# Traveling With Fresh Water Tanks Full



## Jack from Oregon (Nov 9, 2011)

Hi Folks,

Here is an interesting conversation I recently had w/ a Keystone factory rep. We have a 2012 Outback 21RS, bought new. In our discussion, which started as a topic on tongue weight, the conversation expanded to traveling with fresh water in the holding tank. He relayed that Keystone recommends (warns?) that water not be held in the fresh water tanks when traveling. Reason?, that the weight, coupled with the sloshing of the water could stress the tank and the braces. What?, last time I checked, that's what "dry camping" is all about. He said that they want owners to go as far as possible to the campsite before filing up the tank at the closest faucet. This might work when you're going to an established campground, but when your camping on BLM, NFS or other public lands and the closest "faucet" is 50+ miles away on gravel roads...Has anyone else heard of this? Any comments/stories of your experiences would be appreciated by all of us "dry campers". Best regards, Jack in Oregon.


----------



## 26rester (Dec 11, 2012)

I have not heard of this either. We do sometimes travel with the tankful of water, I thought that is what it was there for. I a, going to have to reevaluate that and research the heck out of that.


----------



## Oregon_Camper (Sep 13, 2004)

Sounds like a bunch of CYA if you ask me.

I've been all over Oregon's back roads, camping WAY into unpaved roads and we always fill the tank prior to leaving home. I've looked a the tank once full and it seem like there is never an issue.


----------



## KTMRacer (Jun 28, 2010)

Oregon_Camper said:


> Sounds like a bunch of CYA if you ask me.
> 
> I've been all over Oregon's back roads, camping WAY into unpaved roads and we always fill the tank prior to leaving home. I've looked a the tank once full and it seem like there is never an issue.


x2. I have close to 15,000 miles on our outback. probably over 10,000 miles with FULL fresh water. And a large number of miles with grey and black full and fresh empty. I think it is a CYA.

Now, the way the fresh is held in place is with several straps across frame members. With a full fresh tank, the tank will bulge down where not supported. Being somewhat anal, what I did was to drop the underbelly and insert 3/4" plywood under the fresh tank. there was about 1" clearance between the tank top and the flooring. The plywood spans the whole width. Then I screwed through the frame crossmember flange into the plywood to secure it. IIRC the existing straps were screwed from the top through the frame crossmember flange, so they just stayed in place below the plywood.

In reality it's was a nice mod, but probably was overkill. I know many many people that dry camp and always travel with full fresh tanks and non has ever had an issue.

Just watch your overall weight. In my case a full fresh tank adds about 150lbs to the tongue.

For the black/grey tanks, they are different tanks, abs with some ribbing for strength and captured the full length on a top flange, so I don't see any issues with them either or any need for support underneath.


----------



## raynardo (Jun 8, 2007)

The Keystone rep is probably not a person who has spent any amount of time traveling in a trailer.

Whether it's the fresh water, gray water, or black water, you're going to have sloshing when traveling. In fact, if you don't have any water in your black water tank, you're going to have a nasty dried on mess inside the tank that will have very unpleasing odors throughout the TT.

I've traveled over 60,000 miles in my OB and I always try to have as much water as possible in my tanks, because I like to know that I can stop anywhere for an extended period of time without any citified connections.

We're totally self contained, complete with an onboard 4300 watt generator as well as solar panels. Wherever we go we've got all the comforts of home. That's the way I want to travel, otherwise I'd still have tent, and I'm too old for that now.

I've seen no other literature from Keystone or any other RV manufacturer to advise traveling without any water in your tanks, even if it's to prevent sloshing. So it to me in writing, an not just on some Internet post, and then I'll consider the source.

My experience comes from real life. Not too many people put on as many miles as I have on a travel trailer. We have. We've got 44 states and two Canadian provinces under our trailer. Our worst problems have been cheap tires coming apart and the axle shackle bolt falling out. Yeah, we've had delamination on our front end cap but that was fixed under warranty, and now the end cap is bubbling, but I'm not fixing it, I'll continuing using the trailer until I can't any more, and use the delamination as advertising for Keystone!


----------



## Just Add Dirt (May 5, 2009)

I think its CYA too; Keystone likes to put cheap, under rated tires, on their TT at the factory. lots of water pushes the envelope of the capacities. Like many others, I've had my factory "C" rated, biased ply tires, on my toyhauler, come apart on the highway only to find out they were over extended once I filled the tanks, and put a toy in the garage.


----------



## TwoElkhounds (Mar 11, 2007)

Jack from Oregon said:


> Hi Folks,
> 
> What?, last time I checked, that's what "dry camping" is all about. He said that they want owners to go as far as possible to the campsite before filing up the tank at the closest faucet.


LOL, this is so funny. So what are you supposed to do, find a house near the campground and just hook up your fill hose to their spigot and fill your tanks? We dry camp a lot, there is no place to fill up near the campground. Besides, I like having my own water from my own house. I am not sure that anyone at Keystone has ever camped a day in their life, they really seem to be clueless.

I always travel with a full tank and have never had any problems.

DAN


----------



## CamperAndy (Aug 26, 2004)

Flip this to the end of the long trip in the woods and you are on your way home. Guess what the status is of the other (Black) tank!!

The straps and structure can and should hold full tanks. Can things go bad and they fail? Yes they can but in the 10 of thousand miles I have pulled my trailer I have never worried about having them empty.

As many have said, this is a salesman in CYA mode.


----------



## Jack from Oregon (Nov 9, 2011)

Ahhh, ain't CYA grand!!!!

Thanks to my fellow "dry campers" for your feedback. Also, hats off to KTMRacer for his/her ideas about reinforcing the fresh water tank bracket, looks like I'll go under the beast and take a look. Like all of of you, my wife and I like to go the roads way less traveled, take our time and be self contained w/ a 120 watt solar array, two Trojan 6 volt 145's and other goodies. I too was incredulous when the Keystone rep gave me that advice about no water in the holding tank..again...WHAT???!!! Needless to say, we're taking water in the tank!!

Here's another question for you all, I purchased a 2" receiver hitch, cargo carrier (Harbor Freight) for the back of the Outback. I'm going to carry 10 extra gallons of gas on it since our 2012 Tundra has a rather small (26 gallon) fuel tank. As some of you also have, our's has a 1 1/2" receiver hitch welded on to a separate small frame, apart from the 4" bumper where the spare tire carrier is installed. That little hitch and the way it's mounted is a joke. I took off the spare tire carrier, I'll carry the tire in the back of our Tundra. In it's place, I've ordered a 2" bolt on (no drilling) receiver from Curt Equip. and will install this on to the 4" bumper. I'll be careful not to exceed the weight limit on the bumper. Any stories/advice from you all?

BTW, thanks Outbackers.com and the Admin.

Jack in Oregon


----------



## MJV (Apr 19, 2012)

As others have stated , we also prefer to travel with a full fresh water tank in our 2011---210RS. As this adds weight to the back of the trailer , and lessens the tounge weight, we believe we have handeling problems from possibly not enough tounge weight, but not sure? Other than that we travel with the usual load most users carry in their trailers. I realize we should weigh all axles, however we have not done that yet. Our tow vehicle is a 98--F150 with a standard suspension for the XLT model---5.4 engine. we are using a Rees tow bar with 550 lb. spring bars and a single aftermarket friction sway control. My guess is we also need a tow bar with heavier spring bars---over 750lb. Comments and suggestions??. Thanks Marcel.


----------



## pgwaldner (Feb 5, 2013)

I agree about the cheap tires. I replaced mine with goodyear tires made for u-haul. They are a little pricy, but you get what you pay for. These tires are made for being abused by people whe rent trailers and to being exposed to the elements contstantly. You have to get your dealer to do a little searching, but they do sell them to the public.

I also travel with a full fresh water tank as mine is at the front of the trailer and the extra tongue weight really helps with handling.



raynardo said:


> The Keystone rep is probably not a person who has spent any amount of time traveling in a trailer.
> 
> Whether it's the fresh water, gray water, or black water, you're going to have sloshing when traveling. In fact, if you don't have any water in your black water tank, you're going to have a nasty dried on mess inside the tank that will have very unpleasing odors throughout the TT.
> 
> ...


----------



## Nanamonster (Dec 30, 2010)

pgwaldner said:


> The Keystone rep is probably not a person who has spent any amount of time traveling in a trailer.
> 
> Whether it's the fresh water, gray water, or black water, you're going to have sloshing when traveling. In fact, if you don't have any water in your black water tank, you're going to have a nasty dried on mess inside the tank that will have very unpleasing odors throughout the TT.
> 
> ...


[/quote]
Is this mentioned in the USERS MANUAL? We have a 31 foot bh, we travel with the tanks full all the time.


----------



## KTMRacer (Jun 28, 2010)

Jack from Oregon said:


> Ahhh, ain't CYA grand!!!!
> 
> Thanks to my fellow "dry campers" for your feedback. Also, hats off to KTMRacer for his/her ideas about reinforcing the fresh water tank bracket, looks like I'll go under the beast and take a look. Like all of of you, my wife and I like to go the roads way less traveled, take our time and be self contained w/ a 120 watt solar array, two Trojan 6 volt 145's and other goodies. I too was incredulous when the Keystone rep gave me that advice about no water in the holding tank..again...WHAT???!!! Needless to say, we're taking water in the tank!!
> 
> ...


I cringe at the though of carrying fuel on my bumper. It wouldn't take much of a rear ender to send the trailer and everything around it up in flames!! IMHO carrying fuel or a fueled up genny on the back of my bumper is NOT something I would do.

And BTW on my cargo trailer, I was rear ended TWICE within a one month period while I was stopped at a light. Stopped for 20-30 seconds and BAMM!! Second time got a a complete brand new rear drop down ramp door , not so lucky to the second car that hit me. The Bimmer had bumper, both front fenders, headlights, and hood crinkled. Still had her cell phone at her ear when I came back to look and see what happened. The second one would probably have had gas all over if I had gas cans on the back, even if they were metal.

I carry extra fuel in the pickup bed at the front of the bed.


----------



## Jack from Oregon (Nov 9, 2011)

KMTRacer and the gang,

I agree with your caution as to carrying fuel on the rear cargo carrier of the Outback. No matter what container, (plastic/metal) it's just too exposed to the guy behind you. Reading your response gave my brain the push it needed to store them in the front of the pickup, even though I don't like to store them within the confines of the truck. Welcome to reality...now if Toyota only had put a 35 gallon tank underneath. Thanks...


----------



## Oregon_Camper (Sep 13, 2004)

Jack from Oregon said:


> KMTRacer and the gang,
> 
> I agree with your caution as to carrying fuel on the rear cargo carrier of the Outback. No matter what container, (plastic/metal) it's just too exposed to the guy behind you. Reading your response gave my brain the push it needed to store them in the front of the pickup, even though I don't like to store them within the confines of the truck. Welcome to reality...now if Toyota only had put a 35 gallon tank underneath. Thanks...


Most truck have options (after market) to add a second tank to the truck. Might be the perfect solution for you, but not sure about the price.


----------



## NAturedog2 (Jan 29, 2007)

on our 2007 28rsds our tank got a leak that was a result of the frame that holds the water tank in place breaking, and poking a hold in th side of tank. They build these very cheaply and use the bare minimum thickness of steel. I put 1/4" angle iron to replace it, but it is hard to do as they build these from the ground up. so I would be careful towing with full tanks.


----------



## Larry M (Sep 26, 2006)

You know, all said and done, I'd err on the side of caution. Keystone has not impressed me with the engineering "wiggle room" built into their trailers. If you haven't had a problem traveling with water in the tanks, fine. I had a tech-screw installed through the bottom of my black water holding tank that didn't leak for six years. If I experienced a problem traveling with a full fresh water tank, I'd be looking for a way to carry that necessary water in the bed of the tow vehicle. Was my problem with the black water holding tank the fact that occasionally I had to travel up to fifty miles with the tank full before I could empty it? It wouldn't have been a problem if during assembly someone hadn't run a tech-screw through the bottom of the tank. So, if its' been working, keep doing it, but if you experience problems, address them appropriately. Happy Camping.


----------



## venatic (Jun 11, 2012)

We are looking to travel with a full fresh water tank to our new property, as we don't have water access there. As a test, we filled up the water tank and hot water tank and drove to a place where we could get water if need be. Test was okay, but the weather didn't cooperate as the wind was blowing and the rain was coming down in buckets. Had to pull over a couple of times just to wait it out as it was getting hard to see the road.

But, reading other people's experience, I feel that we will be okay.


----------



## JDStremel3 (Sep 18, 2012)

That's odd the Keystone rep would say that but I just went through the manual and it does state to "Empty the holding tanks" under the "Exterior Pre-travel Checklist." The even more odd part is when I bought the trailer from the dealer they gave it to me "ready to camp" and they filled the fresh water tank. I'm going to fill the tank but look into adding the mod of extra support in the future (thanks for the mod idea).


----------

