# Delamination Fixed



## uh-60guy (Feb 6, 2006)

Our Outback is back home after a complete face lift. It looks great. The only concern I have is when I talked to the technician. He was saying that this was the first Outback they replaced a nose on and they were surprised how cheap the front was made ( he said it was composed of cardboard). Outback (from what they told me) sent a reenforced updated version for replacement. After taking my Outback in, the dealership went looking at the new Outbacks they had and reported they have 4 or 5 that have delam and they are brand new. I very weary how well this new nose is going to hold up. Yes, delamination is one thing but when the delam starts cracking(like it had) thats just looking for problems with water. We are considering trading in the camper but it hard to give up the Outback. The first time I see a delam problem with this new nose I will be trading her in. It a great trailer and will always win on looks compared to other campers but I hope the quality is as good as the looks. One other thing the technician said was there was no evidence of any water problem. For the folks that didn't see my first post about this I will explain the problem. I had delamination starting from the top of the camper going all the way down to the Outback sticker. It wasn't the delam like I have seen on pictures on this sight. It was small ripples with cracks running through them. I took about 3 or 4 months for it to make it down to the sticker.Oh well, I got a trip planned for Labor day weekend. Happy camping.


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## Travelers (Apr 6, 2006)

Happy to hear that you're fixed-up and back on the road again. In other threads I've voiced my concern on the delam issue with the latest Outback models. 50 percent of the Outbacks on a dealer's lot here in Minnesota have cracks or bubbles in the front. Their tech also said newer Outbacks have the cardboard front and no other TT's have it.

You may have been one of the lucky ones to have the issue pop up so soon and under warranty. At least now you have the option of selling while the unit still looks good. The rest of us will have to wait for the next year or two, or three to see if these issues get us - out of warranty. We love the looks of our Outback but the delam issue is huge - I look at the front of our camper every time I walk by it. Mine is softer now than when we bought it four months ago but I see no bubbles or cracks.

Keystone needs to extend it's warranty around this. Are you reading this Keysone? Hello! Is somebody there? I hear you read this every day. Any response of any kind would be great. I heard that a couple of Techs went to a rally and talked to our members - did anyone bring up this issue? If so, I'm sure we would all like to hear what their response was.


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## jewel (May 16, 2005)

I too look at mine everytime I walk by. Im very worried about this -- and if it's going to happen - it better be in warrenty!! We had our outback for 2wks and things were falling apart. Havent taken it in yet - but that's cuz we dont want to be without it during the camping mnths. Anyways..yeah, I would love to hear if they have a response to this!

Jewels


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## Chris1bea95 (Jun 7, 2006)

Can anyone post some pictures of signs to look for? We have had our Outback for a month now and not had any issues other than normal new stuff problems. I had a boat with cracking in the gelcoat and fought for an entire new gel coat and won!


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## uh-60guy (Feb 6, 2006)

Chris1bea95 said:


> Can anyone post some pictures of signs to look for? We have had our Outback for a month now and not had any issues other than normal new stuff problems. I had a boat with cracking in the gelcoat and fought for an entire new gel coat and won!


I didn't take any pictures before it went to the shop but it started way up top near the meeting point of the roof and nose panel. It looks like small wrinkles in the paint right where the nose started to bend around to come down the front. Once it started it never slowed down. I started to worry once it got to the Outback sticker.


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## PDX_Doug (Nov 16, 2004)

So, what I'm getting out of all this delamination talk is that Keystone changed the construction method and materials used, and the trailers with the new method are the ones having the problems. Is this correct?

If so, does anyone know when that change took place? We have had no problems with ours (built 02/05), and this seems to be an issue only in the newer builds. Did we get lucky, and get in on the old style?









Happy Trails,
Doug


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## NJMikeC (Mar 29, 2006)

Next time somebody takes there trailer in for the de-lamination issue then they should have a look at this "cardboard". I'm a little disapointed that they didn't build it like it shows in the brochure where they use the same material that is on the walls. We also heard another member say they are stapled together.

The front on mine is soft. If it is that soft then it will crack for sure over time. Why would you make the wall that has less support and faces the most abuse differently from the rest of the walls. Maybe they aren't as advertised either.

Travelers--- no, nobody is looking from Keystone! I agree with you. Very big problem, very big customer disatisfier! Can you imagine people seeing those new campers on the lot with bubbles in them. Yikes lost that Outback sale for sure!


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## Travelers (Apr 6, 2006)

Of the four Outbacks I've seen with these issues, two had 1/06 production dates and two had 2/06 dates. I've read where other members have had delam issues and I think it would be good to start keeping track of the problems. It would be nice to know that hopefully this only affects a small production run or is it a bigger prolems that spans several years?

So, those members that have had delam, cracking or bubling issues with the front of your Outback please respond with type of problem, production date and whether or not Keystone covered the cost (if out of warranty).

Also, anyone know what it costs to replace the front cap if we have to pick up the cost later on?

Thanks,
Lee


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## Castle Rock Outbackers (Jan 18, 2004)

We purchased our 2004 in January of 2004 with a production date of August 2003. Zero delamination on ours after three years of camping.

Back in 2003 the Outback assemblers were smoking pot on a regular basis, so maybe that was a good thing.

Randy


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## mjatalley (Feb 2, 2006)

Travelers said:


> So, those members that have had delam, cracking or bubling issues with the front of your Outback please respond with type of problem, production date and whether or not Keystone covered the cost (if out of warranty).


We also have a small delam problem on the front of our 2006 26RLS. We are waiting until after camping season to take it in for warranty work for this and a few other small problems.

I haven't looked at my paperwork yet - but where do you find the production date and I will let everyone know.


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## Travelers (Apr 6, 2006)

mjatalley said:


> So, those members that have had delam, cracking or bubling issues with the front of your Outback please respond with type of problem, production date and whether or not Keystone covered the cost (if out of warranty).


We also have a small delam problem on the front of our 2006 26RLS. We are waiting until after camping season to take it in for warranty work for this and a few other small problems.

I haven't looked at my paperwork yet - but where do you find the production date and I will let everyone know.
[/quote]

The production\GVW data is located on the left side (streetside) under the passthrough door. It's a small square metal plate with all the data on it.

We only need to hear from those members that have had problems - hopefully it's a small group!


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## jewel (May 16, 2005)

Dang. Im really worried. after all our hard earned money is spent on a trailer to have to worry about such things...grr.
our old trailer, we bought in '98, and it was a '96 - we had no problems with it what-so-ever. Im not so thrilled to hear that it's made of cardboard..wait til I tell my husband that one!


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## Chris1bea95 (Jun 7, 2006)

Is it "Corroplast" or corrugated paper? Corruplast is the material that is used underneath the trailer for protection.


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## johnny l (Oct 19, 2005)

Travelers said:


> So, those members that have had delam, cracking or bubling issues with the front of your Outback please respond with type of problem, production date and whether or not Keystone covered the cost (if out of warranty).


We also have a small delam problem on the front of our 2006 26RLS. We are waiting until after camping season to take it in for warranty work for this and a few other small problems.

I haven't looked at my paperwork yet - but where do you find the production date and I will let everyone know.
[/quote]


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## Travelers (Apr 6, 2006)

The Outback brochure only lists construction materials for walls, roof & floor. Unfortunately, there's no description for the construction of the front of the TT. Some type of cardboard glued to the fiberglass I guess. I assume the first thing to let go is the glue, or if moisture gets in under the fiberglass it starts pulling away from the cardboard? Would sure like Keystone to explain this one. How about it Keystone?


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## johnny l (Oct 19, 2005)

also have small delam bubble in front have 2006 26rks trying to sell below payoff still under warranty hope keystone wakes up and takes care of everyone!!! it would be the honest thing to do!!!!!!!!!! everthing else is just fine thank god no leaks and no cracks


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## aplvlykat (Jan 25, 2004)

I posted this before because of the problem I had with my front. My outback was made on 7/ 2004. The front is constructed of thin fiberglass(guessing 1/16 thick) and industrial stenght cardboard (guessing 1/4 thick), it is not the same as the bottom it is heavy duty cardboard in several pieces joined togethere on the inside with thin alum. strips. It is stapled onto the alum. frame and is suppose to fit between the sidewalls which extend aprox. 1/4 inch to the front. The front is then stapled on to the alum. frame flush with the sidewall and the edging is then sealed and screwed over both the side and the front. I live in the desert in So. Cal. and get a lot of sun and huge temp swings, sometimes as much as 30 degrees from morning till night. I had a slight indication of water leakage around one of the lights but I do not think that is what caused the delamination problem. I think it was due to expansion and contraction and once the fiberglass broke loose the problem compounded and expanded. I did contact the dealer I bought my outback from and they basically told me that they did not think Keystone would do anything and if they did it would be out of goodwill. They also gave me a price for replacing the front. If I was to buy it and do it myself the cost was 900.00 and to have them install it was another 1200.00 dollars. The draw back is that there was no guarantee that it would not do it again. That is why I had custom alum panels bent to fit the profile. I painted them to match, removed and replaced the fiberglass batting with foam board and installed the new panels. Then I ordered the decals and installed them. I can't remember the exact cost but I think it was around 650.00 plus 85.00 for decals but I did all the labor. My front end is as solid as the sidewalls are and will not delaminate again, As far as I am concerned this is the only way to fix this problem correctly and permanently. Kirk


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## mrw3gr (Feb 19, 2006)

Mine was manufactured 1/27/06 and it had the front end replaced about a month ago. Every morning before work I look up at the front end to see if it's starting to repeat (I also look at the awning where I rubbed against the side of the house backing the caboose into the parking pad....oh, geez...







)


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## outback21 (Jun 17, 2006)

Great, like I needed one more thing to worry about! Ours was manuf. in 4/06...I will be inspecting regularly!!!


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## Chris1bea95 (Jun 7, 2006)

Thanks for putting me in panic mode. I asked the local dealer what to look for and he told the same things that everyone has stated here. A not so good thing is that he also told me that he is replacing 6 fronts next week on other keystone products - HOBIE and ZEPPLIN. The replaceent takes about 5 hours each.


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## WDS9074 (Jun 19, 2006)

I have a 2006 28krs, not sure of the exact date of manufacture. It already has three bubbles low on the front left. I haven't talked to my dealer yet do to camping every other weekend and don't want to turn in for repairs for that long. I am going to have to have them look at before the warrenty is up. I would just rather have them do diamond plate over it then replace the whole front end.


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## Travelers (Apr 6, 2006)

WDS9074 said:


> I have a 2006 28krs, not sure of the exact date of manufacture. It already has three bubbles low on the front left. I haven't talked to my dealer yet do to camping every other weekend and don't want to turn in for repairs for that long. I am going to have to have them look at before the warrenty is up. I would just rather have them do diamond plate over it then replace the whole front end.


Please report the manufacture date as we are trying to determine approximately which production runs were affected the most with this problem. Right now it looks like late 2005 through May 2006 production units have the most issues with delamination. Hopefully, Keystone would extend the warranty for these models based on such a high failure rate. Any comments Keystone????

Thanks,
Lee


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## GoVols (Oct 7, 2005)

I have a 2006 model 26RS manufactured *November 2005*. Four bubbles have appeared, all below the "bend"; three close to the hitch light, and one behind the propane tanks. They are growing and two have merged into a larger bubble.

Sent a certified letter with delivery receipt today to my dealer and to Keystone RV Customer Service detailing the problem and including pictures. (I will have the delivery receipt as proof of notification.)


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## NJMikeC (Mar 29, 2006)

A good friend is looking at trailers. I am steering him away from ours. Starting to look like it is just a matter of time for all of us. Hopefully not but then again maybe it is.


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## johnny l (Oct 19, 2005)

my manfu date is 11/1/05 need to sell


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## batex (Oct 2, 2006)

I have a significant delamination problem on the front cap of my 2003 25RSS Outback which I purchased new in September 2003. It appears as large soft bubbles all over the front of the trailer. It did not start until this summer. The trailer is stored in a covered area but late







afternoon sun can reach the front cap, so maybe the heat is what makes this happen. In any case, it shouldn't happen. Other than large bubbles in the roof which was replaced under warranty, and now this problem we have been satisfied with the trailer. I would like to know what response anyone is getting from the factory when they report an out of warranty delamination problem as I will be corresponding with them within the next week.


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## NJMikeC (Mar 29, 2006)

Bobtex,

Let us know what happens, and good luck.

Mike C


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## Scott Z. (Jul 13, 2006)

uh-60guy said:


> [
> I didn't take any pictures before it went to the shop but it started way up top near the meeting point of the roof and nose panel. It looks like small wrinkles in the paint right where the nose started to bend around to come down the front. Once it started it never slowed down. I started to worry once it got to the Outback sticker.


This is exactly where mine is located that I posted a picture of last week - and I've had my trailer since August 19. The manufacture date is 7/2006. I just talked with Team Challenger and they provided the names of the local repair centers in so I can take it in after my last trip in 2 weeks. I sent the photo to Keystone and they seemed to know right away what the problem is.

Here's the photo again:


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## JimBo99 (Apr 25, 2006)

Could we get a list of affected models by how many of each? We know the % of ownership of the forum, so maybe we can figure on what models the most failures are occuring.


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## KCPart4 (Apr 27, 2006)

I noticed a large bubble on the front cap just above the tanks. We have a 25RSS bought new in April '06. First saw it in August but haven't made it to the dealer yet. Have a week long trip next week but plan to contact dealer when I return. Also have a large bubble on the underside of the queen bed slide. Anyone else noticed a bubble there? Seems like a pattern with this crap. Needs to be resolved, we love the Outback but not against selling it either for a durable brand.


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## johnny l (Oct 19, 2005)

you think keystone outback co. is going out of busniess? you think any good co would take care of this!!!!!!!you would think outback would want a happy repeat buyer! what goes around comes around!!!! lots of people have jobs at keystone! if i was keystone i would contact all outbacks onwers and take care of this!DO THE RITE THING 26rks 2006 model contact me if need more info


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## huntr70 (Jul 8, 2005)

KCPart4 said:


> we love the Outback but not against selling it either for a durable brand.


Good luck with that.........unless you are going to get a $500,000 Class A.

Actually, I've seen them in the shop at our local dealer too.

Let your dealer try to take care of it.....these things are made on an assembly line. They are not perfect. Would I like mine to be, yes. Would I like my truck to be..?? Yes. Would ZI like my house to be??...Yes.

In a perfect world............









Steve


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## arsenana (Jul 8, 2006)

Ours is a 2002. We just ordered a new front and rear cap.

*Total estimate is $2,543.75*.

Each cap is $340.50. Kicker is the labor - 10 hours for the front, 8 for the back. Then add shipping and tax. The front had a wrinkle after a year or so of first buying it (brand new.) I kick myself for not being more aggresive with the dealer and with Keystone on getting it fixed then. Now its all out of warranty, and on my own dime.

The rear cap just has 2 bubbles around the lights. But the whole cap has to be replaced, since its only cardboard underneath. If it was plywood (even cheap, light luanne) it could be patched.

I would gladly have paid 2 or 3 thousand more for plywood instead of cardboard. And adjusted for the additional weight. We love our Outback, and spend a good portion of the year in it. Hopefully, these repairs will hold us another 5 years. Then we'll replace it - but probably not with a Keystone product, and definitely not from our original dealer (a Camping World gold star dealer.)

I will forward the production data as requested.


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## GoVols (Oct 7, 2005)

arsenana said:


> Ours is a 2002. We just ordered a new front and rear cap.
> 
> *Total estimate is $2,543.75*.
> 
> ...


The Keystone customer rep told me they would authorize a front cap replacement for me and it is a 5 hour repair. You might question the labor hours.


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## louvel1 (Jun 9, 2006)

I have a 2006 23krs. I just received a call yesterday from my dealer asking me to bring my trailer in in Wednesday for delam repair. He told me I would have to leave it for a week.


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## N7OQ (Jun 10, 2006)

I have this front bubble thing and waiting for my new front to come in. I'm not sure when my trailer was made but I think I remember it to be Feb 06. I will check it when I get the trailer from the storage lot.

Does anyone know if the new front they put on is made of a better material?


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