage (fishing stuff, bikes, BBQ, dog crate *BEER* mmmm BEER, cooler (to put the BEER in),etc etc etc)
Eating- good for fall camping when its 40 degrees out
Cooking- we do that outside usually.


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## tdvffjohn (Mar 10, 2005)

I d have to agree with your assessment Doug

John


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## Lmbevard (Mar 18, 2006)

Check out this site! http://www.tab-rv.com/ This would cover most of the young couples for a weekend camper and even a small family with a pop-up tent.

We loved our fold-up camper as our family was growing up. We owned a small Colman with a full size and twin size pull outs and a 3/4 bed made out of the dinette. No refridge but did have a small ice box. We spent many days camping in this and hauled it with a Ford Fairmont Station Wagon.

What was important to us was the open floor plan so that everything because a livingroom until it became a bed.


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## Dub (Dec 8, 2008)

I do a lot of backpacking but the wife is a 5 star kinda gal so the RV is our compromise. When I am in the woods in a tent I am camping. When I am in the RV in an RV park I am RVing. Boondocking is a mix between the two. So we need a balance of the five above.

Living/entertainment is first because on those rainy days we want room. We also had to climb over each other in our PUP to get out of bed, there was another right below the king. And in our old TT you couldn't pass to the bathroom if someone was cooking or at the sink.

Sleeping space is second. We just want nice sized bunks, bedroom size is irrelevant. So long as I have a king/queen to sleep on, several bunks, and the ability to sleep the grandparents on a second queen bed/etc.

Storage is third. We need a lot of places for all of our toys.

Bathroom is fourth. In my old camper I could wash my feet in the tub, sit on the john, and wash my hands in the sink all at the same time. Way too small. I want to at least be able to change clothes in there.

Cooking space is fifth. We cook outside but on rainy days a lil room is nice.

Eating space is sixth...who wants to eat inside?


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## ember (Jan 17, 2008)

first is sleeping. I'm a VERY poor sleeper, and I WANT my space.
second - Bathroom - I want to be able to get dressed in the bathroom after my shower!
(SIDENOTE: These two choices were the only things I told Stacey I HAD to have when we started shopping for a TT. A full bath, not a toilet in a box, and bed that is a bed 100% of the time. I don't make my table into a bed at home, and I'm D**N sure not going to do it on vacation!!)
third-Living- Stacey is a bit of a television addict!! NUFF SAID!!
fourth eating- As someone else said 'I'd rather cook in the rain than eat in the rain'
fifth-cooking- We do most of our cooking on the campfire or the outside kitchen anyway. 
sixth- storage- I've got the whole bed of the truck, plus the extended cab. (Being empty-nesters has some benefits!!) Well not to mention, that the tools we store for our hobby (rockhounding) are the same shovels etc, that we use for work (landscaping) so they're already in the truck.








TTFN
Ember


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## N7OQ (Jun 10, 2006)

I'm definitely a camper and not an RVer I love the woods, campfires, fishing, campfires, hiking, relaxing around the campfire. I do like parks with showers if I'm staying a long time but no pools, and stuff like that.


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## Oregon_Camper (Sep 13, 2004)

Pretty sure we fall into the RV'er category....uh NOT.









*Sleeping *is clearly #1. When we had a river flow through our tent during a HUGE storm, my wife told me this was the last camping trip she would ever take in a tent again. Bought a Coleman pop-up about 3 weeks later.

*Storage* is #2 as I bring just about everything known to mankind when we go deep into the Oregon National Forrest and there are no amenities.

*Bathroom* comes in at #3 for the DW. It is nice to have a place for her to shower up and not have to head off for a fallen tree when nature calls. For the boys and me...no problem.

*Living / Eating / Cooking* are all done outside as much as the weather allows, so these don't have any impact on my RV purchase.


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## CamperAndy (Aug 26, 2004)

Got to add creature comforts to the poll. The Heat and Fridge are great reasons to have the RV. With the size of the fridge we have now we do not even need to bring an ice chest with us, except to take with us when we go rafting!!


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## AZthunderations (Aug 21, 2008)

Doug, great topic. We prefere dirt and trees to asphalt and astro turf. We too, started with a tent trailer, not a pop up, but a 72 Appleby that you erected the conduit frame on top of and then fastened the tent over for shelter. Only 4 x 6 floor space with a double bed on each side. It was tent camping, but off the ground.
Our first pop up, a 96 Viking was a big improvement. We had inside or outside cooking, a little fridge and a queen bed. Our second pop up was a Coleman and we had about the same features except a king bed and it was a lot easier to set up. After 11 days camping on top of Mingus Mountain with it raining 10 of them and the wind blowing all the time and the fabric slapping the supports we decided to upgrade again to a TT.
Our first choice was an Outback, either a 21RS or a 23KRS. Reason: storage. The outside storage door on the 21RS was perfect to store stuff and when needed (grandkids) there were bunks. 23KRS, same reasons except now there was more space and a real seperate bedroom if needed.
So, storage of camping stuff is priority. We spend most of our camping time outside and you need the chairs, tables, screen rooms, etc.
Second, a real bed, not a converted bench or couch.
Third, the bathroom is sure convieient, especially in bad weater. Doesn't have to be big, just have the objects of desire.
Fourth, dinning area. We too, do most cooking outside, but if the bugs are out or the weather turns cool, eating inside is prefered. We also like to play board games at night on the table.
Fifth, cooking. Most of the time cooking is done outside on a grill or cooktop, sometimes on a campfire. I do like to make coffee inside some mornings as it warms the trailer along with helping to wake the wife with the aroma.
Sixth, comfort. OK, it's nice to have A/C or heat at those times when needed. We keep threatning to use the microwave some day. It just seems to futuristic for camping.
As I explained in another post on another topic, we didn't get an Outback after looking for one for several months and fell into a deal on a 25' Forest River Rockwood with many features of a 21RS. It has the outside storage door with the fold up bunk so we can store our stuff and still sleep the grandkids in real beds. It has the fixed queen bed (not a slide out) and so has even more storage under it. This TT will do for awhile and then maybe a new Outback......still like that 23KRS style.
The fact that I still check this site several times a day is because of the great people that are always ready to help with a problem, or give great advice.
Whether you camp or RV, just enjoy the heck out of it and wave to all those that enjoy the same lifestyle you are enjoying.


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## BigBadBrain (Aug 26, 2004)

"If you were moving into an RV one half to two thirds the length of what you have now, what could you give up?"

I can't imagine a smaller RV than our 23rs (a 11.5rs???) so my responses are based upon what I think is adequate in our 23rs and what isn't. First, we do more RVing than camping in our Outback. It acts as a base of operations for excursions (be they vehicular or otherwise) and therefore most of what we want after a day's foray is comfort and 'home'. To that end, the 23rs has its limits. While it is big on sleeping space it is short on living space. Four adults in this trailer gets pretty cramped and even when we are trying to just sit and relax with a beer (for two of the adults that is) and recap the day's adventures as a family it can be crowded (especially with cameras, hats, coats, computers, etc. spread all over). When we can we sit outside but there are many times where that has proven infeasible (or simply too much work for travel weary folk) and we go for the inside living area just for the comfort (no bugs, cool, warm, dry).

Oddly, the premise of scaling down is not what I imagine we will do. I suspect a small motorhome (<30ft) is more likely to be the next thing for us. As our kids leave and we are down to two, the idea of the motorhome becomes more interesting. Our TV is going to be wearing out soon (in terms of ability to drag the 23rs around with confidence) so we will need to make a change of some sort. A new truck is certainly a possibility but for about the same $$ we can get a good, late model used motorhome and tow DW's Saturn behind it.

Who knows, if gas prices creep up to $4-5 again I may just buy a cabin close by (with dark skies).

BBB


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## rdvholtwood (Sep 18, 2008)

PDX_Doug said:


> *The first question I ask myself is, am I a camper or an RV'er?* What's the difference? When we were shopping for our pop-up, a salesman defined the two this way, and it's always made sense to me. Campers are those that see their rig as the end to their means. They tend to head for the woods or back country and prefer campfires to swimming pools. RV'ers on the other hand, see their rig as a means to an end. The RV is portable accommodations that provide a base for pursuing there other interests. RV'er's prefer 'parks' with many amenities (i.e.: pools, laundry facilities, lots of hookups) to dirt and long hikes. Both outlooks have their merits, and I can certainly appreciate both approaches. The common thread that binds us all together is the wanderlust to get out and experience the world!


As far as answering the question - I think we have been more of campers over time. We married late 70's and camped in a tent up until '91. At that time, we moved into our Coleman pop-up and have been using that for the past 17 years! I really enjoyed the Coleman as it gave you a little of both. As the Coleman grew older, we relied less and less on using the hookups - except for the electric. Since we did not have a bathroom, we found over time (and not that age had anything to do with it







) that it was becoming too much between the setup and not having a bathroom.

Finally, we moved up to a TT, and when we were looking - the #1 item on our list was layout - with regards to the sleeping area. My wife and I are on the tall side and a queen bed was just not going to work. So we found the Outback with its KING slide!! - and - the next thing that we liked the most was the bathroom. At this point, the bathroom in our outback is big - considering we never had one before to compare it to! However, as we start to use and get comfortable with our trailer, I am sure that it will seem small!

For us, the other areas of the trailer (eating, living area, etc) are amenities that we really like and really can't rate on what we would like more of or not. So to sum up, I think after many years of "campers" I think for the most part, since we like the PA start parks the best, we will always be campers at heart. However, camping as an RVer might be in the horizon and be a very welcomed change.

Since this is our first TT, and being empty nesters, who knows what will favor, we'll just have to wait and see!!


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## 3LEES (Feb 18, 2006)

Oregon_Camper said:


> Pretty sure we fall into the RV'er category....uh NOT.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


It's not often that I use this reply....

X2

I agree with your assessment Jim

Dan


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## Lady Di (Oct 28, 2005)

Guess I fall in line with most of the others. Sleeping is a big # 1.

Bathroom is definitely #2.

After that it got more difficult to decide.

We have sometimes thought of upgrading to a little bigger (DH would like more storage space) but our 25RSS really fits our needs. We used it last summer during a power outage.

One never knows when it might become necessary to use the OB or SOB as backup housing.


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## Dub (Dec 8, 2008)

I moved from a smaller TT by a 1/3 to the 310BHS. In it we gave up bathroom space...too much in my opinion, living space-practically none, and sleeping space--the bunks were much smaller, and it was loaded to the max so less storage as well. But at the time it was all we had and we made due and were happy with it. The most popular model was the 16 and 18 footer as they could be towed by regular minivans and often were. The 16 made efficient use of space and was mainly for sleeping in and that's it. If I had to make due...probably could...but I love my space!


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