# New Oil Burner Anyone?



## Nathan (Jan 2, 2007)

The press embargo must be over: 6.7L


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## Carey (Mar 6, 2012)

4 head bolts and 2 shared is a good step in the right direction.

Rods look a bit weak, but who knows,

You guys better test the hell out of it! After spending that much money, it had better be a winner for everyone, not just the 95th percentile. I think you guys have well learned, its the other 5% that will destroy you and ruin any good your are trying to do.

You need to create a special 5%er team and make sure that 5% group will be happy. They are the ones who make your quality name, not the 95%ers.

You need to quit thinking big and think small. Test that engine on out to 3-400,000 miles. Thats what expected out of a pickup diesel engine. Cummins gives that. A 350k life alotment. Dmax is 250k. You guys need to build to 400k and trump em both.

Carey


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## Sayonara (Jul 23, 2007)

This has had me scratching my head for a few months now.... only 3 years for the 6.4L?


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## Nathan (Jan 2, 2007)

Sayonara said:


> This has had me scratching my head for a few months now.... only 3 years for the 6.4L?


The 6.4 doesn't get to 2010 emissions. It's really as simple as that.


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## Sayonara (Jul 23, 2007)

Nathan said:


> This has had me scratching my head for a few months now.... only 3 years for the 6.4L?


The 6.4 doesn't get to 2010 emissions. It's really as simple as that.
[/quote]
I read that, just seemed pretty drastic of a change, to create a whole new engine but then again im not an engine guy so maybe it was necessary.

Better mpg's would be nice. I averaged 9.1 over ~2000k miles to SC and back last week. 18,790 GCVW.


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## Collinsfam_WY (Nov 9, 2006)

Sayonara - don't forget the lawsuit over the 6.0 warranty costs. Bad blood + no 2010 emissions = 6.7 Scorpion!!!

-CC

Edit - Scorpion is a way cooler name than Power Stroke. Nathan I had my hopes up! Dangit!!! Marketing guys!


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## Carey (Mar 6, 2012)

I bet the public will decide which name is best. There will be companies making nameplates that remove the powerstroke and replace it with scopion. There will be guys with scorpions on there hoods, and back windows. We will have lic plates, bumper stickers of a scopion stinging the lil guy peeing, lol We will have scorpions with there tails drilled into the lil dead peeing guy too..

Boy cant wait for all that $^&% <wink>

Then ford will see the light and put the scopion on from the factory.

lol
Carey


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## Sayonara (Jul 23, 2007)

I vote no on "Scorpion". Sounds corny for a big diesel truck engine.


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## Duanesz (Jul 10, 2009)

Sorry Nathan I did not see this post and just put a post about the new oil burner too.

Duane


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## GarethsDad (Apr 4, 2007)

I would rather have a mid sized Inline 6.0l. Do we really need a big V8. I used to drive a old IH I6 that had all the power you needed and made up the milage with a split rear gear. James


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## Airboss (Jul 14, 2007)

"Ford's first diesel motor for its F-Series pickups to be developed entirely in-house after three decades..."

Really?!?

I won't be first in line.


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## GarethsDad (Apr 4, 2007)

Airboss said:


> "Ford's first diesel motor for its F-Series pickups to be developed entirely in-house after three decades..."
> 
> Really?!?
> 
> I won't be first in line.


Well that would be in (this country) Ford has diesels in everything in the EU and the UK. I also beleve that there was a diesel F150 ranger (fullsize) back in the late 70's but it could have been a cummins. James


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## N7OQ (Jun 10, 2006)

Good looking engine and a good read, I look forward to seeing it and hope it works out good since Ford is the only US company to not be owned by the Government and will most likelly be my next truck.


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## jozway (Jan 28, 2008)

N7OQ said:


> Good looking engine and a good read, I look forward to seeing it and hope it works out good since Ford is the only US company to not be owned by the Government and will most likelly be my next truck.


Dodge is'nt owned by the goverment.







As far as I know it's only GM (goverment motors).


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## Nathan (Jan 2, 2007)

Airboss said:


> "Ford's first diesel motor for its F-Series pickups to be developed entirely in-house after three decades..."
> 
> Really?!?
> 
> I won't be first in line.


There's only one way to deal with skeptics: Show them the proof.

Wait and see, wait and see....


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## Nathan (Jan 2, 2007)

jozway said:


> Good looking engine and a good read, I look forward to seeing it and hope it works out good since Ford is the only US company to not be owned by the Government and will most likelly be my next truck.


Dodge is'nt owned by the goverment.







As far as I know it's only GM (goverment motors).








[/quote]
Uh, yes they are. The Govt is a big stakeholder but they gave a percentage of the company to Fiat and are letting them make the decisions....









The other major stakeholder in GM and Chrysler are the UAW..... Yep, they now represent Labor AND Management..... What a world we live in!


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## jozway (Jan 28, 2008)

Nathan said:


> Good looking engine and a good read, I look forward to seeing it and hope it works out good since Ford is the only US company to not be owned by the Government and will most likelly be my next truck.


Dodge is'nt owned by the goverment.







As far as I know it's only GM (goverment motors).








[/quote]
Uh, yes they are. *The Govt is a big stakeholder but they gave a percentage of the company to Fiat* and are letting them make the decisions....









The other major stakeholder in GM and Chrysler are the UAW..... Yep, they now represent Labor AND Management..... What a world we live in!








[/quote]

I think Fiat actually purchased them and own Dodge????


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## Carey (Mar 6, 2012)

There is a ford ranger for the rest of the world that has been diesel powered like forever.

I once read somewhere that there is a ford diesel factory in the UK that supplies many of fords diesels. I also read that much of the scorpions original design was done in the UK.

There was talks of using a composite block when this all started for the scorpion, and that technology was derived in the UK.

Ford diesels overseas are renouned. I wouldnt even discredit that ford cant build a diesel. This has nothing to do with ford not or never able to design a pickup diesel for the US. The navistar engine was already out and proven. Why would any company back in the 80's go and design a diesel when a really great diesel of the 6.9 IH already existed.

Now from that point forward, IH designed another great diesel with the 7.3. But when the highly touted 6.0 came out thats when IH dropped the ball and ford got burned. I can tell you IH's max force 6.0 was not a bit better in IH trucks. IH just screwed up.

What company that is no.1 in the pickup market will put up with that. It only made since for ford to go to the UK and pick some of there top designers and fix the problem. Bring the design over to the states and let some of our best american engineers build the engine for us.

Yes I wish they would design with commercial use in mind, as many, many of there light trucks are used for commercial. But who knows, maybe they are. We are all just speculators at this point.

If you read that article, what ford has done makes some good sense in design.

There isnt no reason at all ford cant build a deisel of the decade. The future is Urea to control emissions. The cummins engine isnt doing that, and so far I have seen stories that gm may not do that.

Using Urea allows the engine to go back to injecting exhaust gas (egr) into the engine into the 20% range, and that range is safe for the engine. The dmax and cummins is still doing up to 40% and thats horrible for an engine.

With ford just doing this will give a one up on the life and reliability of there engine. If you read that article, they are only going to pull egr from one bank so that further back up that a much lower amount of egr will be used.

The air charge cooler will be water cooled and thats another secret to making power from a diesel, and yep they are doing that too.

The only thing from that article that worried me was the rod size, but if those are engineered properly and we all know they are, it shoudlnt be a problem.

I would bet we are looking at an entry from this engine of 700 torque and close to 400 hp. The engine very well could be capable of 8-850 torque reliably, but why show your cards at the start of the game. This engine may be around for several decades, so they gotts save somthing for later.

If you read they are also making a new 6 speed auto and that will be another plus, cause out here on the rv hauling road, that present ford auto is one few like and see make many miles.

Did you read this baby gets 3rd gen bosch injectors? 30,000 psi. Well, that kind of pressure promotes high fuel mpg.

I really hope they get it right the 1st time! But with present technology it is possible.

Carey


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## N7OQ (Jun 10, 2006)

I sure hope this engine works perfect and blows all the other trucks out of the water. The way things are right Ford it the only choice for me. Wouldn't I look good in a King Ranch Diesel, how I got to win that lottory.


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## Carey (Mar 6, 2012)

N7OQ said:


> I sure hope this engine works perfect and blows all the other trucks out of the water. The way things are right Ford it the only choice for me. Wouldn't I look good in a King Ranch Diesel, how I got to win that lottory.


I thought you said you would die with your dmax.

You know Bill, I think you like stirring the brew.. lol

Carey


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## bama29fan (Jun 22, 2009)

Sounds good on paper.....Notre Dame should have been great on papper on 2007









I hope it works out....but I would not be buying one until 2013 at least. But if everyone was like me then we wouldn't know how the engine is gonna work out. So all yall need to go buy one and test em for a couple of years and let me know how it goes....sound like a plan


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## MJRey (Jan 21, 2005)

Hopefully it works out well for Ford. I passed on buying a Ford because of the 6.0 problems and it was obvious that the 6.4 wasn't going to be around past 2010. I'll bet that with the emissions and electronic controls it will be nearly impossible for owners to modify or mess with the systems and keep it running. One thing I like about mine is I can fairly easily get rid of the EGR and DPF systems if I want to. I think we'll need to wait 2 to 3 years until the guys like Carey put some serious miles on them to see how it really holds up.


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## Carey (Mar 6, 2012)

MJRey said:


> Hopefully it works out well for Ford. I passed on buying a Ford because of the 6.0 problems and it was obvious that the 6.4 wasn't going to be around past 2010. I'll bet that with the emissions and electronic controls it will be nearly impossible for owners to modify or mess with the systems and keep it running. One thing I like about mine is I can fairly easily get rid of the EGR and DPF systems if I want to. I think we'll need to wait 2 to 3 years until the guys like Carey put some serious miles on them to see how it really holds up.


Nope not me!

I will wait for the public to break em in. There will be some rich old bored guys buying these in my company. We have a good bunch of guys in there late 60's and 70's that cant stand to sit and have to get away from grandma a few weeks out of the month. They buy a new truck every year, some buy a new one every 6 months. Yeah they are millionars and haul rvs for fun. RV hauling is just a way to keep em saine. Money is something they really could care a less about.

Us poor guys use them as our gunie pigs for new products and new truck models. You know, I'll keep you tuned in on there thoughts!

I really doubt I will get rid of this truck I have. I can do anything I want to it, I can blow all the black smoke I want, and this model was made from 2003 to 2009. This model of truck is the cheapest of all of them to run. Parts are everywhere, and the 5.9 cummins isnt going away and used parts will continue to become more plentiful and cheaper.

Those old guys will let us poor guys test drive there trucks, so I bet I get to drive a new scorpio ford as soon as they are out on the market.

Carey


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## OutbackPM (Sep 14, 2005)

Colorado~DirtBikers said:


> I once read somewhere that there is a ford diesel factory in the UK that supplies many of fords diesels. I also read that much of the scorpions original design was done in the UK.


 That's correct its in Dagenham which is on the east side of London. Some of my college mates went to Ford there (late 1970's) when they made cars like the Cortina and RWD Escort. They have since specialized that location to diesel engines manufacturing and technology. I think Ford have a good capability to design and make engines so I am glad to see the new truck diesel from them.

Here's a little bit of side info that means more to me now then when first told by my grandfather. My grandfather was in WW1 in the Royal Flying Corp as an engine mechanic. In WW2 he was moved to Rolls-Royce Derby in England to work on the Merlin engine that powered the Spifire and later on the Griffin version that powered the P51 Mustang. He said that Rolls Royce were unable to supply the quantity of these engines so Ford UK & US was employed to make many too. In his opinion the Ford version was vastly supperior to the Rolls version because they knew how to set up the mass production techniques necessary. One reason Ford has had a good history making engines that work well.

Ford's Navistar experience since the 7.3 has not been as good so I applaud them for making a good attempt to bring that back. I am not a Ford man or that biased towards any manufacturer but when you see the right effort put into making a good product for the long term I wish them well rather than the resent history of car makers to dress up old stuff and call it new.


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## Nathan (Jan 2, 2007)

jozway said:


> Good looking engine and a good read, I look forward to seeing it and hope it works out good since Ford is the only US company to not be owned by the Government and will most likelly be my next truck.


Dodge is'nt owned by the goverment.







As far as I know it's only GM (goverment motors).








[/quote]
Uh, yes they are. *The Govt is a big stakeholder but they gave a percentage of the company to Fiat* and are letting them make the decisions....









The other major stakeholder in GM and Chrysler are the UAW..... Yep, they now represent Labor AND Management..... What a world we live in!








[/quote]

I think Fiat actually purchased them and own Dodge????
[/quote]

Anyone interested, here's the article on the ownership percentage in Chrysler. 
So it is:
UAW: 55%
Fiat: 20%
Government and Secured Sharholders: 25%

Fiat's first 20% was essentially free to them, and they can get 15% more after the Government loans have been repaid.

Ok, now back to the normally scheduled programing.


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## Nathan (Jan 2, 2007)

OutbackPM said:


> That's correct its in Dagenham which is on the east side of London. Some of my college mates went to Ford there (late 1970's) when they made cars like the Cortina and RWD Escort. They have since specialized that location to diesel engines manufacturing and technology. I think Ford have a good capability to design and make engines so I am glad to see the new truck diesel from them.
> 
> ...


The Dagenham facility is also mostly wind powered by onsite turbines. Pretty neat to drive up to an industrial facility and see Wind turbines turning rather than smokestacks.


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## nynethead (Sep 23, 2005)

ford waiting to 2011 is a mistake, dodge is coming out with their new truck in 2010. crewcab which is basically a mega cab and now and 8 foot bed. highest tow rating, cummins and a 6 speed tranny. That's what I am looking toward. Not as trusting on the duramax since I broke down at 30K last year towing to Disney. left bad taste and an untrusting feelings as i am approach 60K and wonder if it is going to fail again.


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## JMAC (Jul 31, 2009)

nynethead said:


> ford waiting to 2011 is a mistake, dodge is coming out with their new truck in 2010. crewcab which is basically a mega cab and now and 8 foot bed. highest tow rating, cummins and a 6 speed tranny. That's what I am looking toward. Not as trusting on the duramax since I broke down at 30K last year towing to Disney. left bad taste and an untrusting feelings as i am approach 60K and wonder if it is going to fail again.


What was your break down issue? (What failed?)


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## Tyvekcat (Aug 28, 2007)

Colorado~DirtBikers said:


> Those old guys will let us poor guys test drive there trucks, so I bet I get to drive a new scorpio ford as soon as they are out on the market.
> 
> Carey


LOL 'Scorpio Ford ' Scorpio, Scorpion, Heck, They all look alike to me ! Good one Carey. (Did you mean to do that?)
All this emission stuff, I think they have reached the point of diminishing returns.

CTD Rattle Rattle Rattle


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## N7OQ (Jun 10, 2006)

Nathan said:


> Good looking engine and a good read, I look forward to seeing it and hope it works out good since Ford is the only US company to not be owned by the Government and will most likelly be my next truck.


Dodge is'nt owned by the goverment.







As far as I know it's only GM (goverment motors).








[/quote]
Uh, yes they are. *The Govt is a big stakeholder but they gave a percentage of the company to Fiat* and are letting them make the decisions....









The other major stakeholder in GM and Chrysler are the UAW..... Yep, they now represent Labor AND Management..... What a world we live in!








[/quote]

I think Fiat actually purchased them and own Dodge????
[/quote]

Anyone interested, here's the article on the ownership percentage in Chrysler. 
So it is:
UAW: 55%
Fiat: 20%
Government and Secured Sharholders: 25%

Fiat's first 20% was essentially free to them, and they can get 15% more after the Government loans have been repaid.

Ok, now back to the normally scheduled programing.








[/quote]

I want to know how the heck the UAW can own a company and represent the workers at the same time? Is this not a conflict of interest? I'm sorry but I have lost my faith in both GM and Chrysler on anything built from this point on plus this is the 2nd time Chrysler has had to be bailed out by the Government. So in the future it will be Ford for me.


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## Collinsfam_WY (Nov 9, 2006)

nynethead said:


> ford waiting to 2011 is a mistake, dodge is coming out with their new truck in 2010. crewcab which is basically a mega cab and now and 8 foot bed. highest tow rating, cummins and a 6 speed tranny. That's what I am looking toward. Not as trusting on the duramax since I broke down at 30K last year towing to Disney. left bad taste and an untrusting feelings as i am approach 60K and wonder if it is going to fail again.


I bet Nathan is dying to comment on this (but cannot) so I will do it for him! No mistake - that is just a MY thing. $5 says you see them on dealer lots by next March. Do you recall when the new '08 SuperDuty with the 6.4 hit the lots? In case you don't - it was...iirc...Feb. '07. Dealers can already "build" these trucks with the new 6R140 trans in their online order books.

I am FIRED UP about the 6R140. The 140 means the trans is rated for 1400lbs of torque if I read the articles right. Mama has already said NO WAY when she saw my glazed saucer sized eyes as I was stammering on about this powertrain.

The only complaint I have seen thus far is that a manual trans will no longer be available.

-CC


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## Carey (Mar 6, 2012)

Tyvekcat said:


> Those old guys will let us poor guys test drive there trucks, so I bet I get to drive a new scorpio ford as soon as they are out on the market.
> 
> Carey


LOL 'Scorpio Ford ' Scorpio, Scorpion, Heck, They all look alike to me ! Good one Carey. (Did you mean to do that?)
All this emission stuff, I think they have reached the point of diminishing returns.

CTD Rattle Rattle Rattle








[/quote]

Yeah I did. Be a good nick name for it. I thought of scorp ford to, that reminds me of one of my favorite bands, the scorps(scorpions)

I like your cummins spirit!









Carey


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## Carey (Mar 6, 2012)

collinsfam_tx said:


> ford waiting to 2011 is a mistake, dodge is coming out with their new truck in 2010. crewcab which is basically a mega cab and now and 8 foot bed. highest tow rating, cummins and a 6 speed tranny. That's what I am looking toward. Not as trusting on the duramax since I broke down at 30K last year towing to Disney. left bad taste and an untrusting feelings as i am approach 60K and wonder if it is going to fail again.


I bet Nathan is dying to comment on this (but cannot) so I will do it for him! No mistake - that is just a MY thing. $5 says you see them on dealer lots by next March. Do you recall when the new '08 SuperDuty with the 6.4 hit the lots? In case you don't - it was...iirc...Feb. '07. Dealers can already "build" these trucks with the new 6R140 trans in their online order books.

I am FIRED UP about the 6R140. The 140 means the trans is rated for 1400lbs of torque if I read the articles right. Mama has already said NO WAY when she saw my glazed saucer sized eyes as I was stammering on about this powertrain.

The only complaint I have seen thus far is that a manual trans will no longer be available.

-CC
[/quote]

1400 ft lbs! You do realize that many class 7 semis make less than 1400 torque.

Also ford isnt coming out with a new truck in 2011. Just a new powertrain. I think I read that the present cab will run to 2013. It may get a different grille.

Prolly some dont realize the present ford truck is the same cab as the one that started the super duty back in 1997. Only some outer sheetmetal, grilles and the interior has been changed.

Carey


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