# F-150 Is He Big Enough?



## intruder (Aug 4, 2008)

HI gang, I'm new and not very good in english but I like your forum and i have a question for you









i have a F-150 4x4 king-cab 2004 Heritage with a 4.6L, and i look for a 23 KRS to put in my bike ( weight 800 pounds) and i like to know if my truck is big enough! thanks

please, write slowly,,, I read not very fast!!!


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## NHRA Larry (Jan 30, 2008)

It may work for you. I tow a 30rls with a dodge 1500 (w/hemi). My combination almosts hits the towing limits on the truck. I did in fact make some changes to insure the combo works. The biggest was I had to install "LT" rated 10 ply tires and got rid of the "P" rates tires (which elimated the sway issue), I also installed a "superchip" which changed the the computer setting when in tow mode. I installed a hitch on the back of the TT which I run a small M/C carried off the back of the TT (w/my pit scooter).

It may take some trial and error, playing with different combos, but it should work for you. The general mindset is that you have to have a 3/4 ton dissel to haul a tt, but with the price of fuel, I can't justify the benefits of a bigger truck vs the cost to upgrade.

NHRA Larry


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## jasonrebecca (Oct 30, 2007)

With the 4.6 I am not sure if you will have enough power/torque.
I have the 5.4 and long and/or steep grades I struggle with my 21rs.
I would be more concerned about the tongue weight with the bike up front.


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## Nathan (Jan 2, 2007)

the toy haulers have very heavy tounge wieghts. The TT length should be ok, but you will likely be pushing it on weights. I think the 23krs loaded tips in at 1000-1200lb tounge weight which will about max out your truck. Were you planning on putting stuff in the bed?


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## skippershe (May 22, 2006)

Hi intruder









I just wanted to add.....

Welcome to Outbackers!


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## Grunt0311 (Aug 23, 2005)

NHRA Larry said:


> It may work for you. I tow a 30rls with a dodge 1500 (w/hemi). My combination almosts hits the towing limits on the truck. I did in fact make some changes to insure the combo works. The biggest was I had to install "LT" rated 10 ply tires and got rid of the "P" rates tires (which elimated the sway issue), I also installed a "superchip" which changed the the computer setting when in tow mode. I installed a hitch on the back of the TT which I run a small M/C carried off the back of the TT (w/my pit scooter).
> 
> It may take some trial and error, playing with different combos, but it should work for you. The general mindset is that you have to have a 3/4 ton dissel to haul a tt, but with the price of fuel, I can't justify the benefits of a bigger truck vs the cost to upgrade.
> 
> NHRA Larry


First off, welcome to the site Intruder







. I hope you find the site useful and fun to be on.

Secondly, I have to disagree that the general mindset is that you need a 3/4 ton with a diesel to tow a tt. The mindset is that you need to have a truck that you can tow a tt within the weight limitations. Diesel has nothing to do with it. Sorry to be blunt, but putting LT tires on your truck does not increase its towing capacity, neither does having a computer chip in it. All that does is give you more power for the hills. It doesn't help with the weight or control/stopping with a tt. I have a hard time believing that you are within the weight capacities of your rear axle, payload, and towing with a trailer that big. Especially when you figure the weight of all the stuff in it, generator, scooter, people in the truck, etc. I'm not saying everyone needs to have a 3/4 ton to tow any travel trailer, just that some trailers are too big for 1/2 ton trucks.

Bill


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## intruder (Aug 4, 2008)

thank you every body!
thats confirm what i was thinking, it's limit







but not impossible.
i got to have a good reflexion about it!!

thanks again!


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## HDOutbackers (Feb 28, 2008)

Check out Fords website as well. You can search using 2004 Ford Truck Towing. It will give you specifics about your vehicle based on engine size, axel ratio, etc. It is a VERY useful tool!

Good luck and welcome to the site.

VICTIM


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## intruder (Aug 4, 2008)

intruder said:


> Check out Fords website as well. You can search using 2004 Ford Truck Towing. It will give you specifics about your vehicle based on engine size, axel ratio, etc. It is a VERY useful tool!
> 
> Good luck and welcome to the site.
> 
> VICTIM


Hey, you looks have the same bike as mine, FLHTC if i'm right? is it not a good way of life ?, good bike, good trailer








tanks for the idea to looks fords website!
[/quote]


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## russlg (Jul 21, 2008)

intruder said:


> HI gang, I'm new and not very good in english but I like your forum and i have a question for you
> 
> 
> 
> ...


First off, unless it is a _Supercab_ it is not a 2004 F150 Heritage. They did not have a _king-cab (aka Supercrew, 4 full doors)_ in the 2004 F150 Heritage model line-up. They did have a _king-cab (aka Supercrew, 4 full doors)_ in the "New" redesigned 2004 F150. So the question becomes which model do you really have. The VIN would tell me right off the bat. I work for a Ford dealer.


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## intruder (Aug 4, 2008)

russlg said:


> HI gang, I'm new and not very good in english but I like your forum and i have a question for you
> 
> 
> 
> ...


First off, unless it is a _Supercab_ it is not a 2004 F150 Heritage. They did not have a _king-cab (aka Supercrew, 4 full doors)_ in the 2004 F150 Heritage model line-up. They did have a _king-cab (aka Supercrew, 4 full doors)_ in the "New" redesigned 2004 F150. So the question becomes which model do you really have. The VIN would tell me right off the bat. I work for a Ford dealer.
[/quote]

king cab, mean 2 real doors with 2 little doors, not 4 full size doors like a crew cab.
and it's really a 2004 heritage 2004 with a 6'5'' box .

he suppose to be able to tow 6500 pounds, and the 23klr's weight is around 5100 pounds , that's wy i'm thinking it's border line but not impossible ( may be after modifing few things will be better)


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## HDOutbackers (Feb 28, 2008)

Add the 1000lbs of the FLHTC, plus the weight of your camping stuff and you are very near the capacity of the Model year F150.

My 02 F150 had a 6900lb capacity and a tongue weight limit of 500 lbs. I decided against trying to tow bike and trailer with a 150.


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## russlg (Jul 21, 2008)

intruder said:


> HI gang, I'm new and not very good in english but I like your forum and i have a question for you
> 
> 
> 
> ...


First off, unless it is a _Supercab_ it is not a 2004 F150 Heritage. They did not have a _king-cab (aka Supercrew, 4 full doors)_ in the 2004 F150 Heritage model line-up. They did have a _king-cab (aka Supercrew, 4 full doors)_ in the "New" redesigned 2004 F150. So the question becomes which model do you really have. The VIN would tell me right off the bat. I work for a Ford dealer.
[/quote]

king cab, mean 2 real doors with 2 little doors, not 4 full size doors like a crew cab.
and it's really a 2004 heritage 2004 with a 6'5'' box .

he suppose to be able to tow 6500 pounds, and the 23klr's weight is around 5100 pounds , that's wy i'm thinking it's border line but not impossible ( may be after modifing few things will be better)
[/quote] According to the 2004 Ford Towing guide, page 18:

https://www.fleet.ford.com/showroom/rv_trai...04/2004_All.pdf

You can Tow between 5500 and 6500 lbs. That ASSUMES you have the FACTORY INSTALLED tow package. In my opinion, this vehicle is undersized to to the Outback 23KRS AND the Motorcycle.


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## intruder (Aug 4, 2008)

big thanks, russlq for the info!

thats confirm the 6500 pounds for my pick-up , and I see it's too short with the 23 krs. but I'm asking another question if I install an air system, is that give me enough capacity?


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## Collinsfam_WY (Nov 9, 2006)

The only thing I know of that will solve your weight problem is this.

www.hitchhog.com

I have the 5.4l version of your 4.6l motor. The "Heritage" is the older version of the F150 like mine which means you have the 2 valve motor like I do. I know how my 5.4 struggles at times with a 23RS. Your 4.6 with a loaded 23KRS will have a very tough time. You will be unhappy with the performance at times. Maybe alot.

-CC


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## Sayonara (Jul 23, 2007)

Welcome and good luck !! Enjoy the site.


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## NHRA Larry (Jan 30, 2008)

Grunt0311 said:


> It may work for you. I tow a 30rls with a dodge 1500 (w/hemi). My combination almosts hits the towing limits on the truck. I did in fact make some changes to insure the combo works. The biggest was I had to install "LT" rated 10 ply tires and got rid of the "P" rates tires (which elimated the sway issue), I also installed a "superchip" which changed the the computer setting when in tow mode. I installed a hitch on the back of the TT which I run a small M/C carried off the back of the TT (w/my pit scooter).
> 
> It may take some trial and error, playing with different combos, but it should work for you. The general mindset is that you have to have a 3/4 ton dissel to haul a tt, but with the price of fuel, I can't justify the benefits of a bigger truck vs the cost to upgrade.
> 
> NHRA Larry


First off, welcome to the site Intruder







. I hope you find the site useful and fun to be on.

Secondly, I have to disagree that the general mindset is that you need a 3/4 ton with a diesel to tow a tt. The mindset is that you need to have a truck that you can tow a tt within the weight limitations. Diesel has nothing to do with it. Sorry to be blunt, but putting LT tires on your truck does not increase its towing capacity, neither does having a computer chip in it. All that does is give you more power for the hills. It doesn't help with the weight or control/stopping with a tt. I have a hard time believing that you are within the weight capacities of your rear axle, payload, and towing with a trailer that big. Especially when you figure the weight of all the stuff in it, generator, scooter, people in the truck, etc. I'm not saying everyone needs to have a 3/4 ton to tow any travel trailer, just that some trailers are too big for 1/2 ton trucks.

Bill
[/quote]


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## NHRA Larry (Jan 30, 2008)

NHRA Larry said:


> It may work for you. I tow a 30rls with a dodge 1500 (w/hemi). My combination almosts hits the towing limits on the truck. I did in fact make some changes to insure the combo works. The biggest was I had to install "LT" rated 10 ply tires and got rid of the "P" rates tires (which elimated the sway issue), I also installed a "superchip" which changed the the computer setting when in tow mode. I installed a hitch on the back of the TT which I run a small M/C carried off the back of the TT (w/my pit scooter).
> 
> It may take some trial and error, playing with different combos, but it should work for you. The general mindset is that you have to have a 3/4 ton dissel to haul a tt, but with the price of fuel, I can't justify the benefits of a bigger truck vs the cost to upgrade.
> 
> NHRA Larry


First off, welcome to the site Intruder







. I hope you find the site useful and fun to be on.

Secondly, I have to disagree that the general mindset is that you need a 3/4 ton with a diesel to tow a tt. The mindset is that you need to have a truck that you can tow a tt within the weight limitations. Diesel has nothing to do with it. Sorry to be blunt, but putting LT tires on your truck does not increase its towing capacity, neither does having a computer chip in it. All that does is give you more power for the hills. It doesn't help with the weight or control/stopping with a tt. I have a hard time believing that you are within the weight capacities of your rear axle, payload, and towing with a trailer that big. Especially when you figure the weight of all the stuff in it, generator, scooter, people in the truck, etc. I'm not saying everyone needs to have a 3/4 ton to tow any travel trailer, just that some trailers are too big for 1/2 ton trucks.

Bill
[/quote]
[/quote]
Like I said, it's the general mindset that you have to have at least a 3/4 ton diesel to haul a TT. It dosen't take a 2500 hd diesel to tow a 23RS. According to keystone's specs - the 23RS weights 4989# with a hitch weight of 570#. A little of overkill for a Chevy 2500HD w/6.0 diesel.

NHRA Larry


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## having_fun (Jun 19, 2006)

I don't think anyone has said that. If he had a 5.4 or 6.0 gasser with a 4.10 rear ratio, I think many would think he would be OK with a 1/2 ton.


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## Grunt0311 (Aug 23, 2005)

NHRA Larry said:


> It may work for you. I tow a 30rls with a dodge 1500 (w/hemi). My combination almosts hits the towing limits on the truck. I did in fact make some changes to insure the combo works. The biggest was I had to install "LT" rated 10 ply tires and got rid of the "P" rates tires (which elimated the sway issue), I also installed a "superchip" which changed the the computer setting when in tow mode. I installed a hitch on the back of the TT which I run a small M/C carried off the back of the TT (w/my pit scooter).
> 
> It may take some trial and error, playing with different combos, but it should work for you. The general mindset is that you have to have a 3/4 ton dissel to haul a tt, but with the price of fuel, I can't justify the benefits of a bigger truck vs the cost to upgrade.
> 
> NHRA Larry


First off, welcome to the site Intruder







. I hope you find the site useful and fun to be on.

Secondly, I have to disagree that the general mindset is that you need a 3/4 ton with a diesel to tow a tt. The mindset is that you need to have a truck that you can tow a tt within the weight limitations. Diesel has nothing to do with it. Sorry to be blunt, but putting LT tires on your truck does not increase its towing capacity, neither does having a computer chip in it. All that does is give you more power for the hills. It doesn't help with the weight or control/stopping with a tt. I have a hard time believing that you are within the weight capacities of your rear axle, payload, and towing with a trailer that big. Especially when you figure the weight of all the stuff in it, generator, scooter, people in the truck, etc. I'm not saying everyone needs to have a 3/4 ton to tow any travel trailer, just that some trailers are too big for 1/2 ton trucks.

Bill
[/quote]
[/quote]
Like I said, it's the general mindset that you have to have at least a 3/4 ton diesel to haul a TT. It dosen't take a 2500 hd diesel to tow a 23RS. According to keystone's specs - the 23RS weights 4989# with a hitch weight of 570#. A little of overkill for a Chevy 2500HD w/6.0 diesel.

NHRA Larry
[/quote]

I am saying, it is not a general mindset that you need to have a 3/4 ton DIESEL. Tell me, where did I say I had a 6.0 DIESEL?? In fact, my truck has a 6.0 GAS engine. There goes your argument for me saying everyone needs a diesel. And the fact that I have a 3/4 ton for towing a 23rs, I would rather be on the side of the coin I am then you, that being having too much truck rather than not enough!

Put as much frosting on it as you want, you can't change the facts and make it any sweeter. But atleast have your facts straight before you start flaming and making digs at someone!









Bill


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## skippershe (May 22, 2006)

A new member has asked a question and we are supposed to be helpful here.
Come on guys, let's keep it nice


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## russlg (Jul 21, 2008)

I'd say the question has been answered. Truck can tow 6500lbs max the way it is. Intruder asked about adding an air system, I'd say if you need to start radically changing the vehicle, then it is probably time to start shopping for a new tow vehicle. The trailer weight is 5155lbs (source, keystone site for '09 23krs) DRY, not counting the cargo for just plain old camping and the weight of the three tanks when filled.THEN add the weight of a Full size Motorcycle to the front of the trailer... I also am curious if this vehicle has the factory tow package. That 6500lb capacity assumes that you have that package. I would get a bigger truck.


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## wingnut (Mar 21, 2005)

We have a 2005 23rs, and when we first bought it we had a 2001 F150 Crew Cab. We had 4x4 and 5.4l. After a year of this set up we changed to a GMC 1500HD with a 6.0gas it is a crew cab as well. Intruder asked if the truck would pull the trailer, that answer is yes. Doing it safely is another matter altogether. Our 5.4L was screaming at highway speeds, this is because the transmisson in tow mode is a three speed. Another problem I had was the rear brakes, It may have been our set up and we live in the blueridge mountains but in the year of towing the outack I worout 1 full set off brakes and more than half of the second set. Third and this is completely my fault. We generally camp at State parks and National Forest campgrounds. Around here that means no hookups. By the time we loaded the generator, bikes, outdoor camping stuff, and cast iron cookware. The Ford was at it's limits. The biggest reason for changing trucks was the big block. They just pull better. By the way coming home from a trip up the blueridge parkway; which has a 45MPH speed limit; we FRIED the catalytic convertor. I put a new cat on and a cat back system and that never happend again. We only had 40k miles on the truck. We also have a heavy bike: a Goldwing; and I don't think the F150 would do a very good job at all, especially with the 4.6L. Just my two and a half cants.


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## intruder (Aug 4, 2008)

I effectively forget to answer this question , yes I have the tow package from factory , sorry!
and I don't like thinking solding my pick up because he only have 30,000km ( about 19,000 miles) for a 2004 it's not a lot, and thats why I'm try to found a solution , but may be the solution is , to found a smaller TT .


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## Nathan (Jan 2, 2007)

intruder said:


> I effectively forget to answer this question , yes I have the tow package from factory , sorry!
> and I don't like thinking solding my pick up because he only have 30,000km ( about 19,000 miles) for a 2004 it's not a lot, and thats why I'm try to found a solution , but may be the solution is , to found a smaller TT .


It's not the trailer that is causing troubles, it is the toy in the trailer....


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## egregg57 (Feb 13, 2006)

I think the intention of most people, when responding to these sort of questions, is to try to be helpful and give a straight and unbiased answer. Given the information, I try to give the best answer that I can. I am not an expert but having towed several different sized campers with several different trucks and an SUV, experience has showed me that the 80% rule of thumb will keep most people in the green regarding weight, performance and handling.

1/2 ton trucks tow campers. I have had two. And if you include an Expedition then three. operating within thier limits they make fine TV's. But once you start crossing the thresholds of GVWR, GCVWR, Tow Capacity etc then the experience is not going to be satisfactory and doesn't get better over time.

The same rule applies to 3/4 ton trucks, gas or deisel.

Two people with the same type of camper and TV are going to have different habits as far as how much is loaded, where it is loaded, driving habits, hitch type and so on.

As a group, considering camper weight, length and 50 to 75% of the payload capacity of the camper (weight of stuff that can be loaded), we can suggest what type of TV is necessary to do the job.

I personally am not going to suggest that a given TV is suitable when one of those weight or length spec's are approached or exceeded.

The main reason for that is that I don't think I could live with myself if I told an inexperienced person that they should be okay and then find out that this person wrecked (God forbid) and was injured or died or caused some one else to be injured or killed.

So I do not sway from the weight or length specifications. If I am going to give advise I want it to be sound, it needs to be sound.

Ultimately the responsibility of risk falls upon the driver of the rig. It is his/her responsibility to understand thier limitations, the vehicles limitations and the limitations of the the combination they are towing.

Nothing replaces pulling out the owners manual and understanding what is written there. Equally invaluable is the input from experienced and helpful people that have been where that new person has been before.

Choose wisely, be safe.

Eric


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## Grunt0311 (Aug 23, 2005)

Very well stated Eric!









Bill


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## intruder (Aug 4, 2008)

you are very right Eric!
anyway , it's always good to read people's experiences, and that's what I'm coming here, read all of you.
and all of you were very helpfull for me, you all looks have a lot of experiences and give good ideas









I'm the kind of person who like read a lot before taking a decision and I found your site. thanks every body!


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## russlg (Jul 21, 2008)

No harm in reading up on this stuff. It is wise to do. Good luck!!


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