# 30 Amp Home Circuit For The Outback



## rdvholtwood (Sep 18, 2008)

I am in the process of installing an additional electrical circuit in our garage for the purpose of connecting the Outback at the house. A day or two prior to our trips, we usually plug the TT in to get the fridge up and running. I am famaliar with running additional cirucuits in the house; however, I want to make run this by you all to make sure that I am doing it right. There is no problem with connecting it to our 120V 20A outlet, but, if I want to do any work or mods in the Outback on a really hot day, it would be nice to be able to turn on the AC.









I know I will need a 30 AMP breaker single-pole. I have a Crouse-Hinds breaker panel and from what I can tell I can use Siemens breakers. With the breaker I am planning on running about 15' of 10 AWG from the breaker box to the outlet. Doing a quick google search, it recommends that I use a NEMA TT-30R (2P, 3W) for the receptacle.

For those of you that have done this, I am looking for any additional suggestions you may have.


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## Justman (Jul 22, 2006)

Sounds like you've got it handled pretty well. Biggest mistake I've made in the past is running it too short...of course.









If you plan on running it outside, you'll want to run it in an outside approved enclosure and run it in PVC conduit.


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## outback loft (Sep 22, 2008)

rdvholtwood said:


> I am in the process of installing an additional electrical circuit in our garage for the purpose of connecting the Outback at the house. A day or two prior to our trips, we usually plug the TT in to get the fridge up and running. I am famaliar with running additional cirucuits in the house; however, I want to make run this by you all to make sure that I am doing it right. There is no problem with connecting it to our 120V 20A outlet, but, if I want to do any work or mods in the Outback on a really hot day, it would be nice to be able to turn on the AC.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I am not sure of the breaker that particular panel uses, sometimes the best bet is to take one of the existing breakers with you to get the one you need. The 10 awg wire is correct for what you are putting in, and a 30 amp 110 volt breaker(single pole) breaker. It will be 10-2 which is a 2 wire with ground(3 wires total) I am not sure of the exact spec for the receptacle, as my electrical supply house knows what you mean when you tell them you need a 30 amp rv receptacle. You cannot do that at a Home Depot or Lowes, and probably will not find the receptacle there either.


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## CamperAndy (Aug 26, 2004)

Will the plug be inside the garage or other dry area or outside. This will dictate the weather enclosure requirements, other then that it sounds like you have it covered.


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## bowhunter2819 (Apr 27, 2011)

Spend the extra few dollars and use 8 wire. That way you wont have to worry about it.


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## Kevin K (Jan 31, 2011)

I bought my RV outlet at Home Depot. They also had the outdoor box with the plug already in it. Look on the bottom shelves, I had to look around to find the right one. It is nice to be able to run the A/C at home.


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## vdub (Jun 19, 2004)

Dedicated 30 amp is nice, but certainly not crucial. I often run my whole system including air conditioner on a single 20 amp with no problems. Just be careful to not throw all the big stuff like micro, fridge, or hot water heater and a/c all on at once.


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## jozway (Jan 28, 2008)

There is no need to run anything bigger than a 10awg wire if your close to the panel. Siemens breakers will work just fine. Just make sure it is a single pole breaker. I had a friend that hooked his plug up to 240 volt. After one attempt to plug it in he ordered a new invertor







. I went over and fixed it for him and explained to him why it is only 120 volt he was not happy.


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## rdvholtwood (Sep 18, 2008)

CamperAndy said:


> Will the plug be inside the garage or other dry area or outside. This will dictate the weather enclosure requirements, other then that it sounds like you have it covered.


This will be inside - much easier and probably cheaper.


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## rdvholtwood (Sep 18, 2008)

vdub said:


> Dedicated 30 amp is nice, but certainly not crucial. I often run my whole system including air conditioner on a single 20 amp with no problems. Just be careful to not throw all the big stuff like micro, fridge, or hot water heater and a/c all on at once.


I need to use an extension cord to get to the outlet and I know its not rated for 30 AMPS.....don't have an 20A outlet close enough to reach....


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## rdvholtwood (Sep 18, 2008)

jozway said:


> There is no need to run anything bigger than a 10awg wire if your close to the panel. Siemens breakers will work just fine. Just make sure it is a single pole breaker. I had a friend that hooked his plug up to 240 volt. After one attempt to plug it in he ordered a new invertor
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Ouch!!







definitely using a single-pole....


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## thefulminator (Aug 8, 2007)

Just a suggestion.

If you are going to the trouble of installing a box with a 30 amp outlet, install a 20 amp GFI wall outlet next to it just like at most rv parks. In the event you do work on your trailer, it would be really nice to be able to run a shop vac, battery charger, heater, work light or other device without having to run the cord around the other side of your trailer. If you ever do electrical work on the trailer and can't have the trailer powered up, you still have a place to plug your tools in.


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## outback loft (Sep 22, 2008)

bowhunter2819 said:


> Spend the extra few dollars and use 8 wire. That way you wont have to worry about it.


For a 15' run he is fine with 10 wire, there is not enough of a voltage drop to need 8 wire.


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## GlenninTexas (Aug 11, 2004)

You can find the outlet at Lowe's or Home Depot. Standard 30amp RV Outlet.

Regards, Glenn


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## vdub (Jun 19, 2004)

> don't have an 20A outlet close enough to reach


Yeah, that would make a difference.









This summer, I will be boondocking for a couple months. I have a quiet gen (Honda 2000), but still prefer the silence of the forest. I got a 100' 10awg 120/3 extension cord (tad expensive) to get the gen out in the forest as far as possible.

The gen will only be run a few hours a day to charge the batteries and save some propane by switching hot water and fridge to electricity during the charge period.

I took my ques from ghosty and installed two 220ah golf cart bats with a remote controlled 1750w modified sine wave invertor. It's big enough to run all my electrical needs for several days I think. Eventually, I'll get solar panels and two more batteries.

Anyway, I'm off topic... Back to your outlet....


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## jasonrebecca (Oct 30, 2007)

I installed one a couple years ago. It has a 30A RV outlet and a duplex. I ran 3 #8 wires in flex conduit across the attic of my garage and then through the wall like you see here.


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## therink (May 13, 2010)

I found a 30amp rv receptacle at Lowes and ran direct burial 30am rated romex cable from my house 30 amp breaker to the rv spot in the yard. Put the receotacle on a wooden post. Cost for everything, about $100. Works great.


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## Chuggs (Jun 8, 2010)

Sounds like you've got a handle on it...

Circuit Breaker Panel...

Add 1 - 30amp Single Pole breaker. Check for a decal on your load center for listings of compatible breakers.

Indoor Outlet:

Mount a box to the wall...

Select wire... If it's in a place that's not likely to be molested...like sitting tools ontop of the wire...etc. You can use 10-2 w/ground Romex Wire. If you're likely to rest things against the wire run...then it's a good idea to shield it...you could use metal conduit, or flexible armor, grey pvc, etc... Then run individual stranded wire 3 - #10awg THHN.

TT-30 receptacle

Cover Plate compatible with receptacle

Note: Use box adapter to clamp romex end as it enters box/panel, or use appropriate box adapter for conduit/amored flexible conduit. Romex or conduit should be anchored to the wall for support...they make romex staples...and conduit straps for this.

Outdoors:

Electrical box with cover suitable for outdoor use w/ TT-30 Receptacle.

PVC conduit - schedule 40 if it's not in a traffic area otherwires schedule 80 - 1/2" mininimum. PVC cement. PVC box adapters. Conduit straps for achoring. If buried...2" inches below grade if you use PVC. Low amperage can be buried shallower than this. Outdoor metal conduit can be buried shallower...but it's cheaper/easier to use PVC IMHO.

Wire... 3 - #10awg THWN...or 10-2 w/ground NMB direct burial wire.

Some thoughts...

The single box outlet is a very economical way to run the 30amp rv outle. The only problem it presents is when you go to plug-in. It's a good practice when connecting your RV's shore power cord to trip the breaker before you plug it in. After the connection is made...you turn the breaker back on. Do the reverse when disconnecting. This prevents an arc from jumping accoss the contacts when making a connection --- which will form a slag deposit. This will eventually lead to a poor connection. Since the single outlet doesn't have a breaker co-located with it... you can either trip the 30 amp breaker in the load center of your house...or the 30 amp breaker in the load center of your RV. Then you can plug/unplug without making an arc during the connection.

If you use #10 wire...it's going to have to be totally replaced if you decide later to go to a 50amp outlet. If you use 1/2" PVC you'll have to upgrade to 3/4" sched 40 or 1" sched 80 (if using pvc) to run a 50amp circuit. Just be aware that it will cost more in the long run to do the job twice...should you decide later on you want a 50amp circuit.

BE SAFE! Have flashlights handy...trip that main before removing the cover of your houses load center. It only takes a second to make a mistake and get electrocuted. I know people play with live wires all the time...but every now and then...somebody will get bitten!


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## rdvholtwood (Sep 18, 2008)

jasonrebecca said:


> Sounds like you've got a handle on it...Circuit Breaker Panel...Add 1 - 30amp Single Pole breaker. Check for a decal on your load center for listings of compatible breakers. Indoor Outlet:Mount a box to the wall...Select wire... If it's in a place that's not likely to be molested...like sitting tools ontop of the wire...etc. You can use 10-2 w/ground Romex Wire. If you're likely to rest things against the wire run...then it's a good idea to shield it...you could use metal conduit, or flexible armor, grey pvc, etc... Then run individual stranded wire 3 - #10awg THHN.TT-30 receptacleCover Plate compatible with receptacleNote: Use box adapter to clamp romex end as it enters box/panel, or use appropriate box adapter for conduit/amored flexible conduit. Romex or conduit should be anchored to the wall for support...they make romex staples...and conduit straps for this.Outdoors:Electrical box with cover suitable for outdoor use w/ TT-30 Receptacle.PVC conduit - schedule 40 if it's not in a traffic area otherwires schedule 80 - 1/2" mininimum. PVC cement. PVC box adapters. Conduit straps for achoring. If buried...2" inches below grade if you use PVC. Low amperage can be buried shallower than this. Outdoor metal conduit can be buried shallower...but it's cheaper/easier to use PVC IMHO.Wire... 3 - #10awg THWN...or 10-2 w/ground NMB direct burial wire.Some thoughts...The single box outlet is a very economical way to run the 30amp rv outle. The only problem it presents is when you go to plug-in. It's a good practice when connecting your RV's shore power cord to trip the breaker before you plug it in. After the connection is made...you turn the breaker back on. Do the reverse when disconnecting. This prevents an arc from jumping accoss the contacts when making a connection --- which will form a slag deposit. This will eventually lead to a poor connection. Since the single outlet doesn't have a breaker co-located with it... you can either trip the 30 amp breaker in the load center of your house...or the 30 amp breaker in the load center of your RV. Then you can plug/unplug without making an arc during the connection.If you use #10 wire...it's going to have to be totally replaced if you decide later to go to a 50amp outlet. If you use 1/2" PVC you'll have to upgrade to 3/4" sched 40 or 1" sched 80 (if using pvc) to run a 50amp circuit. Just be aware that it will cost more in the long run to do the job twice...should you decide later on you want a 50amp circuit. BE SAFE! Have flashlights handy...trip that main before removing the cover of your houses load center. It only takes a second to make a mistake and get electrocuted. I know people play with live wires all the time...but every now and then...somebody will get bitten!


Nice! Both are nice....I like the idea of the breakers being right in the box. Just curious - do you have another breaker in the main fuse panel or is this wire hot up until this point?

At this point, I am just going to install the 30A receptacle (inside the garage) with a breaker in the main fuse panel. I have a 20A circuit close to the 30A that I can use if I need to kill power to the TT. Unless its outside and near a water supply I don't think it has to be GFI. I would tend to think using a power tool drawing some amps would constantly trip the breaker?

Thanks Everyone for all your input!


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## vdub (Jun 19, 2004)

I believe the package on a GFCI says that it only protects against a direct short situation and not a situation where you are drawing too much power. It's not to be used as a fuse. Not sure why that would be the case because you can buy a GFCI in various ratings such as 15 and 20 amps. Maybe some electrician could explain that to me.

While you're at it, could a 15amp blade fuse for a 12v system be used as a 15amp fuse in a 120v system? Understanding, of course that the max watts in the two situations would be a 10x difference. The question is, would the 15amp fuse blow at 15amps no matter how many volts? I.e. it would blow at >180w on a 12v system and it would blow at >1800w on a 120v system. Is that right? Or is that faulty thinking? I believe it's faulty thinking, but when I look at a 15amp blade fuse, it does say "for a 12v system".


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## Chuggs (Jun 8, 2010)

rdvholtwood said:


> I believe the package on a GFCI says that it only protects against a direct short situation and not a situation where you are drawing too much power. It's not to be used as a fuse. Not sure why that would be the case because you can buy a GFCI in various ratings such as 15 and 20 amps. Maybe some electrician could explain that to me.
> 
> While you're at it, could a 15amp blade fuse for a 12v system be used as a 15amp fuse in a 120v system? Understanding, of course that the max watts in the two situations would be a 10x difference. The question is, would the 15amp fuse blow at 15amps no matter how many volts? I.e. it would blow at >180w on a 12v system and it would blow at >1800w on a 120v system. Is that right? Or is that faulty thinking? I believe it's faulty thinking, but when I look at a 15amp blade fuse, it does say "for a 12v system".


The GFCI Outlet is current protected by the 20amp (OR 15amp) breaker. The GFCI part of it just measures and unbalanced circuit. IE...if the LINE and NEUTRAL aren't carrying the same amount of current...it trips. It's assuming that current is passing to ground either thru your body or a short to the enclosure which is grounded. Hopefully, preventing you from getting electrocuted. They do make GFCI breakers...which effectively do BOTH... But, in most cases the GFCI part is built into the receptacle. Each Receptacle that is hooked up in series to this outlet is also protected.

Yes...amperage is amperage...but the materials and housing are rated for thier application. It would be a poor practice to use 12VDC rated fuses in a 120VAC circuit. You could accidentally touch the contact that the fuse goes in and get shocked if you touched a 120vac Line...you wouldn't get shocked if you touched a 12vdc+ or 12vdc- terminal.

They make cartridge fuses for AC circuits...very common in air conditioner disconnects, and motor circuit disconnects. They usually blow BEFORE the circuit breaker in the main panel, saving you from having to find a main panel. The disconnect is usually within eyesight of the device it protects.

I'm using a 30amp/125vac rated receptacle and plug under my RV for connecting a FLOJET macerator pump to 12VDC. It works very nicely...even though it's not really rated for 12vdc circuits.
The only real problem with doing it is...the 12v wires in an RV have insulation rated for 105 degrees C...if memory serves. The 30amp - 125V receptacle that I'm using probably has terminals rated for only 75 or 90 degrees C. If I were to run full current through the circuit I could posibly overheat the termination on the receptacle...I get around this by using #10 wire rated for 30 amps...and the circuit is actually protected by a 20 amp fuse...so the wire will never get near 105 degrees with such a limitation on the amperage.


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## 7heaven (Jun 4, 2005)

When we did a kitchen makeover a couple of years ago, we needed to upgrade the electrical panel. I had the electrician run a 30 and 50 amp service to the garage, with the outlets right inside the big garage door.


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## rdvholtwood (Sep 18, 2008)

Chuggs said:


> Some thoughts...
> 
> The single box outlet is a very economical way to run the 30amp rv outle. The only problem it presents is when you go to plug-in. It's a good practice when connecting your RV's shore power cord to trip the breaker before you plug it in. After the connection is made...you turn the breaker back on. Do the reverse when disconnecting. This prevents an arc from jumping accoss the contacts when making a connection --- which will form a slag deposit. This will eventually lead to a poor connection. Since the single outlet doesn't have a breaker co-located with it... you can either trip the 30 amp breaker in the load center of your house...or the 30 amp breaker in the load center of your RV. Then you can plug/unplug without making an arc during the connection.
> 
> ...


Finally!







the last thing I needed was the 10-2 wire - boy was that $$$.









The 10-2 was fun to work....and I was VERY careful when working in the load center. After getting everything connected and wired, I flipped the switch and didn't see any smoke! (I was told that as long as I DIDN'T let the smoke out, that everything was OK







) For now, I just mounted it just inside the garage door in a single box









When I was at Lowe's I was checking out their load boxes and saw boxes for 2 or more breakers, but, no holes for mounting outlets?...Where did you get yours? Do these boxes have punch outs or are they designed that way.? Also, since I have a surge protector that doesn't apply shore power to the RV for at least 2 minutes - I don't think I need to worry about arcing....


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