# Wanna-be Outback Owner Seeking Best So Cal Deal



## sjredburn (Oct 18, 2006)

Hi All,

I'm a newbie here (and to non-boat trailering in general) so I have lots of questions to ask. After visiting the Pomona, Calif RV show this last weekend and gaining a weath of information from several very knowledgable Keystone Outback manufacturer reps, the wife and I have zeroed in either the Outback 21rs or 23rs as our first trailer purchase. It's just us two and two dogs but we like the flexibility of both models. I favor the larger front bed for adult guests and pass-through outside storage of the 23rs and the wife likes the cargo door, lower weight and shorter length of the 21rs. Our Ram 1500 (w/Hemi) TV should be able to handle either and pricing is only $500 apart so neither is a factor.

The problem we are facing is that pricing in CA is WAY higher than back east and even with the "RV show" discount of about $2k we are looking at spending around $22k + tax and extras - a bit more than our original budget.

Could someone from the So Cal contingent (we're in "The OC") help a future brother out by pointing us in the right direction? We've looked at the used market without much success and don't mind a substantial drive if the deal is right. We would prefer to start new rather than inherit someone else's problems but we're open to all ideas, even buying back east and paying for shipping.

Mike Thompson RV, the Outback mega-dealer in our area, would love our business and it would simplify our service needs but at the very least I need some leverage to squeeze the best deal out of them.

With the right deal in place we're ready to "pull the trigger" and join the Outback owners fellowship so well represented here.

Thanks in advance for your suggestions!


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## aplvlykat (Jan 25, 2004)

M. Thompson will deal a little but you will have better luck getting them to include the other parts as part of the deal. The way I did it was to say, Yes I will pay your price but you pay the taxes, fee's. They told me they couldn't so I started to walk and by the time I got to the door they adjusted their price. What I didn't do was to get the hitch or contoller that was best for my setup they did include them with the deal but a lower grade unit. If I had to do it again I would have told them taxes, fee's, prodigy brake controller, reese dual cam hitch. Thats just the way I did it and it worked. Prices are just more out here because of shipping cost. Good luck, Kirk


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## Beerman (Nov 14, 2005)

Stacey,

I bought my 23RS from Lakeshore RV in Michigan. It was a lot cheaper than my Stier's RV in Bakersfield. They wouldn't budge one bit on price. I called Marci and she was very easy to work with, to easy. They delivered the trailer to my door in four days, it would have been sooner but storms slowed them down. The only downside is the service side. Most dealers won't pay much attention if you didn't buy from them. There are authorized service centers that I'm sure would love to handle most issues. Call Lakeshore and see what they can do. You will be shocked at their price compared to the prices in CA.

P.S. I had never owned a TT either. Stick around, you WILL learn a lot of things.

Beerman


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## MattS (Oct 15, 2006)

We bought ours this week at the same show- we're picking it up on Saturday. We got the 25RSS. My best advice is KEEP WORKING on them. They can go much lower on that trailer, if they want to I would imagine. Our total after taxes etc was less than what they asking you for the base price. It took us literally 6 hours of back and forth to the price we wanted. The whole sales thing is no fun, but it can work out. Get a quote from another dealer like Lake shore- get their number and go from there. We basically got that price, then figured in shipping cost or our cost to go get it and that was what we wanted to pay. We found the trailer for about $17 then if you add in the shipping it would have been about $2700- we got it from MT for less than that.


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## campmg (Dec 24, 2005)

I'm in AZ and also experience higher prices but $22k seems high. We have a "local" dealer that had the 21RS around $19,000 but I went to the dealer (Ruthrauff) in Tucson for savings on my 25RSS. See what Lakeshore can do but remember to add in shipping costs of around $1.25 / mile. They still come out cheaper.


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## Mgonzo2u (Aug 3, 2004)

aplvlykat said:


> M. Thompson will deal a little but you will have better luck getting them to include the other parts as part of the deal. The way I did it was to say, Yes I will pay your price but you pay the taxes, fee's. They told me they couldn't so I started to walk and by the time I got to the door they adjusted their price. What I didn't do was to get the hitch or contoller that was best for my setup they did include them with the deal but a lower grade unit. If I had to do it again I would have told them taxes, fee's, prodigy brake controller, reese dual cam hitch. Thats just the way I did it and it worked. Prices are just more out here because of shipping cost. Good luck, Kirk


Stacey,

In August of 2004, we bought our 2005 OB 21RS from MT in Fountain Valley for the negotiated price of $17.5K (using Lakeshore RV's price point as my base). In that negotiated price, the only add on I had them give me was a 2nd 12V battery set up. On top of that, I talked them down to $500 for the extended warranty they wanted $1500(?) for. I closed the deal to finance $18K with them.

We bought in August which is what So Cal RV dealers would consider 'high' season. If I was able to get that reasonable price in the 'high' season of sales, if you hold out until the rains start, you should have pretty good luck in getting them to accept your terms.

Just my $0.02.

Good luck.


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## sjredburn (Oct 18, 2006)

Beerman,

Since I'm looking at the same model as yours I'd love to hear about the deal that Marci at Lakeshore gave you (is it possible to be TOO easy?). Obviously, you felt it was good enough to accept the future service issues. I can't believe they can deliver a trailer that fast! Was it towed or trucked? How about sales tax...did you avoid paying taxes (other than DMV) buying out of state?

Thanks for your insight!

Stacey



Beerman said:


> Stacey,
> 
> I bought my 23RS from Lakeshore RV in Michigan. It was a lot cheaper than my Stier's RV in Bakersfield. They wouldn't budge one bit on price. I called Marci and she was very easy to work with, to easy. They delivered the trailer to my door in four days, it would have been sooner but storms slowed them down. The only downside is the service side. Most dealers won't pay much attention if you didn't buy from them. There are authorized service centers that I'm sure would love to handle most issues. Call Lakeshore and see what they can do. You will be shocked at their price compared to the prices in CA.
> 
> ...


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## the eubies (Sep 7, 2006)

Welcome to the forum.

We too are in CA and are looking at trailers. The prices people have paid in other states are so much better than what I hear in CA. I hate the thought of paying too much. I want to buy used or may go out of state. I am not in a hurry.

SIX HOURS of negotiating







, I would probably die of a heart attack. Maybe I will have to just send my husband to go get one and don't ask him the price...neither one of us is a good haggler.

I believe sales tax is paid at the rate the county you live in charges.

Good Luck to you.

The Eubies


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## MattS (Oct 15, 2006)

> SIX HOURS of negotiating


With a 2 year old in tow, no less


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## mlp05 (Sep 27, 2006)

I bought my 23krs from Marci at lakeshore saved $8,000.00 dollars even after shipping to california.Was a very smooth transaction.I tried useing lakeshores price as leverage from local dealer but they would not budge.MP


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## out4fun (Aug 22, 2006)

Hi Stacey R

alot of the members of this forum have had good luck and got agreat price from lakeshore Rv in MI.

Angelo


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## sjredburn (Oct 18, 2006)

Geez...the more I hear about this Marci at Lakeshore the more I like her! But $8k savings even after shipping costs? My wife would worship me if could save that much on a deal - even if it meant going out of state.

magg - I know the 23krs is more than the 23rs, but what - if you don't mind me asking - did you actually pay for it?

Thanks for all the responses. You people are awesome!

Stacey



magg said:


> I bought my 23krs from Marci at lakeshore saved $8,000.00 dollars even after shipping to california.Was a very smooth transaction.I tried useing lakeshores price as leverage from local dealer but they would not budge.MP


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## SmkSignals (May 2, 2005)

If you can, wait until the last day of the month. You will save even more money. Every sales person I know wheels and deals on the last day of the month to reach quota, bonus's, sales spiff's, ect.ect.ect... You gotta stand strong and be ready to pull the trigger though ... Good luck !!


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## MattS (Oct 15, 2006)

I think what finally clinched it for them meeting our price was when they realized we had absolutely no problem driving to MI to get the trailer for a better price.


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## sjredburn (Oct 18, 2006)

SmkSignals said:


> If you can, wait until the last day of the month. You will save even more money. Every sales person I know wheels and deals on the last day of the month to reach quota, bonus's, sales spiff's, ect.ect.ect... You gotta stand strong and be ready to pull the trigger though ... Good luck !!


Oh, I can "wheel and deal" with the best of them...but only when I know as much or more than the salesperson I'm dealing with! That's why I'm asking the experts on both sides of the table. Timing, knowledge, and good acting abilities are the keys to a fair deal. Working for a wine & spirits distributor for 21 years has taught me to be prepared and be ready to close the deal.

I've always done well in car and truck shopping but I've got a lot to learn about buying a travel trailer...so I really appreciate the advice!









Stacey


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## Swany (Mar 2, 2006)

Stacey R said:


> Hi All,
> 
> I'm a newbie here (and to non-boat trailering in general) so I have lots of questions to ask. After visiting the Pomona, Calif RV show this last weekend and gaining a weath of information from several very knowledgable Keystone Outback manufacturer reps, the wife and I have zeroed in either the Outback 21rs or 23rs as our first trailer purchase. It's just us two and two dogs but we like the flexibility of both models. I favor the larger front bed for adult guests and pass-through outside storage of the 23rs and the wife likes the cargo door, lower weight and shorter length of the 21rs. Our Ram 1500 (w/Hemi) TV should be able to handle either and pricing is only $500 apart so neither is a factor.
> 
> ...


Get on the internet and draft a list of Outback dealers. Call them all. when I bought mine I priced it is 11 Western states. Ended up paying 3k less than the local dealer (Tacoma RV). I traveled 200 miles and made a trip out of it. Be advised that some dealers will refuse to do your warranty work if you didn't buy from them (like TAcoma RV).


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## louvel1 (Jun 9, 2006)

Stacey, I bought my 2006 23krs from Mike Thompson about 6 months ago. I called them over the phone and asked how close they could match lakeshore, the sales guy said it was impossible to match. After going back and forth on the phone I told the sales guy that I was ready to buy NOW! but I had a trip scheduled to visit family in Michigan. I told him that I understood they couldnt match lakeshore but if he could get close to the lakeshore price I would buy from him otherwise I would just pick one up when I went to Michigan and I would tow it back. Bottom line is that the 23krs was listed at 23,995 and I got it for 19,500. It took a little bluffing but you got to do what you got to do. In addition if they still have 06 models left, I guarantee you they will want to work with you. They will try everything to get you at full pop but dont let them.


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## N7OQ (Jun 10, 2006)

I bought my 23RS from a Sacramento Dealer and got it cheaper that what Lakeshore could ship one to me. I can now get the warranty work done locally. I have seen more than one post of people who bought out of state and could not get warranty work done, something to think about.


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## NJMikeC (Mar 29, 2006)

Stacy,

In all seriousness be prepared to fix your trailer your self if you buy from Lakeshore. I did and would recommend it to anybody as long as they have the aptitude to repair them. It isn't hard either.

Also I can tell you this. NO DEALER ON GODS GREAT EARTH IS WORTH $4K, $3K even $2K. For instance go ahead and ask your dealer to justify the high price in terms of value to you. IT CAN"T BE DONE.

Get the best price and deal with it.

I have a little twist on how to buy from Lakeshore. I likely beat everybody's price but you have to PM me to find out how I did it.

Mike C


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## Loving_Our_Outback (Aug 15, 2006)

Two months ago I purchased our 2007 (25RSS) from Holeman RV, in Ohio for $16,295.00.

I then went on the internet and purchased a Stabilizer distribution hitch for $399.00 free shipping and a Prodigy brake controller for $99.00 free shipping.

When the hitch and brake controller arrived I installed both of them along with an additional transmission filter and temp gauge that I also purchased off the internet.

Then over a 3 day weekend I made the 750 mile trip from Tulsa to Ohio to pick it up. On a Friday I drove to Ohio and spent the night in the trailer on the dealer lot, they are set up to due this and encourage it.

The next morning we did the walk thru at 8:00am and by 10:00am I was on my way home.

Friday night I attached the equalizer brackets to the trailer and tested my setup on the lot. Saturday morning they had a guy their that I guess thought he had an equalizer setup to due and changed some of the setting, I am not sure they did me any good.

Spent the night Saturday night in a KOA right off the highway and by Sunday noon I was home.

Estimated cost for gas, KOA and food $350.00. So end of day $17,143.00 plus Oklahoma tax when I put the title in my name $550.00 = $17,693.00.

Now I must point out that when I went to pick it up I even tried to get them to throw in some extra and when they looked at what I was paying $16,295.00 they did not believe they had agreed to that price for a 2007 which by the way should not have the delamination problems or so I am told. The trailer had just arrived on their lot and was just 2 weeks old.

I also do not know what the price difference is between the 23 models and the 25 but you should be able to use this as a guide.


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## Beerman (Nov 14, 2005)

Stacey,

It was real easy. Marci was great. I saved about $4,000 from having it delivered to me. They tow the TT, not trailer it. So it does put on a couple tousand miles before you take delivery. they give you a real quick run down on the TT systems. You can learn alot reading and participating in this community. I can tell you that there wasn't anything wrong with my TT when it arrived. The service techs told me that they get compensated when they fix things on the TT before delivery. So it is in their best interest to find them and fix them. Call Lakeshore and see what they can get it to you for.

Taxes, you pay CA sales tax. When you buy from Michigan you can pay their sales tax. It then gets credited to CA and then you pay the difference. So I think I paid 6% in Michigan, when I registered the TT I had to pay 1.5% more for CA. I think there might be ways around the taxes if you buy in Arizona or something. I didn't care, I still saved thousands.

I love my Outback, my kids love the Outback, my dog even loves the Outback.

Beerman


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## dmichaelis (Jun 13, 2006)

Welcome to the forum. My wife shopped around for our TT. We have a 29bhs. Mike Thompson's was asking $29,000 for it we found it on the internet from Lakeshore for $17,500 with taxes and shipping it was going to be $20,000. We went in to Mike Thompson's and showed them the info we pulled off the internet. At first they where stating no way and pretended like they were calling the factory rep and talking about litigation. Putting on an entertaining show. They came back and stated that they couldn't meet that price. We got up and started to walk out and they came back and met that price plus a thousand dollars. They also took trades. So I traded in my Harley and a 27 foot sailboat. I got what I paid for each of them so I left there happy and feeling that I got a good deal. I have had to bring it in for service once and Rik was great at the Fountain Valley location. We had a deadbolt that was not releasing on the main door and he had it fixed within minutes and changed the locks so that one key worked for all the door locks.

Enjoy your new Outback.


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## Mgonzo2u (Aug 3, 2004)

Also remember the rule of thumb regarding MSRP sticker on trailers, you can generally expect to talk down that number about 25%.

Some say 30% but that would have to be on a very good day.


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## MattS (Oct 15, 2006)

> Some say 30% but that would have to be on a very good day.


 Yeah, I was going to say maybe try at 30%.


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## ED_RN (Jun 25, 2006)

Stiers won't deal on the price, free propane for a year isn't worth a couple thousand dollars. If want to look at mike Thompson try going on line to get a quote. The "fleet manager" will reply back and the price he quoted me was several thousand less than what they wanted when we went onto the lot to look.


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## splashmountainers (Oct 25, 2006)

I'm in the San Francisco Bay Area and I'm selling a 28BH 2003 (bought new in 2004) and it is impeccable! Only used 8 times!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! $13,500 if you're looking for used. Just thought I'd throw it out there to ya. Best of luck -- and Outbacks are great and this place is a SERIOUS wealth of information!


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## sjredburn (Oct 18, 2006)

bobandkate said:


> I'm in the San Francisco Bay Area and I'm selling a 28BH 2003 (bought new in 2004) and it is impeccable! Only used 8 times!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! $13,500 if you're looking for used. Just thought I'd throw it out there to ya. Best of luck -- and Outbacks are great and this place is a SERIOUS wealth of information!


bobandkate,

Sounds like a sweet deal but that's more trailer than we wanted for our first trailer purchase.
Thanks for your response though...I sure someone who needs the extra bunk space will snap it up soon!

Stacey


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## campmg (Dec 24, 2005)

Stacey R said:


> Oh, I can "wheel and deal" with the best of them...but only when I know as much or more than the salesperson I'm dealing with!
> Stacey


That shouldn't be hard.


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## sjredburn (Oct 18, 2006)

Hello Everyone,

While I'm continuing to pursue a fair deal on a new 21/23rs I thought I'd ask those with more experience shopping used online which sites would be the best to monitor for deals on "pre-owned" Outbacks. I check here frequently of course and also on RV Trader Online but when it comes to E-Bay and Craig's List I'm a novice. Are there other sites I should be monitoring?

I could kick myself for missing a great 21rs deal on RV Trader Online a few weeks ago when I waited to tell the wife before calling and returned the next day to find the ad pulled and the trailer sold. I hadn't thought to jot the number down the day before. Dooohhh!

Why does it seem that all the hot (new & used) deals are east of the Rockies?









Again, thanks for your valuable input!

Stacey


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## 3LEES (Feb 18, 2006)

Stacey R said:


> Why does it seem that all the hot (new & used) deals are east of the Rockies?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


The grass is always greener on the other side...

Dan


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## castalos (Oct 22, 2006)

You should be able to get it at about 25% off retail. Start your bid at 30% off to give you some room to go up. End of the month & end of the year is the best time to deal. We bought our unit in December, 3 days before they ended sales for the holidays and said we'd take delivery before the end of the year (they were open for a few days at the end of Dec.)

We just decided that we'd take it if they gave it to us at $xx price, otherwise we'd keep looking. They tried to remove some of the things we wanted (like swapping a jacknife sofa for a sofabed) and we said, nope. They ended up coming right down to our price.

Since this was our first purchase of a trailer, we didn't know to specify EXACTLY what brand we wanted of a brake controller, hitch, etc. So do your research on that before dealing.

ps. This was in Reno, NV - not in So Ca. But Reno isn't that far away from you.
-Coleen


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## cookie9933 (Feb 26, 2005)

Stacey R said:


> Why does it seem that all the hot (new & used) deals are east of the Rockies?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Because practically all RVs are manufactured east of the Rockies, mostly in Indiana. Seems I recall that Fleetwood and a few others are made in the west, but not many.

Bill


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