# Wrecked



## bka4tcu (Aug 18, 2010)

Heading home from Florida yesterday, we got rear ended. We were the front vehicle in a 4 car pile up in a construction zone. The truck looks to be fine, but the Outback took a direct hit to the rear end. The spare tire rack was shoved into the back wall leaving a large hole in the wall which now has a bow shape to it, the sewer hose storage/rear bumper is now in a "v" shape, and worst of all it looks like the rear frame cross brace between the frame rails in bent as well. On the interior, the rear wall is pushed in and the floor is buckled where it meet the back wall. The car that hit us was a Dodge minivan. It hit the rear bumper and then went under the bumper and made contact with the frame.

Driving the remaining 800 miles home last night and today, the trailer had a definite shimmy to it and appeared to be tracking crooked. The problem got worse over 65mph.

I have an appointment with the insurance adjuster for the driver who caused the wreck this week. Has anyone ever dealt with a potential repair like this? If the frame is bent, can it be pulled straight, or is this a case of it will never be the same? Replacing the rear section of the exterior does not look like it would be took hard, but getting the floor level again on the inside looks like a more difficult task given the way the cross brace is bent.

Any advice on getting repairs and dealing with the other drivers insurance would be appreciated. I have a feeling the trailer should be totaled, but the insurance co will want to fix it. Ughh!


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## Grover (Jul 19, 2010)

Sounds like it should be a total. Labor and parts are expensive on a repair like this. The insurance adjuster does not have to insist on a repair, only what costs the least for their company.

I hope none was injured. That will figure in to how quickly they want to settle.


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## hautevue (Mar 8, 2009)

X2 with Grover above. Bent or twisted frames are a disaster for a TT. The entire rear end of the TT probably needs to be replaced, and that's very intensive on labor. And when all's done, you'll probably have leaks, tracking problems which eat tires, and so forth. And the floor is installed before everything above it is installed, so the reversing (to remove damages) is very labor intensive and complicated.

My auto insurance covers our liability on our TT but not collision. Nevertheless, you might get help from one of your auto insurance company adjusters. Those guys "speak the language" of adjusters.

And I recommend you do not sign anything the other party's adjuster presents until you get a second (or third) opinion. You also might call Keystone and ask them to recommend a "certified by Keystone" repair place near your home and see what the local folks say regarding repairs.

IMHO, it's totaled--the labor costs will be astronomical. If they total it, they'll try to low-ball you ("It's really used and only worth $x"). Stand firm and don't let the other party's adjuster take you to the cleaners!









And if the adjuster is going down the road of low-ball, you probably will need to cancel an appointment with him because you're going to the orthopedic physician for examination...


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## bka4tcu (Aug 18, 2010)

Thanks for the advice. I am guessing its totaled, but I want to be prepared for the discussion with the adjustor. My guess is that the adjuster probably looks at cars more often than travel trailers, that being the case, I may have to educate them on the construction and building practices used in manufacturing.

When I get time I'll upload a few pics of the damage.


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## CdnOutback (Apr 16, 2010)

It may also be worthwhile to get some details on what these units are selling for currently as well. Print off a few ads and use them as ammunition if you need to. Don't print the low ones though... just sayin'...


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## egregg57 (Feb 13, 2006)

Remember that the drivers insurance company should put you back where you were before the policy holder struck your camper.

It should suffice with out saying that insurance companies are money making businesses.

I don't care for them, but they are a necessary evil....

Anyway, If it is totaled, it is vitally important for you to know the replacement value of your Outback. They tend to initially depreciate pretty quickly, once off the lot unless you got a very good deal. Keeping in mind both of those items, replacement value ($ for identical model) vs the depreciatated value weighed against the amount the adjuster offers. You could find an end of year close out, identical model somewhere that may be less than what you initially paid last year, or what have you.

Suggest that unit to the insurance company. If the price is right, it works out for them and you.

I have had a couple of run ins with insurance companies with accidents that were not my fault and I was not happy with the way I was treated at all. One was AAA, the other a more regional company.

They are used to dealing with lawyers, threatening the use of one will not cause most insurers to flinch.

In one instance I was hit on the driverside of my vehicle, totaling it, by a driver that was blinded by the sun, couldn't see and decided to turn anyway. The wholesale value of the 86 Nissan pick-up truck was $2K. The offered me $258, or a salvage title to the vehicle.

$258... _REALLY?_

I explained that the wholesale value of the truck was 2,000.00 PRIOR to thier policy holder totalling it and that was what I needed from them. After going back and forth a couple of times, the last phone call before the resolution when like this...

Ring....

Hello, Mr. Gregg, we want to close this claim out, I highly suggest you take the salvage offer if you are interested in it or we will simply send you the check for $258.

No thank you, I am retaining a lawyer, my left arm is now bothering me from the impact on the driverside of the vehicle, I am seeing a doctor and calling the Maine Insurance Commission...Click...

Ring....Ring.....Ring....

Mr. Gregg? You can get in a lot of trouble for feigning an injury....

Your're right, and I am not. You should be well aware, as I am as a Volunteer Firefighter, that some injuries do not manifest themselves for days after a car accident.

Pause.... (.....thoughts of a personal injury lawsuit.......)

We are willing to offer 1950.00 for replacement of your truck.

That is acceptable.

And with that I purchased a $2,000 1998 Ford Ranger. I called it my $50 truck.

What I am trying to say is be very keen on dollar amounts, do not settle for some low ball offer. Thier policy holder struck you.

Make sure you look for any addditional, possibly hidden damage such as the hitch, WDH bars, your hitch attachment points at the frame of your Tow vehicle.

Just be careful and thorough.

Eric


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## hautevue (Mar 8, 2009)

X2 egregg57 above. Good writeup!

His point about damage to the hitch, & the towing end of the TT, and the bars, etc., is well taken. That shock from getting hit in the butt goes somewhere. Some of it was absorbed by the bending of the bumper and the bending of the floor.

But since the frame itself got whacked and bent, that shock went forward (the frame is pretty strong) and was transmitted through the towing end of the TT to your TV.

You should check out the hitch assembly and everything associated with it at the front of the TT. Bent or distorted hitch ball socket assemblies are not good. And the shock continued into the TV---you might want to make sure the hitch receiver and that area of your TV is OK, too.


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## Jewellfamily (Sep 25, 2010)

The problem that you typically run into if its totaled is the "gap". TT's depreciate hard like cars do and your left with the difference of what you owe vs. what it books for on a totaled claim (if you financed it). We actually have gap insurance on ours. It was dirt cheap when we bought it. If you do have gap insurance, make sure they are involved in any claim settling as your gap insurance coverage will fight on your behalf because it means they dont have to pay so much. Good luck!


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## Doxie-Doglover-Too (Jan 25, 2007)

picture?


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## Nathan (Jan 2, 2007)

Yeah, like other's mentioned, don't assume the truck is ok. I have my trailer insured separately but hope to never have to use it. Good luck.


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## bka4tcu (Aug 18, 2010)

I can't seem to resize the photo I have and the forum says my photo is too big. Oh well...The truck is not too bad. I have had the hitch and frame welds inspected. They look good, no cracks in the paint or welds. There is minor damage to the bumper which probably absorbed most of the force through the hitch. I am hopeful that we will have the trailer estimate next week and then we can decide what to do next.


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## KTMRacer (Jun 28, 2010)

I had an instance last summer when my Pace cargo trailer/toyhauler was rear ended. very minor damage to the trailer skin and the ramp door hinges needed to be replaced. BMW that hit me was another story. needed a tow truck, she went under the rear of the trailer both fenders, radiator, hood toast at the very least. First thing I resolved with the adjuster is that the TRUCK reciever and frame WOULD be inspected. I already had an hourly quote on what that would cost to get inspected and said BEFORE we even discuss the trailer, we needed to agree that the truck would be inspected and if needed repairs made. They said there was no visible damage. I insisted and they finally agreed. end result was the the truck and reciever were OK as I suspected. Next they started to claim the trailer was totaled. I said, well lets take a look, we went out, I dropped the rear ramp and let him look inside at the full living quarters/bike hauler. GULP. I also stated I had ALL the reciepts for the work done. Quick backtrack and then they said well, take it to xxxx. I said, NO. At least in Oregon, insurance companies cannot dictate who you go to for repairs, nor can they require more than one estimate. replacing the aluminum skin on the ramp door and replacing the lower rear cross section with the ramp hinges came to almost $3K. I stated who I was going to and had them send in an estimate. They then wanted to pay me and have me get the work done. Again, NO. you have an estimate, approve it so they can get started, and if they find further damage your still on the hook.

Way more involved than any of the few car/car collisions I've had to deal with insurance agents for. IMHO insurance agents seldom deal with trailers and don't have a clue on how to proceed.

Also, from past experience, every time I've had an adjuster try to lowball me, I've pulled out a packet of reciepts for all the maintenance/repairs on the vehicle and said, let's talk about the vehicle condition BEFORE the accident. In every case it resulted in substantially more $$.

And if you can show what a comparable vehicle/trailer is listed for at a dealer or paper, they should either offer you that amount of $$ or purchase the vehicle/trailer for you. Check around and see if you can find a clean comparable and use that for a starting point if they aren't responding. don't accept less than what the advertised price is.

Since your trailer is a 2011, I'd try to find a new or used 2011 on a dealer lot and say buy it for me.


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## CamperAndy (Aug 26, 2004)

bka4tcu said:


> I can't seem to resize the photo I have and the forum says my photo is too big.


There are several ways to do it but the easiest is if you have MS Paint. Right click and select "edit", this will open the image in MS Paint. The use the "Image - Stretch/Skew" command and then set the Stretch command to 50 and 50. Then re save the picture that should srink the image size enough to allow you to post it.


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## Doxie-Doglover-Too (Jan 25, 2007)

CamperAndy said:


> I can't seem to resize the photo I have and the forum says my photo is too big.


There are several ways to do it but the easiest is if you have MS Paint. Right click and select "edit", this will open the image in MS Paint. The use the "Image - Stretch/Skew" command and then set the Stretch command to 50 and 50. Then re save the picture that should srink the image size enough to allow you to post it.
[/quote]

yeah! cuz we wanna see!


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## bka4tcu (Aug 18, 2010)

Ok, here are two photos. The first shows the trailer from the side, the second is a shot of the rear crossbeam and underbelly. As posted previously, the spare tire and carrier took a lot of the force, but the rear crossbeam took a hit as well. the photos do not quite show all the damage, but you get the idea.


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## Insomniak (Jul 7, 2006)

bka4tcu said:


> Ok, here are two photos. The first shows the trailer from the side, the second is a shot of the rear crossbeam and underbelly. As posted previously, the spare tire and carrier took a lot of the force, but the rear crossbeam took a hit as well. the photos do not quite show all the damage, but you get the idea.
> 
> View attachment 2444
> 
> View attachment 2443


That actually looks a lot better than I was expecting, but the damage to the floor and inside the trailer could be a different story.


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## WWH (May 7, 2010)

bka4tcu said:


> Heading home from Florida yesterday, we got rear ended. We were the front vehicle in a 4 car pile up in a construction zone. The truck looks to be fine, but the Outback took a direct hit to the rear end. The spare tire rack was shoved into the back wall leaving a large hole in the wall which now has a bow shape to it, the sewer hose storage/rear bumper is now in a "v" shape, and worst of all it looks like the rear frame cross brace between the frame rails in bent as well. On the interior, the rear wall is pushed in and the floor is buckled where it meet the back wall. The car that hit us was a Dodge minivan. It hit the rear bumper and then went under the bumper and made contact with the frame.
> 
> Driving the remaining 800 miles home last night and today, the trailer had a definite shimmy to it and appeared to be tracking crooked. The problem got worse over 65mph.
> 
> ...


A little off topic but I hope this helps. We are having insurance claim issues on our house and have hired a "Public Adjuster" who used to work for an insurance company as an adjuster but now represents the consumer. He charges us 10% of everything he gets above the original insurance estimate. We just hired him today to assist with a roof hail claim on our house. The replacement roof is 15k and they want to pay us 3k.I certainly do not mind paying him 10% of the money I could not get any other way.

Apparently he is doing well because we were the fourth customer he signed up today.

I also plan on him reviewing all of my insurance policies to make sure I have the coverage I think I have.


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## bka4tcu (Aug 18, 2010)

It has been a little over 2 weeks since we were rear ended on our way home from Florida. The good news is that our trailer did not receive as much damage as we had once thought. The better news is that the dealership we chose to repair the trailer has made us an offer for it that is almost what we paid for the trailer new. So, we plan to sell the Outback to the dealer and will take delivery of a 2013 Wildcat 312 BHX-OK 5'er tomorrow. We hate to see the Outback go, but the 5'er has a great layout and we could not beat the deal. I guess i'll have to change my signature to reflect that I now own an SOB. Even with the Wildcat, I plan to stick around here, there is too much great info on this forum to bail out.

Thanks to all for your advice as we have navigated this process.


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## Partsman Ed (Aug 26, 2008)

Don't be afraid to keep up with the goings on here on the Outback website. We had a 2008 Outback that we loved, but I made the mistake of taking the wife to the RV dealer to get a couple of parts for it and that was all it took!!! 
We ended up dealing on a 2011 Montana Mountaineer that now resides at our house.


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## Oregon_Camper (Sep 13, 2004)

Partsman Ed said:


> ....I made the mistake of taking the wife to the RV dealer to get a couple of parts for it and that was all it took!!!
> We ended up dealing on a 2011 Montana Mountaineer that now resides at our house.


Maybe you should take her with you the next time you take your truck in for service....


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