# Mpg



## Airboss (Jul 14, 2007)

I have just over 8000mi on my truck and I was hoping that the MPG would start increasing by now. Typically diesels need 20,000mi to be considered fully broken-in and I guess that I may be a bit premature expecting better, but I was a little dissapointed at today's results. I recently calculated 14.9MPG. This was unloaded and mostly highway driving. The Lie-O-Meter told me I was getting 18MPG which I would have been okay with until I hand calculated 14.9.

I honestly believe that all the new emissions devices installed on my truck are killing my MPG. So many others have taken these devices off their new trucks (knowing that they are violating the law and terminating their warranties) and reporting 20+ MPG. I can't help but wonder if I should do the same. $1000 worth of new components may give me 5 or more MPGs! That's significant!!! I calculate that I can recover that investment in less than two years at the rate I use my truck.

So...what's a typical law abiding/tax paying/enviromentally-conscience (on a less than ideal income) civilian to do?


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## Fanatical1 (Jan 9, 2006)

Airboss,

Since you and I have similar trucks, I would like to ask a few questions......

Have you been hand checking your MPG regularly? Has this been the norm?

You said mostly highway on your 14.9 MPG. How much highway and how much city?
I get around 13 city and 18 highway so I could see how a mix could lower you to 14.9.

I also drive like I have an egg on the go pedal. Drive it harder and the MPG goes
down the tubes.

Maybe you had a regen cycle in this test, which would have lowered your MPG?

I noticed that a headwind can cause me to lose up to 2 MPG?

With all this said, I agree that the MPG with any of the new diesels are not nearly as good as
the "pre-emission" ones. If I could do it over again, I still would have chosen the 6.7. I think
it's a great set up with the 6 speed auto.

I haven't been following any of the mods they are doing on the new engines. Sounds
interesting if there are not too many negatives with the changes. I assume you lose your
warranty?

Mark


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## johnp (Mar 15, 2004)

I have an 07 with the old 5.9 4.10 4speed auto if I stay under 70 it has been getting 21.5mpg almost since I got it. Stop and go 14.5mpg and towing the beast at 63mph between 12 and 13.5 mpg. I have considered larger tires to knock the highway rpms down a hair god only knows its got more power than I need to tow with.

John


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## Airboss (Jul 14, 2007)

Fanatical1 said:


> You said mostly highway on your 14.9 MPG. How much highway and how much city?


Well, the last tank that I measured was 429 miles at 28.8 gallons. Of that, only 50 were city driving. That said, we had terrible winds last week and I expected a loss in MPGs, but not that much!!!

The people I've talked to that removed the emissions devices (DPF and ERG bypass - no tuners) are getting 19-20MPGs. It's hard to pass up that kind of savings.

When I bought my truck I had the choice of the 5.9 or 6.7. It was hard to pass up the 6-speed auto with the factory exhaust brake and we went with the 6.7. In hindsight, I think I would have gone with the 5.9.


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## prankster (Dec 20, 2007)

the real question is does it matter?you gotta drive and ya gotta tow.you wanna play ya gotta pay!!!and dont forget the prices are arising!!!!!


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## NJMikeC (Mar 29, 2006)

In my opinion these MPG #'s are all messed up because nobody's truck is broken in. Like you said you have only 8K on yours. That and mis-quoted MPG numbers might be the biggest lie of all time and don't believe what all the guys tell you that deleting the DPF will get you that farther down. Do the math yourself but I believe a 2 MPG change is like 2 gallons of fuel. Do you really think they needed 2 gallons during the re-gen? I sure hope not and if I was the engineer who came up with that I would say this is a non-starter.

Most of all MPG is in the foot. Having said that 14.9 is miserable for that truck. Tow with it, hot rod it, change the place you buy fuel from. Then un-plug the negative terminal on the batteries and from then on soft foot it while driving. That should help let it learn it's shift points when soft footing and you should be rewarded. Lastly remember that the cost of the mods isn't $1K but $1K + your warranty which might be $2K.That and when the mods screw your truck up who are you going to take it to then? Mods are mostly about the people who get rich selling them. For the rest, buyer beware unless your hobby is tinkering with that thing.


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## daves700 (Jun 12, 2006)

NJMikeC said:


> In my opinion these MPG #'s are all messed up because nobody's truck is broken in. Like you said you have only 8K on yours. That and mis-quoted MPG numbers might be the biggest lie of all time and don't believe what all the guys tell you that deleting the DPF will get you that farther down. Do the math yourself but I believe a 2 MPG change is like 2 gallons of fuel. Do you really think they needed 2 gallons during the re-gen? I sure hope not and if I was the engineer who came up with that I would say this is a non-starter.
> 
> Most of all MPG is in the foot. Having said that 14.9 is miserable for that truck. Tow with it, hot rod it, change the place you buy fuel from. Then un-plug the negative terminal on the batteries and from then on soft foot it while driving. That should help let it learn it's shift points when soft footing and you should be rewarded. Lastly remember that the cost of the mods isn't $1K but $1K + your warranty which might be $2K.That and when the mods screw your truck up who are you going to take it to then? Mods are mostly about the people who get rich selling them. For the rest, buyer beware unless your hobby is tinkering with that thing.


great response!
x 2


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## webeopelas (Mar 11, 2006)

johnp2000 said:


> I have an 07 with the old 5.9 4.10 4speed auto if I stay under 70 it has been getting 21.5mpg almost since I got it. Stop and go 14.5mpg and towing the beast at 63mph between 12 and 13.5 mpg. I have considered larger tires to knock the highway rpms down a hair god only knows its got more power than I need to tow with.
> 
> John


Doesn't work. Search the diesel forums and almost everybody who puts on bigger tires loses mpg. Greater rolling resistance overcomes the ratio advantage.


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## Sayonara (Jul 23, 2007)

daves700 said:


> In my opinion these MPG #'s are all messed up because nobody's truck is broken in. Like you said you have only 8K on yours. That and mis-quoted MPG numbers might be the biggest lie of all time and don't believe what all the guys tell you that deleting the DPF will get you that farther down. Do the math yourself but I believe a 2 MPG change is like 2 gallons of fuel. Do you really think they needed 2 gallons during the re-gen? I sure hope not and if I was the engineer who came up with that I would say this is a non-starter.
> 
> Most of all MPG is in the foot. Having said that 14.9 is miserable for that truck. Tow with it, hot rod it, change the place you buy fuel from. Then un-plug the negative terminal on the batteries and from then on soft foot it while driving. That should help let it learn it's shift points when soft footing and you should be rewarded. Lastly remember that the cost of the mods isn't $1K but $1K + your warranty which might be $2K.That and when the mods screw your truck up who are you going to take it to then? Mods are mostly about the people who get rich selling them. For the rest, buyer beware unless your hobby is tinkering with that thing.


great response!
x 2
[/quote]
Ditto X3

I cant complain about the MPG of mine 14 ish city/18 ish hwy. Ive always driven trucks and had this MPG. I have also read about thw DPF deletes and such. im not sold on them yet and im certainly not willing to risk my warranty on a $58k truck. Im certainly not happy about the fact that i bought diesel for $2.69/gal in nov and now ive seen it for $4.29. 4 months, come on. I know the MPG was not great, if that was a concern i would not have bought it. but nobody expected diesel to go up this much. thats a bummer. 
Good thing for me is i can drive my other car back and forth to work, but even that is going to be replaced with something even more fuel efficient.


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## GoVols (Oct 7, 2005)

Besides personal driving habits:

Don't forget winter blended fuel hurts mpg (1.0-1.5 mpg personal average).
Biodiesel hurts mpg (2 mpg by personal observation burning B20).
Clogged fuel filters hurt mpg (all it takes is one!)

And for some reason, some trucks off the production line get better or worse than others; call it 'personality'. Don't know why.

It's not a Dodge, but here are my averages since purchasing the truck July 2007 (I now have 12k miles on it.):
Best mileage: 21.5 mpg (all interstate 65-70 mph; unloaded)
Summer blend average 17.8 (mixed commuting + around town)
Winter blend average 16.5 (mixed commuting + around town)
Worst towing mileage: 12.5
Best towing mileage: 15.0

All of these mileages are better than my half ton 1500 gasser I traded in for the oil burner. (Mine is a pre-Jan 1st build 2007 model with no DPF.







)


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## Sayonara (Jul 23, 2007)

I keep hearing these "winter blend" folk lores. we will see, if my MPG gets better, that would be great !


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## MJRey (Jan 21, 2005)

Airboss,

I've also got a similar truck to yours except 2wd instead of 4wd and I've got just under 3,000 miles so far. I've been getting about 11 to 12 mpg towing and 16 to 18 the rest of the time. I can definitely tell when the regen is happening because the mileage drops dramatically. The emissions don't seem to affect the towing mileage very much since the EGT is high enough to keep from needing the active regen to clear out the diesel particulate filter (DPF). I got the truck primarily for towing the trailer and I don't use it much for other driving. I've been reading about the various DPF & EGR delete systems but I don't think I'll bother considering one until the warranty is up. By then there should be a lot more choices if I choose to go that route. For now I don't see a big benefit with my usage that is primarily towing. If I was driving the truck everyday and could get a 5 mpg increase I would definitely be thinking about dumping the DPF. The only thing I decided to try right now is a diesel fuel additive (Stanadyne Performance Formula) that a guy at work has been using on his 04 Dodge with the 5.9 motor. He said he got a slight boost in mileage and it seems to run a smoother with the new ULSD fuel. The information on the additive also claims to reduce the soot in the exhaust which might reduce the amount of stuff getting caught in the DPF. If there is a reduction in the soot going into the DPF it might reduce the number of regen cycles which would improve the mileage. I'll let you know if it makes any difference but it will take a while for me to tell.


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## vdub (Jun 19, 2004)

My mpg sucked until I hit about 25k miles. I have a 100% stock '05, 3500, 4x4. I routinely get 22mpg on the highway, 18 in the city, and 14.5 when towing. If I get less than 14mpg when towing, then it's been a really bad day. The best I ever got on one tank of fuel was 26mpg on a 70/30 mixtures of highway/city. What pushed it to that kind of mpg was that I had just put in a new fuel filter and air filter -- it made a huge difference. But like someone else said, I drive like I have an egg under my foot and I rarely go over 60 mph even when on the freeway, even when not towing.


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## mountainlady56 (Feb 13, 2006)

I checked with many dealers to see if "chips", "adjustments", etc., could increase the gas mileage on the diesel. Everyone I asked said "NO!" They also pointed out like someone mentioned, above, that none of the trucks, here are broken in, that it takes between 25K and 40K miles on a diesel to get the motor broken in to produce better MPG. 
Since I don't have my OB anymore, and don't plan on towing anything with diesel now $4.09/gal, I traded my "baby" in, last night, took a HUGE loss, and bought a small crossover vehicle with great crash test ratings, supposed to get good gas mileage, etc. Living in these mountains, and even "stepping on an egg" on the accelerator, the gas mileage went from avg. 18 MPG to 14-15, and that's a big expense when you have to drive so far to get to everything. Also, the winds are never completely still up here, I don't think!! Usually pretty gusty. 
I surely did hate to see it go, and I almost cried as I left the dealership, but I WILL be able to drive more and won't hurt myself climbing in/out of "Bessie". She surely will make someone a heck of a good truck, but I didn't want to fool with people coming to look at it, test-driving it, etc., as I don't have a hubby around....felt it was kinda risky.
I tried to keep the RPMs at 2K or less as much as possible.
Good luck!
Darlene


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## NJMikeC (Mar 29, 2006)

Winter Blend is not a folklore. It will cost you up to 2 MPG and is really noticeable if you do short trips and don't get the motor warmed up enough. Diesel's like heat.

Don't know about Fords but you can get a Winter Cover on the GM's and that helps with both heat and to a lesser degree mileage. I strongly suggest that and treat with Stanadyne. I do mine every other tankful. Guarantee you will see a difference in mileage from December versus July. Even getting into the high 40's now I'm back up around 16 MPG around town from around 15. From May on I'll get nearly 17 around town.


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## 1jeep (Jul 24, 2007)

i get 16.8mph highway and 12 in the city. i love hearin you diesel guys cry, i had a 96 CTD years ago and when the winter came fuel prices would sky rocket because of home heating fuel demands in the northeast. Back then i couldnt get more than 15mpg from that truck, i know my fathers 07 dmax gets about 15.5mpg empty and teh same 8mpg towing that i see from my tundra.

I cant wait for the warm weather when my gas mileage jumps up to 45mpg.....thats when i start riding my harley to work.


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## Sayonara (Jul 23, 2007)

NJMikeC said:


> Winter Blend is not a folklore. It will cost you up to 2 MPG and is really noticeable if you do short trips and don't get the motor warmed up enough. Diesel's like heat.
> 
> Don't know about Fords but you can get a Winter Cover on the GM's and that helps with both heat and to a lesser degree mileage. I strongly suggest that and treat with Stanadyne. I do mine every other tankful. Guarantee you will see a difference in mileage from December versus July. Even getting into the high 40's now I'm back up around 16 MPG around town from around 15. From May on I'll get nearly 17 around town.


I hope its not a folklore. i have no experience with it yet but everyone keeps telling me about the winter blend costing more and getting worse mileage. 
My 2008 F35 has the winter cover. i put it on when temps are below freezing. the manual says to remove it above 50 as it risks overheating the turbos.


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## Sayonara (Jul 23, 2007)

1jeep said:


> i love hearin you diesel guys cry,


its kind of like listeneing to the 1/2 ton guys realize they dont have the power or safety to pull their new trailer....







OH WAIT- I was one of them ! I made the switch and im glad i did.
I can understand the rise in gas prices TO A POINT. But soon we will see a $2.00 increase in diesel in about 6 months. That seems a little crazy. But i guess ill still buy it cause i love my truck.








hopefully it will go down in price a little and i can get some better mileage.


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## 1jeep (Jul 24, 2007)

Sayonara said:


> i love hearin you diesel guys cry,


its kind of like listeneing to the 1/2 ton guys realize they dont have the power or safety to pull their new trailer....







OH WAIT- I was one of them ! I made the switch and im glad i did.
I can understand the rise in gas prices TO A POINT. But soon we will see a $2.00 increase in diesel in about 6 months. That seems a little crazy. But i guess ill still buy it cause i love my truck.








hopefully it will go down in price a little and i can get some better mileage.
[/quote]
Touche...but soon i will driving a prius and camping in a tent.
seriously though, power is nto the issue...lack of cargo capacity, well thats a different story.


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## Lady Di (Oct 28, 2005)

I guess as long as we can afford it we will keep traveling, and pay the freight.

If it gets REALLY BAD, we can then get a seasonal site and use the Prius to go camping.









We all want to camp, which is why we got our campers.


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## Nathan (Jan 2, 2007)

NJMikeC said:


> Winter Blend is not a folklore. It will cost you up to 2 MPG and is really noticeable if you do short trips and don't get the motor warmed up enough. Diesel's like heat.
> 
> Don't know about Fords but you can get a Winter Cover on the GM's and that helps with both heat and to a lesser degree mileage. I strongly suggest that and treat with Stanadyne. I do mine every other tankful. Guarantee you will see a difference in mileage from December versus July. Even getting into the high 40's now I'm back up around 16 MPG around town from around 15. From May on I'll get nearly 17 around town.


The 08 Super Duty's now have a Winter Cover for the grill. I think it is now standard for Job 3 vehicles in the nothern climates.


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## Sayonara (Jul 23, 2007)

Nathan said:


> Winter Blend is not a folklore. It will cost you up to 2 MPG and is really noticeable if you do short trips and don't get the motor warmed up enough. Diesel's like heat.
> 
> Don't know about Fords but you can get a Winter Cover on the GM's and that helps with both heat and to a lesser degree mileage. I strongly suggest that and treat with Stanadyne. I do mine every other tankful. Guarantee you will see a difference in mileage from December versus July. Even getting into the high 40's now I'm back up around 16 MPG around town from around 15. From May on I'll get nearly 17 around town.


The 08 Super Duty's now have a Winter Cover for the grill. I think it is now standard for Job 3 vehicles in the nothern climates.
[/quote]
I took mine in and they added it for me, no charge. it is written in a TSB to do it in certain states. MI is one of them.


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## Fire44 (Mar 6, 2005)

I have gotten between 20 and 21 mpg running empty on the interstates. Normal driving (about 1.5 miles to and from work) I get around 14-15 mpg. Towing I run around 9-10 BUT I haven't towed the 5th wheel on any interstates. Almost all of our camping trips since we have gotten the 5th wheel have been in the mountains.

As for winter fuel, there is a difference, depending where you are. If you are in the south then there isn't much of a difference (if any) and the further north you go the more it changes. I lose mileage in the winter and it comes back in the summer. And as for the winter front....they do help get some of the mileage back AND it really helps getting the truck to warm up in the cold temps. But you have to be careful if you are in an area like Delaware where it is 20 one day and 60 the next, you have to keep an eye on the temp gauge. Of course you should avoid towing with the winter front.

Gary


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## timber (May 15, 2007)

Sayonara said:


> i love hearin you diesel guys cry,


its kind of like listeneing to the 1/2 ton guys realize they dont have the power or safety to pull their new trailer....







OH WAIT- I was one of them ! I made the switch and im glad i did.
I can understand the rise in gas prices TO A POINT. But soon we will see a $2.00 increase in diesel in about 6 months. That seems a little crazy. But i guess ill still buy it cause i love my truck.








hopefully it will go down in price a little and i can get some better mileage.
[/quote]

A side note to this string: I would suggest anyone with a diesel and using ULSD (we have no choice) also be adding an additive that lubricates. The sulfur that's removed from the fuel acts as a lubricant in the injection pump. Adding a lubricant will help reduce pump internal scoring and failure. I use a product from AMSoil... 1 oz treats 5 gal of fuel. Also, you could try adding some cetane to your tank if you have to burn winter mixed fuel. Cetane is to diesel what octane is to gasoline. At some point you'll have to balance the cost of the additives with the intended results. Me, I've done a lot of engine/transmission upgrades and plan to keep my truck for the long term, so I add them.

Ya, I own a diesel... but when I go to the pump and pay $4 + a gallon, I do it with style!!!









If your looking for a tuner for a Dodge diesel that leaves no footprint when removed from your ECM, check out the SMARTY. Great engineering - performs as advertised - fantastic support. Click here....


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## Sayonara (Jul 23, 2007)

Thats good to know! Thanks!


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## Collinsfam_WY (Nov 9, 2006)

Airboss - for some reason I thought I had seen you post over on cumminsforum.com. Go check it out if you haven't. Your mpg is right in the average range for what the 6.7 guys are seeing. The aftermarket is working hard on dpf delete systems. There are some out now but will throw a code unless you use something like an Edge juice with Attitude which will remove the code on engine start. Those folks are saying that the 6.7's get 20+mpg with the delete systems, programmer and EGR blocked.

These folks seem to have the best system at the moment as far as I can tell. BADP

There is a ton of info on dpf delete systems and the 6.7 over here 6.7 Forum

Good luck

-CC


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## Airboss (Jul 14, 2007)

collinsfam_tx said:


> Airboss - for some reason I thought I had seen you post over on cumminsforum.com. Go check it out if you haven't. Your mpg is right in the average range for what the 6.7 guys are seeing. The aftermarket is working hard on dpf delete systems. There are some out now but will throw a code unless you use something like an Edge juice with Attitude which will remove the code on engine start. Those folks are saying that the 6.7's get 20+mpg with the delete systems, programmer and EGR blocked.
> 
> These folks seem to have the best system at the moment as far as I can tell. BADP
> 
> ...


Yup, I'm sure you saw me there. I lurk around mostly and only post once in a while. It's a different scene, but still good guys just wanting to help one another and I really like that.

I checked out your thread on towing with the new TV. Someone mentioned for you to get en Equal-I-zer for your combo, but I caution you to wait just a bit. Colorada~dirtbikers (Carey) recommended something a little different to me and I'm gonig to check it out soon - maybe in the next month or so. Here's a link to the post if you are interested in the discussion. Since it is a new product that no one on this site is using I will be making a full review once I've had time to get acquainted with it.

Cheers!


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## Collinsfam_WY (Nov 9, 2006)

Airboss said:


> Airboss - for some reason I thought I had seen you post over on cumminsforum.com. Go check it out if you haven't. Your mpg is right in the average range for what the 6.7 guys are seeing. The aftermarket is working hard on dpf delete systems. There are some out now but will throw a code unless you use something like an Edge juice with Attitude which will remove the code on engine start. Those folks are saying that the 6.7's get 20+mpg with the delete systems, programmer and EGR blocked.
> 
> These folks seem to have the best system at the moment as far as I can tell. BADP
> 
> ...


I checked out your thread on towing with the new TV. Someone mentioned for you to get en Equal-I-zer for your combo, but I caution you to wait just a bit. Colorada~dirtbikers (Carey) recommended something a little different to me and I'm gonig to check it out soon - maybe in the next month or so. Here's a link to the post if you are interested in the discussion. Since it is a new product that no one on this site is using I will be making a full review once I've had time to get acquainted with it.

Cheers!
[/quote]

...not sure who this is for. A new TV is just a far away dream for me but I do love my Equalizer on my '02 F150









-CC


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## Sayonara (Jul 23, 2007)

Airboss said:


> Airboss - for some reason I thought I had seen you post over on cumminsforum.com. Go check it out if you haven't. Your mpg is right in the average range for what the 6.7 guys are seeing. The aftermarket is working hard on dpf delete systems. There are some out now but will throw a code unless you use something like an Edge juice with Attitude which will remove the code on engine start. Those folks are saying that the 6.7's get 20+mpg with the delete systems, programmer and EGR blocked.
> 
> These folks seem to have the best system at the moment as far as I can tell. BADP
> 
> ...


Yup, I'm sure you saw me there. I lurk around mostly and only post once in a while. It's a different scene, but still good guys just wanting to help one another and I really like that.

I checked out your thread on towing with the new TV. Someone mentioned for you to get en Equal-I-zer for your combo, but I caution you to wait just a bit. Colorada~dirtbikers (Carey) recommended something a little different to me and I'm gonig to check it out soon - maybe in the next month or so. Here's a link to the post if you are interested in the discussion. Since it is a new product that no one on this site is using I will be making a full review once I've had time to get acquainted with it.

Cheers!
[/quote]
So Airboss, are you going to get that hitch?


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## Airboss (Jul 14, 2007)

Sayonara said:


> So Airboss, are you going to get that hitch?


Yes. I'm getting the High Performance Reese SC instead of the Pro Series SC that Carey mentioned. They are practically the same except that the High Performance model has tapered spring bars: "This system is the same as the Pro Series SC, however it utilizes tapered spring bars. Tapered bars provide superior weight distribution performance over uneven roads and in various weather conditions while also putting less strain on the vehicle."

I promise to write a review once I get it, maybe in the next month or so.


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## Sayonara (Jul 23, 2007)

Airboss said:


> So Airboss, are you going to get that hitch?


Yes. I'm getting the High Performance Reese SC instead of the Pro Series SC that Carey mentioned. They are practically the same except that the High Performance model has tapered spring bars: "This system is the same as the Pro Series SC, however it utilizes tapered spring bars. Tapered bars provide superior weight distribution performance over uneven roads and in various weather conditions while also putting less strain on the vehicle."

I promise to write a review once I get it, maybe in the next month or so.
[/quote]
Intersting. This looks top be a really good alternative to the Equil-i-zer. It uses brake pad material on the friction surfaces increasing the friction 10x. might be just what we need. I dont want anyone to think i am unhappy with the EQ hitch, i have just noticed a lower effectiveness of the sway control when i switched from a 1/2 ton to a 1-ton due to less pressure on the bars.


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