# Bad Sway



## bandrelectric

I have a 2010 Ford F250 deisel 4x4 with towing package. The truck is built to tow. I have towed several different types of trailers including a 42' fifth wheel. I have an Outback 312bh 2011 model. We recently took a trip and the sway was unbeleivable...there were times that i had to change lanes just to keep up with the trailer. There was a pretty good wind (30mph with gust to 45), but should it be that bad. I have sway control system with friction brake. Everything was tight. We are about to take a long trip, about 2000 miles and I am concerned about sway. Any suggestions out there?


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## Mgonzo2u

Just guessing here but did you have enough tongue weight on that trip?


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## CamperAndy

No way you should have just a friction sway control on that bad boy. There are many MUCH better options.

30 mph wind with gusts to 45 can easily overwhelm you. What was the angle of the wind? I would guess it was a quartering head wind.

I also agree that you may have been low on the tongue weight.


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## Nathan

I'm betting you have a friction sway control? If so, go for an integrated sway control system like the Reese Dual Cam. It won't tow like a 5'er, but it should be a lot better. I hear Hensley and Propride tow closer to 5'ers but they cost as much as a 5'er too...


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## egregg57

What type of Weight Distribution Hitch are you using?

Friction Sway Control bars are useless on the size of TT you are towing.

eric


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## rsm7

Something is not right with your setup. I agree with tongue weight but unlees you loaded gear in the back of the trailer it shouldnt be that far off. Check your tongue _height_. The trailer needs to be lower in the nose and this would help transfer weight forward and keep it straighter. I have integrated sway control with my Blue Ox hitch but it is set kinda loose unless there is alot of wind and I have never had that kind of sway. As others have posted it would help to know what brand and type hitch/sway control you are using.


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## duggy

I realize there was quite a wind, but did you have a time where the wind was insignificant, yet you still had sway? Under normal circumstances you shouldn't have any sway at all, even with no sway control. As already mentioned, it was either a lack of tongue weight (should be 12 to 15% of total), or high hitch height (trailer should tow level or slightly nose down), or both. It is very easy to mess up the tongue weight with improper placement of load. Another factor can be tank levels. If a tank at the rear of the trailer is full, that could add 400 lbs behind the axle, which would subtract about 300 lbs off the tongue.

As also already stated, a friction sway control is inadequate for that size of trailer. Don't send a boy to do a man's job!


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## KTMRacer

duggy said:


> I realize there was quite a wind, but did you have a time where the wind was insignificant, yet you still had sway? Under normal circumstances you shouldn't have any sway at all, even with no sway control. As already mentioned, it was either a lack of tongue weight (should be 12 to 15% of total), or high hitch height (trailer should tow level or slightly nose down), or both. It is very easy to mess up the tongue weight with improper placement of load. Another factor can be tank levels. If a tank at the rear of the trailer is full, that could add 400 lbs behind the axle, which would subtract about 300 lbs off the tongue.
> 
> As also already stated, a friction sway control is inadequate for that size of trailer. Don't send a boy to do a man's job!


x2 on all of the above. Also, I'll bet the 312 has real tongue weight in the 1200-1400lb range, regardless of what the "empty" tongue weight is. My 295RE is 1400lbs with full fresh water, 1200 w/o. Unless you have a properly set up WD setup to support that amount of tongue weight, part of your problem may be not enough weight on the TV front end. neighbor was complaining about sway with his trailer. tongue weight was 12% 800lbs, WD had 1000lb bars, should have been stable. problem was the WD wasn't moving near enough weight to the TV front end and front end was light enought that it was the TV wandering on the road, not the trailer. Once we set the WD to get the TV front end back to stock ride height he took it out and called all excited about how stable the setup was. problem gone!!

DW was towing our outback 295RE for the first time down the columbia gorge last fall. when we pulled over to change drivers, I asked her how it was. her comment, wow, this is easy. when I opened the truck door we were in for a shock, wind gusts were in the 40-50mph range. Trailer was dead stable. Reese DC trunnion bar setup is the sweet ticket.


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## duggy

KTMRacer said:


> Unless you have a properly set up WD setup to support that amount of tongue weight, part of your problem may be not enough weight on the TV front end. neighbor was complaining about sway with his trailer. tongue weight was 12% 800lbs, WD had 1000lb bars, should have been stable. problem was the WD wasn't moving near enough weight to the TV front end and front end was light enought that it was the TV wandering on the road, not the trailer. Once we set the WD to get the TV front end back to stock ride height he took it out and called all excited about how stable the setup was. problem gone!!
> 
> DW was towing our outback 295RE for the first time down the columbia gorge last fall. when we pulled over to change drivers, I asked her how it was. her comment, wow, this is easy. when I opened the truck door we were in for a shock, wind gusts were in the 40-50mph range. Trailer was dead stable. Reese DC trunnion bar setup is the sweet ticket.


Good point! It's easy to assume the problem is all about the trailer, but that's _assuming_ the truck has the weight properly distributed. When the whole package is set up properly, pulling a trailer is a low stress past time. If one part of the equation is wrong, it's a whole different story.


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## AB2011

I agree that the trailer/TV setup might be off, front of trailer too high or too light. I have the same trailer and tow it with a chev 2500 HD. I have towed it a couple times with higher winds, one of those times was through the mountains, and it was steady as a rock. Also I only have friction sway control so don't really agree that you need more than that.


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## hautevue

Concur w/above solutions.

The 312BH factory ship weight is 7600. Add 1000 for your "stuff", propane, some fresh water, etc. and you're towing 8600.

Check the tongue weight, "fer sure". Find a commercial trucker's scale guy, call them up and get a time when they can have you block the scales for 15 minutes. Ours locally was very cooperative. Then

1. drive up and pull the TV and TT onto the scales. Weight it without you in the TV but carry what you normally tow with--tools? generator? etc. I got 3 weights: total (TV and TT), TV front wheels off the scale, TV both wheels off the scale.

2. Back up the TT so that only the hitch jack is on the scales. Unhitch, and drive the TV off the scales. Weigh the TT. That gives you the hitch weight.

3. Back up the TV, hitch up, leaving the TT wheels on the concrete. Weigh the TV. Drive forward and back so the operator gets the weight on the front wheels and the rear wheels separately. That will show you the weight transfer.

This should give you the weight numbers for your calcs. The calcs can be found on this site, too.

I fully concur about a super good hitch--I tow about 7000 pounds with the TT loaded, and have a Husky WD hitch (800# - 1200# bars) and one friction sway bar. It works fine, but I really pay attention when I'm tooling along the Interstate at 55 - 60 and it's windy and there are 18-wheelers passing me. No significant sway, but I'm sure I'm near the limit of what sway my setup can handle. Any more weight and I'd definitely upgrade the hitch to a Reese or Hensley or Propride or equivalent. Plus my TT is 30' and yours is 35' long. And I seldom tow with the fresh tank holding more than 5 gallons (except when boondocking). Saving 25 gallons of weight saves hauling 200 pounds around.

I also agree that your tongue weight may be significantly off, and the weighing process will help identify that. 12% of 8500 pounds is 1020 tongue weight--if you're a lot over that (or under that), you may be outside the limits of safety.


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## bandrelectric

I do know that the TT rides level and so does the truck. I think I will take it to the RV place that I baught it from and have them check the weight distribution. They set it all up for me and sold me the friction sway control.


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## bandrelectric

hautevue said:


> Concur w/above solutions.
> 
> The 312BH factory ship weight is 7600. Add 1000 for your "stuff", propane, some fresh water, etc. and you're towing 8600.
> 
> Check the tongue weight, "fer sure". Find a commercial trucker's scale guy, call them up and get a time when they can have you block the scales for 15 minutes. Ours locally was very cooperative. Then
> 
> 1. drive up and pull the TV and TT onto the scales. Weight it without you in the TV but carry what you normally tow with--tools? generator? etc. I got 3 weights: total (TV and TT), TV front wheels off the scale, TV both wheels off the scale.
> 
> 2. Back up the TT so that only the hitch jack is on the scales. Unhitch, and drive the TV off the scales. Weigh the TT. That gives you the hitch weight.
> 
> 3. Back up the TV, hitch up, leaving the TT wheels on the concrete. Weigh the TV. Drive forward and back so the operator gets the weight on the front wheels and the rear wheels separately. That will show you the weight transfer.
> 
> This should give you the weight numbers for your calcs. The calcs can be found on this site, too.
> 
> I fully concur about a super good hitch--I tow about 7000 pounds with the TT loaded, and have a Husky WD hitch (800# - 1200# bars) and one friction sway bar. It works fine, but I really pay attention when I'm tooling along the Interstate at 55 - 60 and it's windy and there are 18-wheelers passing me. No significant sway, but I'm sure I'm near the limit of what sway my setup can handle. Any more weight and I'd definitely upgrade the hitch to a Reese or Hensley or Propride or equivalent. Plus my TT is 30' and yours is 35' long. And I seldom tow with the fresh tank holding more than 5 gallons (except when boondocking). Saving 25 gallons of weight saves hauling 200 pounds around.
> 
> I also agree that your tongue weight may be significantly off, and the weighing process will help identify that. 12% of 8500 pounds is 1020 tongue weight--if you're a lot over that (or under that), you may be outside the limits of safety.


How would I chang the tongue weight if it is off?


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## bandrelectric

rsm7 said:


> Something is not right with your setup. I agree with tongue weight but unlees you loaded gear in the back of the trailer it shouldnt be that far off. Check your tongue _height_. The trailer needs to be lower in the nose and this would help transfer weight forward and keep it straighter. I have integrated sway control with my Blue Ox hitch but it is set kinda loose unless there is alot of wind and I have never had that kind of sway. As others have posted it would help to know what brand and type hitch/sway control you are using.


Ok..the sway sysem says it is a Pro Series with 800 lb weight distribution spring bar, 14000 lb max trailer weight, 800 lb max hitch weight


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## CamperAndy

bandrelectric said:


> Something is not right with your setup. I agree with tongue weight but unlees you loaded gear in the back of the trailer it shouldnt be that far off. Check your tongue _height_. The trailer needs to be lower in the nose and this would help transfer weight forward and keep it straighter. I have integrated sway control with my Blue Ox hitch but it is set kinda loose unless there is alot of wind and I have never had that kind of sway. As others have posted it would help to know what brand and type hitch/sway control you are using.


Ok..the sway sysem says it is a Pro Series with 800 lb weight distribution spring bar, 14000 lb max trailer weight, 800 lb max hitch weight
[/quote]

Why do dealers do this? They sold you an under weight system for your trailer and as has already been mentioned the wrong sway control.

Be nice when you talk to them but I think you need to get your money back on that WDH and friction bar and get a more correct set up.


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## rsm7

A google search came up with this http://www.reese-hitches.com/products/Pro_Series_RB2_Weight_Distributing_Hitch__800_lb_,49569 for a pro series 800. It appears to be an entry level hitch but my first concern would be that 800# spring bars are not enough for that size trailer. I would think more like 1000 or even 1200 but with a 3/4 ton truck you could probably get by with 1000Lb bar? My guess is the dealership probably sold you this for around $500? If so perhaps they will take it back and you could argue that its not the proper weight rating then you could by an Equalizer Brand here for the same money http://www.rvwholesalers.com/catalog/rvw-tow-center-travel-trailer-hitches-equal-i-zer-travel-trailer-hitches/?gclid=CNSb5O2s3qkCFRHGKgodqzzPZg. The Equalizer is a much better hitch with integrated sway control.

All that being said your hitch still shouldnt ride that badly. I would drop that ball height down 1 or 2 holes first see if the it doesnt improve. Its also possible that you are not getting enough weight transfer to the steers because of the 800 lb bars. If thats the case try using an extra link or two in the chain. Definately take it back to the dealer and have them look at it. Have them explain each adjustment and what it does so you can fine tune it yourself when needed.


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## john7349

Sounds like a job for an Equal-I-zer or Reese Dual Cam hitch (1200lb/12000lb).


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## rsm7

CamperAndy said:


> Something is not right with your setup. I agree with tongue weight but unlees you loaded gear in the back of the trailer it shouldnt be that far off. Check your tongue _height_. The trailer needs to be lower in the nose and this would help transfer weight forward and keep it straighter. I have integrated sway control with my Blue Ox hitch but it is set kinda loose unless there is alot of wind and I have never had that kind of sway. As others have posted it would help to know what brand and type hitch/sway control you are using.


Ok..the sway sysem says it is a Pro Series with 800 lb weight distribution spring bar, 14000 lb max trailer weight, 800 lb max hitch weight
[/quote]

Why do dealers do this? They sold you an under weight system for your trailer and as has already been mentioned the wrong sway control.

Be nice when you talk to them but I think you need to get your money back on that WDH and friction bar and get a more correct set up.
[/quote]

CamperAndy not only beat me to the punch but was a little more direct in his answer!


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## KTMRacer

bandrelectric said:


> I do know that the TT rides level and so does the truck. I think I will take it to the RV place that I baught it from and have them check the weight distribution. They set it all up for me and sold me the friction sway control.


First clue. I've NEVER seen a properly set up, or even close to properly set up WD from a dealer. Sad to say but true. You also mentioned the WD setup. I can almost guarantee it isn't adequate for your trailer. 800lb bars are WAY to small, your loaded tongue weight is probably in the 1200-1400lb range. IIRC the spec's for the trailer is a 765lb EMPTY tongue weight. Add to that 60lbs for propane, 120lbs for batteries, and your pushing 1000lbs. add any stuff to the pass through along with other stuff and your now at 1200lbs or more, likely 1300lbs. End result is that the WD setup can't load your TV front end enough and that's a big contributor to what you think is sway. It's equally likely a light front end and now an oversteering TV that is wandering all over the road.

when you go back to the dealer insist that they weight the tongue and give you the loaded tongue weight. then have them explain why they sold you a WD setup that was inadequate for an unloaded trailer from the mfg spec's.!!


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## hautevue

Changing tongue weight:

To the base weight from the factory add the weight of the propane, water if your water tank is forward of the TT axles, batteries (I have two), plus the "stuff" in your understorage areas that are forward of the axles. That'll get you near the tongue weight without actually measuring.

To reduce tongue weight, you can move stuff in the TT forward storage to the rear (rearward of the axles). That vacuum cleaner in the closet near the forward bed? move it to the rear. Only 20 pounds maybe, but everything helps.

But I agree with others above--it is highly likely that your WDH bars are undersized for the weight transfer they're being asked to do. Jumping through hoops to get 50 or 100 pounds off the TT hitch weight won't make much difference.

A former President is said to have said, "It's the economy, stupid." In this case, "It's the weight distribution hitch!"

Good luck and run do not walk back to the dealer who sold you that undersized hitch.


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## rsm7

KTMRacer said:


> I've NEVER seen a properly set up, or even close to properly set up WD from a dealer. Sad to say but true.


I have to agree. That being said I think it would be pure luck for anyone to dial it in perfect on the first shot. The weight distribution on the trailer and the truck would be different every time unless you always loaded the exact same way. Thats why its important to know how the hitch works and what does what.


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## egregg57

After reading what type of WDH you have, not only am I not surprised that you are having sway issues, but I would be surprised if you're not porpoising too (up and down bounce).

I don't mean to sound calous. This isn't your fault. Shame on the dealer for setting you up like this.

Where are you located? Is there an Outbacker near by that can help you get the WDH adjusted properly after it is replaced with the right one? Or are you confident that you can make the adjustments yourself?

Several people have mentioned different types of hitches. I had good success with a Blue Ox BWX1000 WDH with integral Sway control. I was towing a 31RQS. That's a pretty long camper. Very close to what you have now.

Hope you get it all straightened out.

Good luck!









Eric


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## bandrelectric

egregg57 said:


> After reading what type of WDH you have, not only am I not surprised that you are having sway issues, but I would be surprised if you're not porpoising too (up and down bounce).
> 
> I don't mean to sound calous. This isn't your fault. Shame on the dealer for setting you up like this.
> 
> Where are you located? Is there an Outbacker near by that can help you get the WDH adjusted properly after it is replaced with the right one? Or are you confident that you can make the adjustments yourself?
> 
> Several people have mentioned different types of hitches. I had good success with a Blue Ox BWX1000 WDH with integral Sway control. I was towing a 31RQS. That's a pretty long camper. Very close to what you have now.
> 
> Hope you get it all straightened out.
> 
> Good luck!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eric


 I called the dealer yesterday and they wqant me to bring in the trailer and TV. I am getting a good understanding of the problem now. The jitch has to distribut e the weight properly. The bars on my hitch are undersized, thus sway.


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## CamperAndy

bandrelectric said:


> After reading what type of WDH you have, not only am I not surprised that you are having sway issues, but I would be surprised if you're not porpoising too (up and down bounce).
> 
> I don't mean to sound calous. This isn't your fault. Shame on the dealer for setting you up like this.
> 
> Where are you located? Is there an Outbacker near by that can help you get the WDH adjusted properly after it is replaced with the right one? Or are you confident that you can make the adjustments yourself?
> 
> Several people have mentioned different types of hitches. I had good success with a Blue Ox BWX1000 WDH with integral Sway control. I was towing a 31RQS. That's a pretty long camper. Very close to what you have now.
> 
> Hope you get it all straightened out.
> 
> Good luck!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eric


 I called the dealer yesterday and they wqant me to bring in the trailer and TV. I am getting a good understanding of the problem now. The jitch has to distribut e the weight properly. *The bars on my hitch are undersized, thus sway*.
[/quote]

Maybe, WDH does not control sway but they can help prevent it by keeping the TV geometry correct. Undersized bars can mean a light front end on the TV and cause steering issues that can lead to or compound sway issues.


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## KTMRacer

CamperAndy said:


> After reading what type of WDH you have, not only am I not surprised that you are having sway issues, but I would be surprised if you're not porpoising too (up and down bounce).
> 
> I don't mean to sound calous. This isn't your fault. Shame on the dealer for setting you up like this.
> 
> Where are you located? Is there an Outbacker near by that can help you get the WDH adjusted properly after it is replaced with the right one? Or are you confident that you can make the adjustments yourself?
> 
> Several people have mentioned different types of hitches. I had good success with a Blue Ox BWX1000 WDH with integral Sway control. I was towing a 31RQS. That's a pretty long camper. Very close to what you have now.
> 
> Hope you get it all straightened out.
> 
> Good luck!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eric


 I called the dealer yesterday and they wqant me to bring in the trailer and TV. I am getting a good understanding of the problem now. The jitch has to distribut e the weight properly. *The bars on my hitch are undersized, thus sway*.
[/quote]

Maybe, WDH does not control sway but they can help prevent it by keeping the TV geometry correct. Undersized bars can mean a light front end on the TV and cause steering issues that can lead to or compound sway issues.
[/quote]

exactly.







the front end, add lots of weight to the rear, and bingo, now the tow vehicle which normally has signficant understeer, now oversteers and starts to wander all over the road. you think it's trailer sway but really the tow vehicle wandering all over swinging the trailer behind it. I've seen this exact situation on two neighbors Tow vehicles when the WD wasn't set up near correct and the front ends were way light. Once the WD was set up properly, bingo, problem gone, trailer is stable.


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## Carey

If you are reading the specs off of the hitch head it could be anywhere from 800lb to 1200lb hitch weight and 10000 to 14000lbs gross.

The hitch head uses the same sticker for both weight specd hitches.

The only difference between a 10k pro series and a 14k pro series is the weight dist bars. The hitch heads are all the same.

The bars arent marked. Youll have to ask the dealer what they sold you.

Is the hitch head laid back much? Can you post us a pic?

In 30 to 45mph winds you will have sway issues unless you are using an integrated friction sway hitch.

On a 3/4 you will want your w/d hitch to be on the light side of the actual hitch weight, and vice versa for a 1/2 ton.

I used to tow 44 foot park models from elkhart, In. deep into western canada that had 16-1800lb hitch weights while using a 1100lb reese pro series integrated system. I would lay back the hitch head with max air pressure in the air bags, then vent off the air bags to around 30 psi, which would allow the weight to settle into the wd bars. I had very little sway and no porpoising using this way out of spec system.

One could easilly get away with a 800lb system on a 3/4 ton with a 1200lb hitch weight if you were using air bags to level the vehicle.

You will obtain the best ride if you use air bags and error to the light side with your wd system.

I prolly shouldnt be even bringing this up, cause few can follow what I'm saying here. I had the advantage to be able to learn because I used to haul rvs for a living.

Carey


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## rsm7

Colorado~DirtBikers said:


> On a 3/4 you will want your w/d hitch to be on the light side of the actual hitch weight, and vice versa for a 1/2 ton.
> 
> I used to tow 44 foot park models from elkhart, In. deep into western canada that had 16-1800lb hitch weights while using a 1100lb reese pro series integrated system. I would lay back the hitch head with max air pressure in the air bags, then vent off the air bags to around 30 psi, which would allow the weight to settle into the wd bars. I had very little sway and no porpoising using this way out of spec system.
> 
> One could easilly get away with a 800lb system on a 3/4 ton with a 1200lb hitch weight if you were using air bags to level the vehicle.
> 
> *You will obtain the best ride if you use air bags and error to the light side with your wd system.
> 
> I prolly shouldnt be even bringing this up, cause few can follow what I'm saying here. I had the advantage to be able to learn because I used to haul rvs for a living. *
> 
> Carey


A month or two back I posted the same thing and lets just say it didnt go too well.







So yeah I agree with you.


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## Traveling Tek

Listen to these guys.  Mine was swaying all over and bouncing. Here the dealer had it setup wrong. Following advice from the folks on this board I was able to straighten it out and go much smoother down the road. If there was a Kudos button or a like button on this forum, i would definitely hand it out.  And Lord knows I have a lot of tongue weight, but I balanced it out with a lot of tail weight too.


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## willingtonpaul

I hear you Carey. With my setup, I use a 1200lb tongue weight / 12000lb max hitch head and 600lb bars. I don't need to transfer weight to the nose of my truck, I need to get compression on the rear end. I have the slide in camper package on my truck, with the helper springs, and she is stiff. And you need to get good flex in the Reese bars so the cups stay seated on the cams. Too stiff of a bar with too little flex means the sway control feature of the weight distribution bars are not at full effectiveness. And you can know the rating of the bars based on their size. There is a chart out there, I will post a link.

But this is all controversial stuff, so I gave up trying to make people understand. An airstream dealer out in CA showed me the way on sizing the weight bars to the suspension of the tow vehicle vs. The spec'd weights and going strictly by the book. It makes the ride and handling much better, and it better for the trailer long term, as all the stresses are not shifted to the weakest link, which is the materials used in the trailer.


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## Kevin K

Same trailer same intial sway problems. The trailer was to nose down and there wasn't enough weight transfer to the front. It is dialed in now and what a difference.


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## Carey

I know when I pulled rear kitchen or opposing slide rear entertainment bumper pull models, the sway was always worse than a more standard rv. Yes weight balance makes a huge difference.

I hear ya Paul, with this job I have now I cant spend the time defending my thoughts, so most of the time I just chuckle and move on to one of my trucking or hot rod forums.

To stop sway with an intergrated sway hitch the bars must be loaded to there full potential to create enough friction to creat a bind. So for 3/4 tons there is no set in stone rule. Its all about whatever it takes to stop it. There is a very fine line that must be met to get a safe combo when using a 3/4 ton. Many time instead of thinking larger one must think smaller.

With a 1/2 ton always buy bigger than actual hitch weight and then max out the hitch head angle. This will help stabilize the lighter sprung truck plus stop the sway too. Its easier to find the happy medium with a 1/2 ton.

Carey


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## CamperAndy

Carey and Paul it is a bit unfair to post comments that you think you know something others may not understand. Then say youeither don't have the time or that you feel you can have a laugh at their expense.

Sorry I don't agree with you.


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## KTMRacer

Colorado~DirtBikers said:


> To stop sway with an intergrated sway hitch the bars must be loaded to there full potential to create enough friction to creat a bind. So for 3/4 tons there is no set in stone rule. Its all about whatever it takes to stop it. There is a very fine line that must be met to get a safe combo when using a 3/4 ton. Many time instead of thinking larger one must think smaller.
> 
> Carey


with the DC I don't see how different bars would change the DC sway control characteristics assuming they are loaded to the same weight. 800lb bars with 800lbs on them or 1200lb bars with 800lbs on them will give the same force and friction on the cam detents and it will take more force to get the 1200lb bars to lift and slide off the detent than 800lb bars so I'd say the 1200 will give more sway control than lighter bars loaded to the same weight.


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## bowhunter2819

Please Check your require tire pressure on you TV. Most Manufactuers do not put the correct tires on your vehicle for towing. which if the sidewalls arent stiff enough you must have full required pressure to eliminate your extra sway


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## KTMRacer

bowhunter2819 said:


> Please Check your require tire pressure on you TV. Most Manufactuers do not put the correct tires on your vehicle for towing. which if the sidewalls arent stiff enough you must have full required pressure to eliminate your extra sway


a good point. lots of SUV's and 1/2 tons have P rated tires, which have pretty soft sidewalls and squirm. Updating to a LT tire LR C or up can help a lot. OP had a F250 diesel, which should have LR E tires on it, which even if inflated to 60lbs or so, should be plenty stiff, but you make an excellent point for smaller vehicles.


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## willingtonpaul

CamperAndy said:


> Carey and Paul it is a bit unfair to post comments that you think you know something others may not understand. Then say youeither don't have the time or that you feel you can have a laugh at their expense.
> 
> Sorry I don't agree with you.


well, with all due respect, i don't think i came across that way in my post. i will grant you that i should have used the word "believe" or phrase "try out another method" rather than "understand". given the context, however, it should have been clear that my comments were not meant to suggest that anyone here does not have the mental capacity to "understand" my point of view, but rather that most all of the time folks just are not willing to move away from the conventional line of thinking. i have posted comments about my feelings on proper dual cam setup here before on more than one thread, and the consensus is that any thinking "outside the book" from the manufacturer is not safe or recommended has always been the response (from everyone save carey). manufacturers do not adjust their recommendations based on the suspension of the tow vehicle, only the hitch weight, and i think that this is just plain ridiculous. i can dig up the old threads if you want, and IIRC you were active in them; the record can then speak for itself. that being said, if i offended you or any others in my post, i do apologize














; it certainly was not my intent. i can also re-post links to other sites that discuss this in more detail, if anyone is at all interested.









safe towing and happy camping !


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## willingtonpaul

KTMRacer said:


> To stop sway with an intergrated sway hitch the bars must be loaded to there full potential to create enough friction to creat a bind. So for 3/4 tons there is no set in stone rule. Its all about whatever it takes to stop it. There is a very fine line that must be met to get a safe combo when using a 3/4 ton. Many time instead of thinking larger one must think smaller.
> 
> Carey


with the DC I don't see how different bars would change the DC sway control characteristics assuming they are loaded to the same weight. 800lb bars with 800lbs on them or 1200lb bars with 800lbs on them will give the same force and friction on the cam detents and it will take more force to get the 1200lb bars to lift and slide off the detent than 800lb bars so I'd say the 1200 will give more sway control than lighter bars loaded to the same weight.
[/quote]

again, with all due respect, this is just not true. 800lb of load on an 800lb bar will flex the bar far more, and create more friction in the connection with the cam over a 1200lb bar loaded with an 800lb load. the 1200lb bars are made of thicker material, and will not flex as much, thus they will be able to be moved out of the seating with the cam easier. the amount of flex in the bars makes a huge difference. the stiffer bars only transfer more weight to the front of the tow vehicle and back to the trailer axles, as less is lost in the flex of the bar. and if your tow vehicle has a rugged and stiff suspension it in, like a 350/3500 series truck that is built for payload, then you neither want nor need to transfer weight to the front axle or back to the trailer.

http://www.inlandrv.com/articles/hitch-torsion-bar-story.html
http://home.hiwaay.net/~tomorkim/Reese.htm


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## Carey

willingtonpaul said:


> To stop sway with an intergrated sway hitch the bars must be loaded to there full potential to create enough friction to creat a bind. So for 3/4 tons there is no set in stone rule. Its all about whatever it takes to stop it. There is a very fine line that must be met to get a safe combo when using a 3/4 ton. Many time instead of thinking larger one must think smaller.
> 
> Carey


with the DC I don't see how different bars would change the DC sway control characteristics assuming they are loaded to the same weight. 800lb bars with 800lbs on them or 1200lb bars with 800lbs on them will give the same force and friction on the cam detents and it will take more force to get the 1200lb bars to lift and slide off the detent than 800lb bars so I'd say the 1200 will give more sway control than lighter bars loaded to the same weight.
[/quote]

again, with all due respect, this is just not true. 800lb of load on an 800lb bar will flex the bar far more, and create more friction in the connection with the cam over a 1200lb bar loaded with an 800lb load. the 1200lb bars are made of thicker material, and will not flex as much, thus they will be able to be moved out of the seating with the cam easier. the amount of flex in the bars makes a huge difference. the stiffer bars only transfer more weight to the front of the tow vehicle and back to the trailer axles, as less is lost in the flex of the bar. and if your tow vehicle has a rugged and stiff suspension it in, like a 350/3500 series truck that is built for payload, then you neither want nor need to transfer weight to the front axle or back to the trailer.

http://www.inlandrv.com/articles/hitch-torsion-bar-story.html
http://home.hiwaay.net/~tomorkim/Reese.htm
[/quote]

X2

Sorry Andy, but here we go again. Its all about creating a bind. It really doesnt matter what weight your hitch is. Its all about putting your weight bars at full tension AND if your truck is a 3/4 or up you dont need as much weight distribution as a 1/2 ton would. SO one should use a lighter bar so you can max out the bar to create max sway friction. This is how one can stop sway in a 3/4 ton large trailer combo and still have a very balanced rig and ride.

I could write all night, but my job doesnt allow it.

Carey


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## Carey

And for all the Equalizer brand lovers, the Reese SC is a direct competitor. I got to see all the hitches in use. The Dual Cam is best. But next is the Reese SC. The Equalizer was a worthless piece of garbage is what us RV Haulers found out. The Reese SC uses actual brake pad material for a friction surface and that surface is 4-5 inches long. The EQ hitch uses just a tiny piece of metal for friction.

SO, the amount of bar force needed to create friction in an EQ hitch is much higher than its direct competitor the Reese SC.

The Reese SC was what we all used. I would only use 1 bar on smaller trailers, and 2 bars on larger trailers. The amount of friction created by brake lining material is far higher than the tiny piece of metal EQ uses in a equal pound of force comparision.

We used Reese SC because we could install it in 15 mins and remove it in 15 mins. We would haul sometimes 4-5 different trailers per week. So for us the Reese SC was the hitch one could quickly setup and get max sway control out of. Its really a great hitch that few know about.

Heres a link to what we used. http://www.reese-hitches.com/products/Reese_SC_Weight_Distributing_Hitch__1_200_lbs_,66155


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## CamperAndy

You guys do know that the dual cam does not depend on friction to function but also on the loading rate of the cam as the trailer and truck go out of line. There is a friction component but the strength of the bars and the way they want to re-center is a much more active part of the sway control. With that in mind bigger bars may provide addition sway control but are not appropriate on smaller trailers due to the lower weights and how they will affect the ride quality without providing any additional sway control.

For every combination there is an ideal set up and there are set ups that work but may not be best. If I carried lots of heavy loads in my pick up I would have air bags to maintain ride stability and geometry. That said I would most likely air them down and use a WDH and sway control that was a closer match to the TV and trailer combination without adding in the air bag variable.

Carey I think the Reese SC is better then the Equal-i-zer for the reason you mentioned. Both of those are pure friction sway control and thus require that they be loaded to work correctly.

Anyway take time to post your opinion and in the end everyone is free to do as they wish on setting up their combination.


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## rdvholtwood

willingtonpaul said:


> To stop sway with an intergrated sway hitch the bars must be loaded to there full potential to create enough friction to creat a bind. So for 3/4 tons there is no set in stone rule. Its all about whatever it takes to stop it. There is a very fine line that must be met to get a safe combo when using a 3/4 ton. Many time instead of thinking larger one must think smaller.
> 
> Carey


with the DC I don't see how different bars would change the DC sway control characteristics assuming they are loaded to the same weight. 800lb bars with 800lbs on them or 1200lb bars with 800lbs on them will give the same force and friction on the cam detents and it will take more force to get the 1200lb bars to lift and slide off the detent than 800lb bars so I'd say the 1200 will give more sway control than lighter bars loaded to the same weight.
[/quote]

again, with all due respect, this is just not true. 800lb of load on an 800lb bar will flex the bar far more, and create more friction in the connection with the cam over a 1200lb bar loaded with an 800lb load. the 1200lb bars are made of thicker material, and will not flex as much, thus they will be able to be moved out of the seating with the cam easier. the amount of flex in the bars makes a huge difference. the stiffer bars only transfer more weight to the front of the tow vehicle and back to the trailer axles, as less is lost in the flex of the bar. and if your tow vehicle has a rugged and stiff suspension it in, like a 350/3500 series truck that is built for payload, then you neither want nor need to transfer weight to the front axle or back to the trailer.

http://www.inlandrv.com/articles/hitch-torsion-bar-story.html
http://home.hiwaay.net/~tomorkim/Reese.htm
[/quote]

Did either of you guys - Carey or Paul - see this post? clickhere
I read the articles you posted (Paul) and find them interesting as how it relates to my recent experience. I have a 3/4 ton and am using 1000lb bars. The back of my truck is usually loaded with firewood, etc, and I have yet to get it to a scale to get some weights. However, if I am reading and understanding these articles correctly - I wonder if based upon my stiff suspension with the 2500 RAm and the 1000lb bars - am I wonder if I am overhitched?

The nose of my TT is nose down somewhat and if I attempt to adjust the L bracket up I get a bend in my spring bars. Ironically, my front steps have lost 2 rivets during this season? and I am finding closet doors open towards the front?

Just trying to understand hear and correct the problem before I do any more damage.

So, not to change the subject, but what are your suggestions - a new hitch?


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## willingtonpaul

rdvholtwood said:


> To stop sway with an intergrated sway hitch the bars must be loaded to there full potential to create enough friction to creat a bind. So for 3/4 tons there is no set in stone rule. Its all about whatever it takes to stop it. There is a very fine line that must be met to get a safe combo when using a 3/4 ton. Many time instead of thinking larger one must think smaller.
> 
> Carey


with the DC I don't see how different bars would change the DC sway control characteristics assuming they are loaded to the same weight. 800lb bars with 800lbs on them or 1200lb bars with 800lbs on them will give the same force and friction on the cam detents and it will take more force to get the 1200lb bars to lift and slide off the detent than 800lb bars so I'd say the 1200 will give more sway control than lighter bars loaded to the same weight.
[/quote]

again, with all due respect, this is just not true. 800lb of load on an 800lb bar will flex the bar far more, and create more friction in the connection with the cam over a 1200lb bar loaded with an 800lb load. the 1200lb bars are made of thicker material, and will not flex as much, thus they will be able to be moved out of the seating with the cam easier. the amount of flex in the bars makes a huge difference. the stiffer bars only transfer more weight to the front of the tow vehicle and back to the trailer axles, as less is lost in the flex of the bar. and if your tow vehicle has a rugged and stiff suspension it in, like a 350/3500 series truck that is built for payload, then you neither want nor need to transfer weight to the front axle or back to the trailer.

http://www.inlandrv.com/articles/hitch-torsion-bar-story.html
http://home.hiwaay.net/~tomorkim/Reese.htm
[/quote]

Did either of you guys - Carey or Paul - see this post? clickhere
I read the articles you posted (Paul) and find them interesting as how it relates to my recent experience. I have a 3/4 ton and am using 1000lb bars. The back of my truck is usually loaded with firewood, etc, and I have yet to get it to a scale to get some weights. However, if I am reading and understanding these articles correctly - I wonder if based upon my stiff suspension with the 2500 RAm and the 1000lb bars - am I wonder if I am overhitched?

The nose of my TT is nose down somewhat and if I attempt to adjust the L bracket up I get a bend in my spring bars. Ironically, my front steps have lost 2 rivets during this season? and I am finding closet doors open towards the front?

Just trying to understand hear and correct the problem before I do any more damage.

So, not to change the subject, but what are your suggestions - a new hitch?
[/quote]

i did see this thread but did not really pay much attention to it. i have spent many, many hours playing with and perfecting the reese hitches, but have never used an equalizer. so i really know nothing about these hitches. i did see some threads on another board about the design change to the brackets though, to make them heavier. in my opinion, however, if you are bending and breaking things prematurely, then there is something wrong. and any evidence that the trailer itself is showing of being shaken to death points to a potential over-hitching problem, again IMHO. one of the features of the dual cam that has always been appealing to me is the vast interchangeability of the components between hitch heads, so you can mix and match heads and bars while simultaneously changing the hitch head angle. my very limited understanding of the equalizer is that it is somewhat difficult to switch bars without changing out the head as well. i know there are alot of very happy equalizer users out there, so i would think there has to be a way to dial in your setup to get it working properly for you. it seems like you have a good bit of time and money already invested in your current setup, so maybe switching now is not the most effective solution. then again, a fresh start might be the better answer, but only you can make that call.....


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## hautevue

rdvholtwood: popping rivets on the front steps? Closets towards the front open? Methinks thou dost have a problem.









Torque sufficient to pop rivets is a warning, I think. If I were towing and found that, I'd really look at the setup and see if I could diagnose whas' happenin'. It takes a lot of torque to pop a rivet, so your TT, TV and hitch (and its setup) are sending you a message...

Let us know what you find.


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## rdvholtwood

willingtonpaul said:


> To stop sway with an intergrated sway hitch the bars must be loaded to there full potential to create enough friction to creat a bind. So for 3/4 tons there is no set in stone rule. Its all about whatever it takes to stop it. There is a very fine line that must be met to get a safe combo when using a 3/4 ton. Many time instead of thinking larger one must think smaller.
> 
> Carey


with the DC I don't see how different bars would change the DC sway control characteristics assuming they are loaded to the same weight. 800lb bars with 800lbs on them or 1200lb bars with 800lbs on them will give the same force and friction on the cam detents and it will take more force to get the 1200lb bars to lift and slide off the detent than 800lb bars so I'd say the 1200 will give more sway control than lighter bars loaded to the same weight.
[/quote]

again, with all due respect, this is just not true. 800lb of load on an 800lb bar will flex the bar far more, and create more friction in the connection with the cam over a 1200lb bar loaded with an 800lb load. the 1200lb bars are made of thicker material, and will not flex as much, thus they will be able to be moved out of the seating with the cam easier. the amount of flex in the bars makes a huge difference. the stiffer bars only transfer more weight to the front of the tow vehicle and back to the trailer axles, as less is lost in the flex of the bar. and if your tow vehicle has a rugged and stiff suspension it in, like a 350/3500 series truck that is built for payload, then you neither want nor need to transfer weight to the front axle or back to the trailer.

http://www.inlandrv.com/articles/hitch-torsion-bar-story.html
http://home.hiwaay.net/~tomorkim/Reese.htm
[/quote]

Did either of you guys - Carey or Paul - see this post? clickhere
I read the articles you posted (Paul) and find them interesting as how it relates to my recent experience. I have a 3/4 ton and am using 1000lb bars. The back of my truck is usually loaded with firewood, etc, and I have yet to get it to a scale to get some weights. However, if I am reading and understanding these articles correctly - I wonder if based upon my stiff suspension with the 2500 RAm and the 1000lb bars - am I wonder if I am overhitched?

The nose of my TT is nose down somewhat and if I attempt to adjust the L bracket up I get a bend in my spring bars. Ironically, my front steps have lost 2 rivets during this season? and I am finding closet doors open towards the front?

Just trying to understand hear and correct the problem before I do any more damage.

So, not to change the subject, but what are your suggestions - a new hitch?
[/quote]

i did see this thread but did not really pay much attention to it. i have spent many, many hours playing with and perfecting the reese hitches, but have never used an equalizer. so i really know nothing about these hitches. i did see some threads on another board about the design change to the brackets though, to make them heavier. in my opinion, however, if you are bending and breaking things prematurely, then there is something wrong. and any evidence that the trailer itself is showing of being shaken to death points to a potential over-hitching problem, again IMHO. one of the features of the dual cam that has always been appealing to me is the vast interchangeability of the components between hitch heads, so you can mix and match heads and bars while simultaneously changing the hitch head angle. my very limited understanding of the equalizer is that it is somewhat difficult to switch bars without changing out the head as well. i know there are alot of very happy equalizer users out there, so i would think there has to be a way to dial in your setup to get it working properly for you. it seems like you have a good bit of time and money already invested in your current setup, so maybe switching now is not the most effective solution. then again, a fresh start might be the better answer, but only you can make that call.....
[/quote]

I guess I was thinking in more general terms - that this could apply to any flavor hitch - especially if a re-design of parts occur that work in conjunction with sway control.


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## rdvholtwood

hautevue said:


> rdvholtwood: popping rivets on the front steps? Closets towards the front open? Methinks thou dost have a problem.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Torque sufficient to pop rivets is a warning, I think. If I were towing and found that, I'd really look at the setup and see if I could diagnose whas' happenin'. It takes a lot of torque to pop a rivet, so your TT, TV and hitch (and its setup) are sending you a message...
> 
> Let us know what you find.


It could also be these rough Pennsylvania roads.....


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## bowhunter2819

KTMRacer said:


> Please Check your require tire pressure on you TV. Most Manufactuers do not put the correct tires on your vehicle for towing. which if the sidewalls arent stiff enough you must have full required pressure to eliminate your extra sway


a good point. lots of SUV's and 1/2 tons have P rated tires, which have pretty soft sidewalls and squirm. Updating to a LT tire LR C or up can help a lot. OP had a F250 diesel, which should have LR E tires on it, which even if inflated to 60lbs or so, should be plenty stiff, but you make an excellent point for smaller vehicles.
[/quote]

My Ram 2500 MEgacab Cam with D rated tires. The man is getting extra cheap when throwing these trucks togeather


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## Carey

Andy I agree that the dual cam is a different animal then the friction type hitches. I also agree that the dual cam needs to be closely matched to actual hitch weight for it to work properly. And you may not need air bags for your setup. But.

Here is what I love about air bags. In dash adjustabilty!

Here is what I did when hauling rvs. I would air the bags to around 50psi. I would then Lay the hitch head back at 90%. I would get my hitch all set up, then lower the bags to say 30psi. This would force the bars to load even more since the truck would lower itself at 30psi.

Now here is what I loved. In high winds I could lower the air to say 5psi and load the bars more for better sway control. Then in town over dips, such as fuel stops etc. I could unload the bars so I wouldnt damage the hitch or the new trailer. You guys breaking parts, that can be stopped if you used air bags to change your bar loading in bad situations.

Yes I was using a pure friction hitch. With the addition of the air bags I could control the bar load from inside of the cab which in turn controlled friction.

The greatest thing is when you are going off of the interstate you can air up since sway control is no longer needed. You can tool all around over dips or whatever with no worry of snapping parts like you did Holtwood. And no I missed your post. Thanks for posting that.

The problem with the EQ hitch is you have to have heavy loading of the bars to get sway control. Since your friction point is only 1/2 an inch, your suspectabilty to break parts is high. The Reese SC doesnt need as much loading to creat friction. When it is loaded though it has a much better friction spot then EQ and its design cannot break as easy as EQ.

The perfect hitch.. The Equalizer hitch head and bar style combined with the Reese SC brake pad friction point. The EQ hitch head is a far better design than the Reese SC. The Reese SC has a far better design friction point. Wish a company would combine these two together!

Man I got to be up early to chase semi truck parts. Have more ideas in my head, just no time to write them. lol

Yes Holtwood Id try something different too. Do you know your static tongue weight?

Carey


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## rdvholtwood

I am currently discussing the concerns I have with Progress Manufacturing (Equalizer hitch) to determine the ideal setup for my TV. I like the air bag idea that Dirtbikers had suggested.

Once everything is figured out - it maybe a good idea to post something (like the articles) here on OB's for reference.

Rick


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## marker

hautevue said:


> Concur w/above solutions.
> 
> The 312BH factory ship weight is 7600. Add 1000 for your "stuff", propane, some fresh water, etc. and you're towing 8600.
> 
> Check the tongue weight, "fer sure". Find a commercial trucker's scale guy, call them up and get a time when they can have you block the scales for 15 minutes. Ours locally was very cooperative. Then
> 
> 1. drive up and pull the TV and TT onto the scales. Weight it without you in the TV but carry what you normally tow with--tools? generator? etc. I got 3 weights: total (TV and TT), TV front wheels off the scale, TV both wheels off the scale.
> 
> 2. Back up the TT so that only the hitch jack is on the scales. Unhitch, and drive the TV off the scales. Weigh the TT. That gives you the hitch weight.
> 
> 3. Back up the TV, hitch up, leaving the TT wheels on the concrete. Weigh the TV. Drive forward and back so the operator gets the weight on the front wheels and the rear wheels separately. That will show you the weight transfer.
> 
> This should give you the weight numbers for your calcs. The calcs can be found on this site, too.
> 
> I fully concur about a super good hitch--I tow about 7000 pounds with the TT loaded, and have a Husky WD hitch (800# - 1200# bars) and one friction sway bar. It works fine, but I really pay attention when I'm tooling along the Interstate at 55 - 60 and it's windy and there are 18-wheelers passing me. No significant sway, but I'm sure I'm near the limit of what sway my setup can handle. Any more weight and I'd definitely upgrade the hitch to a Reese or Hensley or Propride or equivalent. Plus my TT is 30' and yours is 35' long. And I seldom tow with the fresh tank holding more than 5 gallons (except when boondocking). Saving 25 gallons of weight saves hauling 200 pounds around.
> 
> I also agree that your tongue weight may be significantly off, and the weighing process will help identify that. 12% of 8500 pounds is 1020 tongue weight--if you're a lot over that (or under that), you may be outside the limits of safety.


Most commercial scales (say at a Flying J ect) provide TV front; TV rear, and Trailer axels (ie 3 readings at once). Then all you need is to unhook and weigh the TV seperately. To go even further, you should weigh with the weight distribution hooked up and unhooked so you know where you stand there as well.

The actual weights are most revealing!


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## willingtonpaul

rdvholtwood said:


> I am currently discussing the concerns I have with Progress Manufacturing (Equalizer hitch) to determine the ideal setup for my TV. I like the air bag idea that Dirtbikers had suggested.
> 
> Once everything is figured out - it maybe a good idea to post something (like the articles) here on OB's for reference.
> 
> Rick


are you making any forward / positive progress here ?


----------



## rdvholtwood

willingtonpaul said:


> I am currently discussing the concerns I have with Progress Manufacturing (Equalizer hitch) to determine the ideal setup for my TV. I like the air bag idea that Dirtbikers had suggested.
> 
> Once everything is figured out - it maybe a good idea to post something (like the articles) here on OB's for reference.
> 
> Rick


are you making any forward / positive progress here ?
[/quote]

Actually, I am glad you asked, as I am finally finished with my setup.

Last week I took the OB to a weigh station close by and was able to get some measurements. While the measurements reflected "base" measurements, I was able to get an idea of where the weight was distributed. As suspected, my front was much lighter. The tongue weighed in at 900lbs and when I initially set up my equalizer, I was using a much lighter guessed weight.

I completely overhauled my hitch (took it apart, cleaned up the rust, painted it, and replaced the 3/4 washers) and re- assembled using an extra washer making a total of 7 washers. The leveled TT height was 24" and the ball height measured in at around 25 1/8" - which per the installation manual was right on for a 900 lb tongue weight for a 3/4 ton truck. After hitching the trailer and WD bars, and measuring the front and rear wheel wells, I noted that there was only about a 1/2 difference between front and back - which I was happy with. The front of the TV no longer looked like it was higher and the rear looked a lot more level.

I haven't taken it out for a test run, but, after talking with Daniel at Progress yesterday, we both feel that the hitch is not dialed in correctly. I am planning on sometime next week taking the TT back to the weigh station to take repeat measurements to compare them to the base measurements taken before the adjustment.

We are heading out this weekend and camping locally, so I will post back and let everyone know how the new setup worked.

Rick


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## willingtonpaul

rdvholtwood said:


> I am currently discussing the concerns I have with Progress Manufacturing (Equalizer hitch) to determine the ideal setup for my TV. I like the air bag idea that Dirtbikers had suggested.
> 
> Once everything is figured out - it maybe a good idea to post something (like the articles) here on OB's for reference.
> 
> Rick


are you making any forward / positive progress here ?
[/quote]

Actually, I am glad you asked, as I am finally finished with my setup.

Last week I took the OB to a weigh station close by and was able to get some measurements. While the measurements reflected "base" measurements, I was able to get an idea of where the weight was distributed. As suspected, my front was much lighter. The tongue weighed in at 900lbs and when I initially set up my equalizer, I was using a much lighter guessed weight.

I completely overhauled my hitch (took it apart, cleaned up the rust, painted it, and replaced the 3/4 washers) and re- assembled using an extra washer making a total of 7 washers. The leveled TT height was 24" and the ball height measured in at around 25 1/8" - which per the installation manual was right on for a 900 lb tongue weight for a 3/4 ton truck. After hitching the trailer and WD bars, and measuring the front and rear wheel wells, I noted that there was only about a 1/2 difference between front and back - which I was happy with. The front of the TV no longer looked like it was higher and the rear looked a lot more level.

I haven't taken it out for a test run, but, after talking with Daniel at Progress yesterday, we both feel that the hitch is not dialed in correctly. I am planning on sometime next week taking the TT back to the weigh station to take repeat measurements to compare them to the base measurements taken before the adjustment.

We are heading out this weekend and camping locally, so I will post back and let everyone know how the new setup worked.

Rick
[/quote]

sweet. looking forward to hearing about the experience of the next trip...


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## willingtonpaul

any more progress here ?


----------



## bandrelectric

willingtonpaul said:


> To stop sway with an intergrated sway hitch the bars must be loaded to there full potential to create enough friction to creat a bind. So for 3/4 tons there is no set in stone rule. Its all about whatever it takes to stop it. There is a very fine line that must be met to get a safe combo when using a 3/4 ton. Many time instead of thinking larger one must think smaller.
> 
> Carey


with the DC I don't see how different bars would change the DC sway control characteristics assuming they are loaded to the same weight. 800lb bars with 800lbs on them or 1200lb bars with 800lbs on them will give the same force and friction on the cam detents and it will take more force to get the 1200lb bars to lift and slide off the detent than 800lb bars so I'd say the 1200 will give more sway control than lighter bars loaded to the same weight.
[/quote]

again, with all due respect, this is just not true. 800lb of load on an 800lb bar will flex the bar far more, and create more friction in the connection with the cam over a 1200lb bar loaded with an 800lb load. the 1200lb bars are made of thicker material, and will not flex as much, thus they will be able to be moved out of the seating with the cam easier. the amount of flex in the bars makes a huge difference. the stiffer bars only transfer more weight to the front of the tow vehicle and back to the trailer axles, as less is lost in the flex of the bar. and if your tow vehicle has a rugged and stiff suspension it in, like a 350/3500 series truck that is built for payload, then you neither want nor need to transfer weight to the front axle or back to the trailer.

http://www.inlandrv.com/articles/hitch-torsion-bar-story.html
http://home.hiwaay.net/~tomorkim/Reese.htm
[/quote]

I think you are right. I just got back from my trip and used several different links on the wd bars. I found that i really do not need to distribute much weight at all. When i put a bunch of weight to the front of my truck the sway was terrible.......no weight to the front not very much sway.

Thank you everyone for all of your posts. It has been very educational and helped me alot.


----------



## willingtonpaul

all i want is to have your rig tow behind your truck like the hitch manufacturer designed it to, and have it do it safely, comfortably, and without undue damage to your trailer over the long term. and i am glad that you are making progress ! and thanks for the thanks, but i did not get my setup dialed in like it is without help from others, so i am happy to try to help. but it really is critical to have the hitch set up to use 5 links in service properly. so just make sure that 5 links are in service with the correct rating weight distribution bars (based on the rating of the suspension of the tow vehicle, NOT the tongue weight) and hitch head angle. give us some photos of the setup at some point.....


----------

