# Mad As H---!!!



## 1stTimeAround (Sep 22, 2004)

Hello everyone! action

I received a visit yesterday (I was not home, but he was kind enough to leave some literature on my door!) from one of the county's zoning compliance personnel.







They left information stating that, my "Recreational Vehicle" must be parked in my "rear yard", not the driveway, where it currently resides. On the information he left me, it appears as though he is indicating that the "rear yard" is the area directly behind the house (if you were standing in front of it). Do any of you have any insight into this?

I have one stinkin' neighbor that has issue with the camper! This is the same neighbor that tried to get the rest of the folks in my area to sign a petition to make me move it, and they essentially told her to go to....well you know!! When I first brought the camper home she told me that it "concerned" her because of resale value. I figure resale will be effected much more with a TT in the "rear yard" rather than in a newly paved, nice looking driveway. She said that it blocks her view of the road. This from a woman that never comes outside (I mean that literally, except for cutting her grass, checking her mail, and taking the trash out.) She has done nothing but complain about living in our neighborhood since she moved in. She previously lived in a more rural area on 10 acres, why can't she move back!! The part of this that really sucks is that we had a very good relationship before the TT, but she stopped talking to me, and my family, as soon as the TT showed up. I think she's pissed off at the rest of the neighborhood as well, she didn't stick around for Halloween this year (always has before) and has continued to become what I would consider "Uni-bomber" type reclusive.







Great news though, she's a child psychologist!!









I am awaiting a call from the zoning man today, to see what I have to do and how much time I have to do it. In trying to prepare for what I guess is the inevitable, how much are you folks paying to store your TT? Do pay by the month, is there a contract involved? I know nothing about the storage industry.









Thanks for letting me vent! The part I really hate, is that I just want to have fun with my family. I am not interferring with anyone else's property or life. I don't bother anyone, I don't have loud parties or trash all over my yard, and this is my payback. I could understand better if I had a RV similar to Cousin Eddie in "National Lampoons Christmas Vacation" but I don't.

I appreciate the ear to bend, or eyes actually! I am sure "this too shall pass" , however currently it's just a PITA!


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## mswalt (Sep 14, 2004)

Jason,

Bummer!!!









I feel for you....I know how much time and effort you've put into getting your TT and getting it home and setting it up and so on. Isn't it a shame some "busybody" has to try to ruin it for you?









Is it too impractical to move it behind your house? Can you set it up there "out of the way" and maybe add hookups, too?

If not, I hope you find just the right storage place. I don't know what you'd have to pay, but here in Abilene, they run from $35 to $70 per month (for covered spaces) depending on the location, availability and accessibility.

Anyway, Good Luck.

Mark


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## Jose Fernandez (Jun 22, 2004)

Jason,

Not sure where you live, but I'm surprised you gotten away with this long. In my neighborhood, I can not leave an RV on the street nor the driveway for more than a 24hr period. Basically to load and unload. From talking to other RV owner's, this is common practice.

Jose


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## 1stTimeAround (Sep 22, 2004)

Hey Guys!

Check this out! I spoke with the zoning guy!

I can't park it in my driveway, but I am allowed, legally, according to the zoning compliance guy to park it in the street!!! Yes, in the street, dead in front of her house if I want too!

Obviously this is not the solution I would prefer because this will cause some problems for other neighbors who have been more than willing to leave me and my camper alone. But I will have to do it for a few weeks or until I can make other arrangements. I am currently scripting a letter for my neighbors explaining why I must park it in the street and that I am sorry for any inconvenience that it will cause them.

I'll keep you updated on the matter!

Jason


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## Y-Guy (Jan 30, 2004)

Rear yard usually will mean the side of the house too, behind a standard 6' fence. Our neighborhood requires all boats and trailers to be on the side of the house, where I have mine. My neighbor across the street has his in the back yard, which is in violation and I look right at the back yard. Since this is a new neighborhood we all were well educated on the rules, but for neighborhoods without convents it can be tough. If they haven't equally enforced the rule, and you can find others you may have a defense. Talk with the county guy, read the rules and find out when they were adopted and if you may be grandfathered into them at all. Do your research before you just move it. As for storage, its all relative to size and where you live. Call around, talk to other RV owners and even dealers to find the safest places. If you have any friends that are cops, ask them too.

Good luck resolving it.


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## hurricaneplumber (Apr 12, 2004)

Jason,

I am a boardmember for our city's zoning board. I have heard jabber about our town cracking down on the 40 foot class A motorhomes that are parked in driveways and the road. Since there are only about three of them that cause problems, we now will probably have a law for it.

The best thing to do with your code enforcement is to work with them, keep the temper down and don't badmouth your neighbor. The more you work with them instead of fighting the better off you will be. I have seen people fight back and they are still suffering the consequences.

Is it possible to get to your back yard? If it is not easy then ask if you can get a zoning variance to keep it where it is. Before offering to move it to a storage facility, try to exhaust all other possibilities first. Ask if a fence or shrubbery trees on the property line to help disguise the camper, etc.

There may be options, keep looking for them.

Just keep the temper down, I know it is hard, but it will be advantageous to you.

Good luck

Kevin


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## hurricaneplumber (Apr 12, 2004)

110.100 Rear Yard: Shall mean that space within and extending the full width of the lot
from the rear lot line to the part of the principal structure which is nearest to such
lot line.

110.125 Variance : A grant of relief from one or more of the requirements of this
ordinance.


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## Castle Rock Outbackers (Jan 18, 2004)

Parking our Outback at our property has never been an option for us. We live on a golf course, so the covenants prohibit it. And to be honest, even if we could, I would not park the unit in our front or even side yard. The Outback does, in my opinion, lower the aesthetic value of the cul-de-sac we live on. We love camping (and campers), but that doesn't mean our neighbors do.

We pay $35 a month to store our Outback at a storage lot.

Randy


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## 1stTimeAround (Sep 22, 2004)

Hurricane (and everybody else too!!)

I have not had any issue with the zoning officer. He has been great to talk to and work with.







None of my frustration is directed toward him.

I do have issue with the way the rules are enforced, their is no issue until someone creates and issue, such as my neighbor. If you drive through my neighborhood, there are mulitple situations with boats, RV's, jet skis, utility trailers, etc, however I got "the neighbor".

Your words are well taken and I appreciate the definition for "rear yard". On my county's web site there is no such definition. However in the zoning language they do discuss, front, side, corner and rear yards, so I am not sure how that fits in to the picture.

I dealt with the zoning officer very respectfully and will continue to do so. I will also check with him about a variance, even though it probably isn't an option.

Just remember, I am using this forum as my "Scream at the World" board. I always make sure to conduct myself appropriately and respectfully, just as I was raised. But every now and then you need to scream and I figure some of you may feel my pain. Kind of like RVA, Recreational Vehicles Anonymous, except we all know each others names and where we live and what kind of dogs we have and where we like to go, etc.

I'm smiling on this end, please bear with me!!









Jason


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## Kenstand (Mar 25, 2004)

In my area I can only have the trailer in the driveway for 24 hours. Of course I have kept it there longer but usually only 2 or 3 days at a time. I can store it at home but it must be in the side or backyard. I do notice trailers, boats, work trailers and other vehicles in the front yard of houses in town. I think our city officials do not go looking for violators but only respond if neighbors complain.

Good luck with your situation but the regulations against parking in the front are probably common.


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## hurricaneplumber (Apr 12, 2004)

Jason,

Hopefully things work work in your favor.

We had the 'neighbor' issue at my house and my wife went the psycho crazy route and didn't exactly handle it in the most calm way. It became evident that no one will bother to help you when you balk at the rules and the people enforcing them. We lost the battle, the neighbor won. Then I got on the Zoning Board, funny how things work out









But since I believe in being the bigger person, I still shovel or snowblow their sidewalk if I have time. I think now they realize that they shouldn't of attacked us and had the situation happen like it did. Many things happened all due to lack of communication. We now have a 10 foot tall fence/hedge between our properties. Sad but reality of living in town.

I express my thoughts because every month I see folks come in front of the Board when they want something to benefit them and they start badmouthing the rules or people, it is hard for me to vote yes for someone like that, so usually they lose the battle.

Maybe a nice weekend morning chat with your neighbor lady and a explanation of how you use the camper and why it is parked there may alleviate some tension. She may think you have relaitves living in it. Tell her it is part of the growing and nurturing of your kids, or something.

Enough of my babbling, I'm done...

Good Luck

Kevin


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## BigBadBrain (Aug 26, 2004)

I'm pretty sure that many of us suffer from rules and regulations that force us to act in ways we resent. Most of the rules are endured easily enough but I too resent the restrictions on parking my camper. I can't put it in the driveway because of the slope so I park it on the street.

Last fall when we parked the Outback in front of our house while working on it to get some mods done, learn how to pack it and even spend some time in it, I knew it was a matter of time until I got the 'looks' or the casual 'nice trailer, where are you going to park it?' kind of remarks. Oddly enough, the most complaint-like comment came from another TT owner who lives a couple houses down. "Why do YOU get to park on the street when I can't?" I tried to explain that it was temporary and I had planned on parking at a storage area nearby ($55 per month - uncovered; storage for RVs is getting harder to find - a lot of RVs being sold these days). I got a letter from him two days later that was sent to the home owner's association as well.

So, I now pack a lunch, the tools, the camping gear, whatever I need and go do my work while parked at the storage area. There is a nice patch of grass, a tall fir tree for shade, a nice comfortable camp chair, and it is across from the firestation so there is even a little drama once in a while (scared the pants off me the first time those guys pulled out!)

I guess when we live in closely packed neighborhoods that afford friends for the kids (and us), infrequent traffic, and nice, well cared for homes, we end up making some compromises.

Pisses me off no end.

But that's just me.
BBB


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## Y-Guy (Jan 30, 2004)

Jason I don't have my Good Sam ID now but they have some items on their website, I'll post it and link here. If you are a member they might be a resource too.

Most of all we feel for you, feel free to vent anytime! - Good Luck.

Good Sam Club Parking Rights Website

*Parking Rights Checklist*
Now that you have read some Parking Rights cases and ordinances, please take a few minutes to review the information by completing this checklist. It will assist you in determining how to proceed with your RV parking rights problem. When you talk to your Parking Rights Advisory Council member, having this information handy will make it easier for him or her to assist you with your particular situation.

1. How did you first learn about the RV parking restrictions in your community?

2. Is there an existing ordinance or are your community leaders considering a new ordinance that would impose restrictions on RV parking?

3. Do you have a copy of the existing or proposed ordinance? If not, you can obtain one from your local government.

4. Have you or has anyone you know been cited for an illegally parked RV?

5. Is the purpose of the ordinance to remove RVs from city streets or from your property?

6. Are the restrictions being proposed for the purpose of aesthetics? If yes please click on the state of Ohio and read the Euclid case.

7. Are the restriction being proposed related to health, safety and welfare? If so, contact your local law enforcement and fire protection agencies to ask if there have been any problems concerning RVs in your community.


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## NDJollyMon (Aug 22, 2003)

Reading a thread like this makes me glad that I live where I live. I would hate to live where I couldn't mod or even load up my RV without nosy neighbors getting into MY BUSINESS.

Lowering values because of a brand new RV parked in front? Ridiculous. Maybe some property values are a little 'over inflated' in the first place.

The day someone says what I can and can't park on my own property...well...let's just say I'll be moving somewhere else.

In the meantime, my OUTBACK will be planted on the front of my driveway whenever I like.


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## dougdogs (Jul 31, 2004)

I wish I could get my trailer even close to my house. No problems with town officials or ordinances, there is just no way I can get a 5th near my house. A neighbor of mine has a 26' Wildwood in his yard, and has offered to let me keep mine there for a day or two (for loading or unloading) Another neighbor has a pop-up that is buried under about a ton of crap









Here is a picture of my front yard/driveway from another thread. Just too many trees in around my house to take something as tall as my 5th up my street.


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## rdowns (Oct 20, 2004)

When we were camping shopping and discussing lengths, my husband said I could get a bigger camper but we would have to park it somewhere else. This was _so_ not an option! I love having it here, then I can play in it etc. My camper is not visible from the street because of our layout. In our neighborhood the only thing that would get many complaints would be something pretty trashy,or something that blocked parking. Parking is VERY important around here. You can't park anything on the street for a long time because of the inevitable snow removal. These are blessings to living in this area, maybe we pay for it with decreased values, but to me that trade is worth it. 
Interestingly, on RVNET, there was a family that was selling their home and bought some rural property so they could park their 5er at their house! And I thought I was a fanatic!!!


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## NDJollyMon (Aug 22, 2003)

It's more about principal to me. Telling me what I can and can't do with my property.


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## Castle Rock Outbackers (Jan 18, 2004)

I guess rules and laws like this are meant to keep the most people happy. I love my house, and I love my Outback, but put them together, and the neighbors would not be happy. I don't really like the way it looks either:


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## vdub (Jun 19, 2004)

True story of ignorance and revenge.

Shortly, after moving to a neighborhood with many, many covenants in the DC area, my neighbor came over and asked me to stop mowing his lawn. The houses were very close together and I knew I was mowing a portion of his lawn, but figured that was a good neighborly thing to do. So I asked him where the line was -- he didn't know. That weekend I got out my deed and tape measure and started measuring it out and was able to find the survey marks on the sidewalk. Come to find out, about 2' of his driveway was on MY land. Looking at the deed closer, it did say something about an encroachment. My neighbor dug out his deed and it had the same wording. Encroachments are not unusual in these types of planned neighborhoods. It was no big deal to me, but the neighbor was mega unhappy. About a month later I come home from work and there were survey stakes all over the lawn. My neighbor had paid about $3,000 to verify the property line. Yeap, his driveway was 2' into my property. That next weekend the neighbor was out on his driveway with a concrete cutter chopping off that portion of the driveway. It looked ridiculous with a 10' wide driveway -- all because he didn't want me mowing any part of his lawn.

But, wait, there's more! The subdivision was built on several old farms and they had retained the windmills as sort of a symbol and had painted the town logo on the fantails. Being a farm boy, I thought that was kind of neat and I happened to have a model windmill (10' tall), so I made a stencil, painted the logo on the fan tail, and stuck the windmill in my backyard. I thought it was cool. Neighbor turned me in to the local covenant gestapo and I quickly got a nasty letter saying that the windmill did not conform and had to be removed. I was unhappy and neighbor was getting on my nerves, so I researched the covenants and discovered that I could have 18" high ornamental rocks anywhere on my property without getting any approvals. Remember the neighbor's driveway that is now narrower than most? I lined up my 18" high rocks (good solid granite) right next to his driveway. It was really hard for him to get in and out of his cars without smacking right into my ornamental rocks.


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## kjp1969 (Apr 25, 2004)

We live in a neighborhood where the only restriction is that RV's can't be parked on the street without a permit- permits are free and the Police will issue up to 7, 48-hour permits per month. We could park in the driveway- its long enough, barely- but would rather not look at the trailer all the time, and our neighbors wouldn't like it either. So, we pay for storage parking about 8 miles away.

Some of our neighbors have stuff in their driveways (garden trailers, boats, etc.) and its an eyesore. But they're still good neighbors, and we put up with their moderate clutter and they put up with ours. It makes for a friendly neighborhood. Absolutist positions like "no trailers at all" or "I'll park whatever I want, whenever I want" would just create unnecessary friction. Discretion is the better part of valor.

Kevin P.


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## missouricamper (Jun 28, 2004)

We have no ordinance and would perfectly legal keeping our camper in the driveway. However, our neighbors blew a gasket one day yelling about our camper that had been there almost 2 years! We couldn't believe they were so upset, and then didn't say anything. We moved it into storage the next day just to keep the peace. Non-covered storage was $75 month. We never see the neighbors and they have light blocking shades on that side of the house. I don't have a clue as to why it made any difference to them. Now the truck sits there, so I don't see a big diff except in my wallet.

I know that 1st time around wrote that original post a long time ago, but just in case you still need a place to park.... if you have any DoD ties, look into the MWR campgrounds and parking. Much less expensive if you have the ability to use them.


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## BigBadBrain (Aug 26, 2004)

Oooohhh... VDUB, I never thought to really look for loopholes. I'll bet there are some good ones if I look hard enough.









Ah, DW would never go for it even if I did find them.


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## 1stTimeAround (Sep 22, 2004)

Well, after a long day of frustration and thinking.... I am in full compliance with county ordinances and zoning requirements.

You got.....the 28RSS is in the street. I just don't see why this had to be a big deal. I respect every opinion that has been presented, including my own. When I bought the TT I paid $1500 to have an addition to my driveway and parked the TT directly against my 5 foot fence as to minimize the camper appearance. My house is white, just as the Outback and it really isn't an eyesore. Unfortunately, it is now, for neighbors that had no problem with where it was.

My wife and I are still discussing our options. It appears that storage around here is anything from $50-100 and all are within 10 minutes drive, however $1200 bucks a year is fairly steep when your already paying the bill for the camper. I have some friends with property so I may be able to move it amongst them and fortunately we have lots of trips planned this summer so we will be using it a lot.

Thank you all for being there to let me vent. I would give a million to see her face when she here's that I am legal to leave it in the street!! I guess the old saying, "Be careful what you wish for, you just might get it!" applies here. I am pretty sure she would have chosen the driveway over the street, especially since now the TT is more in front of her house than before.

Have a good one! Whew...after all this I need a beer!!

Jason


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## vdub (Jun 19, 2004)

Hmmmm, I think I'd go for the whole 6-pack.

Is there any chance at all of getting straight back into the yard behind the "backyard line"?


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## johnp (Mar 15, 2004)

I think because its legal to park in your street with over 700 menbers I think a rally one weekend on your street might change her mind







. I would also make sure she heres that turbo diesel idle for an hour each day at sunrise







.
I know thats not the way to handle it but I hate stupid rules and pain in the @#$ neighbors.Three rv's, boat,utility trailer, and a pool in over 14 years and no inspectors or complaints yet, I think I will stay.

John


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## jgerni (Nov 10, 2003)

Jason,

You are welcome to bring your Outback to my house and park it right beside mine. Mine could use a little company anyway.

Sorry your having to deal with these types of people I think its ridiculous

I don't have much to add but good luck in getting this resolved.

Josh


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## j1mfrog (Jun 6, 2004)

> In trying to prepare for what I guess is the inevitable, how much are you folks paying to store your TT? Do pay by the month, is there a contract involved? I know nothing about the storage industry.


To answer this question, I usually end up paying 5 or 6 cases of beer a year to store my Outback in my brothers yard.







I get to help them deposit the rent though.


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## camptails (Jan 18, 2005)

I too am suprised that you have gotten away with it as long as you have. My covenents state 24 hours only before and after trips. I knew it going in and would not want it any other way. I love my toys but that does not mean that my neighbors do too. I must pay for storage space for mine.

Camptails


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## hatcityhosehauler (Feb 13, 2004)

I know I'm jumping into this one late, but I hate to be left out. I tend to share Jolly's opinion on this one. It's my property, I pay the mortgage and the taxes, my neighbors shouldn't be allowed to tell me what I can and can't park on it.

As far as local laws, I actually don't know. There are others in the neighborhood that park their boats or RV's in thier driveways, so I just figured I would too. I did mention it to the next door neighbors, and they didn't have a problem with it. I guess they figured the camper looks better than the 20' shipping container that has been it the driveway for 15 months. I actually keep the camper in the back yard, partially behind the house during the winter, and when there is a long slack time between trips.

I think that if a neighbor had an issue, and they came to me first, and politely expressed their concerns, I would definately be more receptive to moving the trailer, or at least doing something to hide it better. But if you sneak around my back, and bring "the man" in to do your dirty work, then it's on, and I'm looking for loop holes like V-Dub.

I've rambled enough. Jason, one thing, I agree you probably wouldn't get your variance, since the neighbor who dimed you to the zoning board would get to speak against it, and usually, it only takes one disgruntled neighbor to stop that, unless of course it's the municipality that is filing for the variance. Then they just do what ever they want.....I'm rambling again, aren't I.....

Tim


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## NDJollyMon (Aug 22, 2003)

VDUB...great story. Love those rocks!

missouri...I keep my OUTBACK at the MWR lot for $5 month. I only use the driveway between trips, cleaning, modding, etc. Sometimes it's there quite awhile though.

Jason...
$1200 a year will buy you a year round campground spot on a lake up here! YIKES! I pay $60 per year. Double fenced, locked, and guarded by men with automatic weapons. A great deal...I think.


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## BigBadBrain (Aug 26, 2004)

Tim,
You sparked one with your comments - try this on:

We moved into the neighborhood in 1998. The covenants at the time were reviewed by the lawyers for the homowners assn. and found to be legally unenforceable. Naturally, the homeowners assn doesn't even exist without the covenants and has no authority without it so what do they do? They invent a set of covenants and pass them to all the homeowners after the lawyers bless them. We are all asked to vote on them - 54% approved them (I'll let you guess which side I chose) and so now we are legally bound by what half our neighbors decided should be the rules for our property.

As soon as our kids are out of school, we are out of this neighborhood. In the meantime, I will continue to "erect semipermanent or permanent structures over 6ft. in height" in my back yard and wait for the letters to flood in.

BBB

Oh, and I"m going to look intot he rules for parking on the street too.


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## Thor (Apr 7, 2004)

Took me awhile but I read the read topic. I am amazed that people actually complain about a new TT that costs more then most cars on the road!! I could understand if the TT was falling apart or it was under major construction..but it is a TT and is designed to be moved. I do not think TT in front of a house decreases propety valve. I think a messy weed infested lawn will actually do more harm.

I park my TT beside my house (Even built a special interlocking pad for it) for the winter months and I park it my driveway during the camping season. It is gone most weekends anyways (Love camping). So far no issues what so ever.

I have planted several trees in stragic places to hid the TT a bit but more so for protection.

Parking your TT beside your house and having a fence or shurbs that hide the TT a bit should be a reasonable solution.

Good luck.

Thor


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## HootBob (Apr 26, 2004)

I agree with Thor,
I'm glad we don't have any problems like that neighbors are pretty cool
We also park ours along the side of house all year long.
And anything like would happen to us, then look out.
Because we own a lot two doors down the street .
I will put a garage of it then & everyone could find another place to park their cars.
Don


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## dougdogs (Jul 31, 2004)

johnp2000 said:


> I think because its legal to park in your street with over 700 members I think a rally one weekend on your street might change her mind
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I like your devious mind!! I'm game to drive down from NJ for this one.

Not sure about running my diesel in the morning, but I have one!!


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## Y-Guy (Jan 30, 2004)

johnp2000 said:


> I would also make sure she heres that turbo diesel idle for an hour each day at sunrise


LOL I love it. We need a few of us Diesel guys to come over for an afternoon!


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## 1stTimeAround (Sep 22, 2004)

Let me see what kind of codes, zoning laws and ordinances there are and we might be able to put together the first annual.

OUTBACKERS STREET RALLY - MIDLOTHIAN STYLE!!!

Johnp2000, I LMAO when I read your reply last night. I woke my poor wife up from a dead sleep to read it to her, for some reason she didn't see the humor, go figure!!!

Thanks for the support guys!

Jason


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