# Sticky  Black Tank 101



## camping479

I think I've finally got this black tank thing figured out after lots of frustration and leftover odors.

I first started using nothing but a sewer hose to drain, that didn't work as the tank never seemed to drain completely and would always smell really bad the next time we went out, so I needed to do something.

Enter the flush king. I though this would solve the problem. The only thing was it took forever and lots of water to do the trick. I would spend 45 minutes flushing away and the tank still would have some "residue" in it. The kids would be in the truck and my wife sitting on the bumper patiently waiting for me to finish so we could hook up and go.

So my next step was to get a quickie flush, it was a bit of a pain to install, but it has really done the trick as far as cleaning the tank. I empty the tank and turn on the quickie flush and let it clean away while I do other things. After five minutes or so (y-guy turned me onto this) I close the flush king valve and let the tank fill up and then drain it. I now have a squeaky clean black tank.

To clean it even better, I've started using calgon water softener (got that tip from the thread on the GEO method). When I emptied the tank today and backfilled it, the water had all this scaly stuff in it which I am asuming is buildup coming off of the sides of the tank due to the water softener.

These few things have cut my black tank cleanup time by 3/4 compared to the flush king alone and produce a clean, odor free tank. We don't really do any dry camping, but one advantage of the quickie flush at a dump station would be it is pretty quick, a 2 or three minute flushing would be good enough to get the tank just about completely clean.

Mike


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## Travelers Rest

Hi, want to elaborate on the Calgon method for those of us that didn't read that thread?

Thanks...

Is there such a thing as a squeeky clean black tank??









Steve


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## Thor

Mike

With the quikie flush installed how have your sensor readings been?
Do you still add the blue stuff to help breakdown and control odor?

Thor


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## camping479

My sensors work great now. I still use tank treatment. I buy odorloss packets from camping world. It has no odor and is supposed to lubricate the valves too.

Here's the GEO method, I downloaded it off of RV.NET.

Everyone who owns an RV should be concerned with maintaining its wastewater tanks. Problems with wastewater tanks that can be avoided should be avoided. Wastewater tank repair is expensive. Due to health concerns, many service facilities will not work on wastewater tanks and lines until the tanks have been completely emptied and sanitized. This may be quite difficult when the tank(s) is in need of repair. So, common sense dictates that the tanks should be kept relatively clean at all times. Additionally, improper use of the wastewater tanks can lead to a build up of solid wastes, which in itself may cause the system to fail.

Iâ€™ve discovered very simple, effective, and inexpensive methods of maintaining my wastewater tanks in a relatively clean condition at all times. I developed these methods myself through my understanding of chemistry, physics, and biology with a smidgen of common sense thrown in for good measure. I also read my RV ownerâ€™s manual. Although we are not full time RVers we use our fifth wheel camper at least one weekend a month. We never use public bathing and toilet facilities. In other words, our wastewater tanks are fairly heavily used. Since IÂ¡Â¦ve met a number of RVers who donâ€™t seem to know how to maintain their wastewater tanks I thought many RVers would find my tips useful. If you have not been maintaining your tanks I believe you will be pleasantly surprised the first time you employ these tips. I do these things and they work.

1. DUMP A FULL TANK

When you are camping and your RV is connected to a sewer/septic intake, leave the drain valves closed until the tank is full and ready to dump. Dumping a full tank provides a sufficient quantity of water to flush solids from the tank. Leaving the drain valves open allows the water to drain off without flushing out solid waste. That solid waste will collect in the tank(s) and cause problems over time.

2. DUMP TANKS IN ORDER FROM DIRTIEST TO CLEANEST

In other words, dump the black (commode) water tank first, then dump the galley tank, then dump the shower and bathroom sink tank. This way you will be flushing out the dirtiest water with progressively cleaner water.

3. USE WATER SOFTENER

**Calgon Water Softener link**

This stuff is amazing and it works. Buy a couple of boxes of powdered water softener at the grocery store. Youâ€™ll find it located with or near the laundry detergent products. I prefer Calgon Water Softener because it dissolves quickly in water. Cheaper water softeners work just as well but dissolve more slowly. Dissolve two (2) cups of the water softener in a gallon of hot water. Then, pour the solution down the drain into the empty tank. Use two cups of softener for each wastewater tank in your RV. The tankâ€™s drain valve should be closed otherwise the softened water will just drain out. Then use the tank(s) normally until it is full and drain it normally. Add a cup of laundry detergent to the black (commode) water tank at the same time. This will help clean the tank. The gray water tanks should already contain soap through normal use.

The water softener makes the solid waste let go from the sides of the tanks. If youâ€™ve ever taken a shower in softened water you know that after rinsing the soap from your body your skin will feel slick. Thatâ€™s because all the soap rinses away with soft water. Softened water also prevents soap scum from sticking in the tub. Get the connection? With softened water gunk washes away instead of sticking. The same thing applies to your RVÂ¡Â¦s wastewater tanks.

I use one of those clear plastic elbow connectors to attach my sewer drain line to the wastewater outlet on my RV. It allows me to see how well things are progressing during a wastewater dump. Before I began using water softener regularly the black water tankâ€™s water was brown, the galley tankâ€™s water was brownish, and the bathroom tankâ€™s water was white. The first time I added water softener to the tanks the water coming from the black water tank was actually black (not brown) and the kitchen tankâ€™s water was also black (not brownish). The bathroom tankâ€™s water remained white. That told me that the water softener had actually done what I had intended for it to do and made solid waste, which had been stuck to the interior of the tanks, let go and drain away. I added water softener to all the wastewater tanks for the next few dumps to be certain all the solid waste possible had been cleaned away. The wastewater only appeared black on the initial treatment. I now add water softener to each tank once after every few dumps to maintain the system.

Occasionally, I pour a gallon of liquid bleach into each tank to sanitize and disinfect them. I no longer use the blue toilet chemical because it isnâ€™t necessary. I have no odors coming from my black water tank. Generic brand liquid bleach is cheap and very effective.

4. USE A WATER FILTER ON YOUR FRESH WATER INTAKE LINE

Most fresh water contains sediment. Sediment will accumulate in your wastewater tanks and your fresh water lines. It also tends to discolor your sinks, tub/shower, and commode. I use the disposable type and have found that they eventually fill up and begin restricting the fresh water flow resulting in low pressure. Thatâ€™s how I know itâ€™s time to get a new filter. It works, itâ€™s cheap, it avoids problems, do it.

SOME OTHER THOUGHTS

-- I believe occasionally traveling with partially filled wastewater tanks that contain softened water promotes cleaning by agitating the water. The same goes for chlorine bleach. 
-- I believe this process works faster and more efficiently during warm weather. However, I know it works well even during cool/cold weather. 
-- I believe the process works best the longer the water softener remains in the tanks. So, I donâ€™t add water softener during periods of heavy wastewater generation. I wait until I know we wonâ€™t be generating wastewater quickly so that the softened water remains in the tanks for several days before dumping. 
-- I add a small amount of chlorine bleach to the fresh water tank twice a year to disinfect and sanitize the fresh water tank and fresh water lines. A weak chlorine bleach solution will not hurt you. However, it certainly makes the water taste bad. When we have chlorine in the fresh water system we use bottled water for drinking and cooking until the chlorine is gone. 
-- My tanks are plastic and my pipes are PVC. 
-- Donâ€™t be afraid to use your tanks. Just use common sense about their care and maintenance. 
-- These tips are inexpensive to do. Some of them donâ€™t cost anything. You have nothing to lose in trying them and I encourage you to do so. I actually feel a certain amount of pride in the condition and cleanliness of both my waste and fresh water systems. Naturally, these tips make dumping a much more pleasant and sanitary procedure. 
-- If you have odors in any of your water systems these procedures should eliminate them. Odors indicate a sanitary problem and degrade the enjoyment you derive from your RV. 
-- When my RV is parked and not in use I place stoppers in my sink and tub drains. This allows the wastewater tanks to vent through the vent pipes to the outside instead of through the drains into the RV.

Mike


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## hatcityhosehauler

My experiences are almost the same as Mikes, except I don't have a quickie flush.....yet. The calgon seems to help remarkably with odor, and the solids being released from the tank sides. I have also added a 1/2 cup of Tide to the tank also.

Tim


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## Thor

I already use soften water. I have a well at home. I never thought about the soap idea. Just added it to the book of tricks.

Thanks
Thor


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## NDJollyMon

Excellent post Mike! Thanks...mine needs a good cleaning b4 storage.


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## kjp1969

My routine: On leaving the campsite, I dump the black tank and the grey tank, no flushing. When we get home, I use a home-made wand thingey that blasts the inside of the black tank with hose water, and also fills the black tank back up. Usually the next day I take the trailer to the storage yard with the black tank full and sloshing around (a 10 miles drive) Then I dump again, fill with a couple of gallons of water, and a dose of blue stuff. So far so good- no smells. I'm going to pick up some of that water softener, though, just to try it out.

Kevin P.


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## Parker Outbacker

Boy I learn something new everyday









Great info for us newbies. Water softner in the tank







who would have thought. Just printed the article.

I think I'm going to create a binder with some of this stuff, just to keep handy.

Ron


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## Oregon_Camper

Parker Outbacker said:


> Boy I learn something new everyday
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> Great info for us newbies. Water softner in the tank
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Y-Guy had a nice binder when I bought his trailer. Think I've add another 50 pages to that already. Can't have too much information for the trailer...


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## campntn

I guess I keep it too simple:
As I leave the campsite, I dump my tanks, pour in some tank deodorant mixed in a gallon of water, let it slosh around on the way home, then open the tanks and dump that. (we live very isolated







) all the solids and such just come out.
We've only been on 3 or 4 trips with it and so far, no odors or problems. I think if I end up having to do one, I'd prob look at that new Tornado flush thing. or stick with quickie flush. 
Mark


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## Reverie

This forum thread is brilliant. Is there any way to pin it so we can access it quickly? This subject comes up all the time and it almost always comes back to these techniques.

Reverie


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## camping479

Pinned

Mike


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## kk5fe

camping479 said:


> .........After five minutes or so (y-guy turned me onto this) I close the flush king valve and let the tank fill up and then drain it. I now have a squeaky clean black tank.
> [snapback]13525[/snapback]​


I have been doing this too, but I just wanted to add that when my dealer put in my quickie flush he warned me not to close the valve while the water is on as it possibly could burst the tank since the toilet valve is pretty air tight. What I have been doing is I bring a short dowel stick and open the toilet valve and put it in so air can come out while I fill it up.
Just donâ€™t go away while this is running..... it fills fairly quick!


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## California Jim

Actually your black tank is vented through the roof, so no need to prop open the toilet







But you do need to keep an eye on it lest you forget you're filling the tank. I actually got distracted once and almost made a mess


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## Fire44

Me too....and I was using a hose going down through the toilet....

I guess that I'm not as dumb as my DW says!!!

Gary


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## kk5fe

California Jim said:


> Actually your black tank is vented through the roof, so no need to prop open the toilet
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Hmmm.... ok, good to know!







I was just going by what the dealer told me... go figure.

Thats why I love this forum!









Thanks California Jim


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## Forgiven_One

Great article, I just printed it out so I can be prepared for our first trip during memorial day. Cant wait to try out our new Outback.


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## campntn

Great timing. I was at WalMart today and picked up one of those wand thingies in the RV section that I sprayed out my tank with. It sprays in a 360 degree. First time I've done that. Very lil if any reside came out. I was pleased. Like I said earlier, I usually just empty at exit the campground, pour a lil bit o tank deo mixed in a gallon h20 back in, let it slosh around on way home, then drain black tank again.
One of those flush things would be kewl though.


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## TheBoyds

We do the same but we will add a bag of ice to the black tank and the drive back the ice will break up and clean the tank even more. We then dump the tank near the house

Brian


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## campntn

WOW!! There's an idea. Someone in your house must have worked as a waiter/waitress. I was a waiter in college, that's how we cleaned burnt coffee pots. Did you add salt with the ice, then jiggle while goin down the road?


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## njdmmoe

Dude, feces is foul man. Blech.


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## campntn

Dude, can't speak for everyone else, but ain't no feces in my tank. #1's only.


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## chuone

Reverie said:


> This forum thread is brilliant. Is there any way to pin it so we can access it quickly? This subject comes up all the time and it almost always comes back to these techniques.
> 
> Reverie
> [snapback]36072[/snapback]​


Had any problems with the Decals peeling,Cracking and the color Graphics and paint fading or changing colors?


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## debkirkland

Hi all. I'm new here and just wanted to make a suggestion. Baking soda is an excellent water softener and much cheaper than Calgon. Try it in the dishwater next time you do dishes and you'll see what I mean.

Also, for a great info on sewage stuff and a cheap ingenious way to clean your black tank, see this link:
http://www.phrannie.org/macerator.html

Blessings,
Debbie K.


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## DRM

<We have camped in the past for four years with coleman niagara pop-up to skamper then to Outback 28 BHS - My husband was so amazed by the manufacturer demonstration and the durablity of the Outback we traded in and love it.

But the main issue we have was the black tank smell. My husband used the wand everytime we dumped and we used the deordorant packets. But this still did not do the job. It was embarrassing to let anyone other then my family use our bathroom.

Mike, thanks for the ideas we just had the king flush installed at Camping World and we will try the calgon water softner.

Annette and Don Messner
Pennsylvania


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## Highlander96

DRM,

Make sure to add a little laundry detergent as well. Make sure you do the calgon treatment before you leave home to give the opportunity to "swish"







around in the tank. I think you will be amazed!









My $.02!
















Tim


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## prchoudh

Something also to consider besides using the Calgon method, is to also leave the tank valves open when you store it and let the tanks air out. I have an old cap that I use in addition to using screen mesh to cover the opening on the capadn that keeps odors out while you store the trailer.

I must confess though, I am very dissapointed with Keystone quality. I had a Class A MH Winebago before this and had no where near the quality problems that I have with my TT. For example, the smells, adjustment issues and such. Would I buy another Keystone? There are days that I wonder. However, this issue is for a different thread.


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## debkirkland

DRM said:


> But the main issue we have was the black tank smell. My husband used the wand everytime we dumped and we used the deordorant packets. But this still did not do the job.
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DRM,

No matter how bad it stinks, it should not smell in the camper unless it is not venting properly. All the gas that is building up in the tank, should vent through the roof, unless the tank is nearly full or the end of the vent pipe is under water and the gas has no place else to go other than into the camper every time you flush. If your tank is venting properly, the only advantage of a quickie flush is not to prevent the smell, but rather rinse out any sediment that is on the bottom of the tank (if you feel the need) or settled on the sensors resulting in a false level reading.

Please read this link. I posted the link above, but the title may have thrown you off since you are not concerned with macerators. The beginning of the article covers basic sewage stuff before going into macerators. It explains how to tell if your vent pipe is out of position and what to do about it.

I hope you find the article helpful.


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## Jay8256

A friend told me several years ago to us Arm & Hammer Laundry Detergent after dumping he adds a scoop and 5 gallons of water for the trip home. I started using it and it really does work. Then I either RV Today or Good Sams had the Calgon tip, so now I use both. We have a RV port at the house with full hook up so I can dump when I get home and the leave the tank open for a day or two to dry. Before we leave on the next trip it is another scoop of Arm & Hammer, Calgon and 5 gallons of water. I do not use any type of deoderant or other additives... 
I also always fill my tanks before I dump, then fill them with water and dump again..
Jim


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## Jay8256

kk5fe said:


> camping479 said:
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> .........After five minutes or so (y-guy turned me onto this) I close the flush king valve and let the tank fill up and then drain it. I now have a squeaky clean black tank.
> [snapback]13525[/snapback]​
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> 
> I have been doing this too, but I just wanted to add that when my dealer put in my quickie flush he warned me not to close the valve while the water is on as it possibly could burst the tank since the toilet valve is pretty air tight. What I have been doing is I bring a short dowel stick and open the toilet valve and put it in so air can come out while I fill it up.
> Just donâ€™t go away while this is running..... it fills fairly quick!
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Click to expand...

kk5fe,
If I read correctly you are in south east louisianna..... We are in south west texas Port Neches.... about 20 miles form the boarder.... We be neighbors.... Have been to a few Louisianna Parks, S. Toledo Bend, Lake Fausse Point, John Paul Jones... We travel to a lot of festivals between here and Lafayette..... Going to the CFMA Awards in Lafayette 8-8 - 8-21.... If you like Cajun Music it is at the Blackham Coliseum they have RV parking at the Coliseum...

Jim


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## Crawfish

This has been some good reading, learned a lot, thanks.

"*Let's Go Camping*"

Crawfish


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## h2oman

About the Calgon. This is my two cents. Chemically speaking this should work as described. I caution its over use though. This water(Calgon) or any type of deionized (RO, distilled, softened etc) water will seek to combine with whatever is at hand. Thus, it combines with the solids and pulls them off of the walls of your tank. You must understand that this water is doing the same thing to the inside of your tank and other plumbing it comes in contact with. Anything in the plastic or metal that it can combine with it will. This will over a period of time degrade any and all plumbing. I'm not advocating hyseria here. By all means do it. Mostly at the end of a long trip prior to storage of your rig. It really should work. You may just consider not doing it constantly. It is difficult enough getting Keystone to warranty its products. This is an area you don't want to go to.


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## tdvffjohn

Calgon will degrade how?


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## OutbackPM

As I understand it softened water has a higher Ph level than regular tap water so attacks impurities in the copper fittings so you can get pin hole leaks. I had this in one of my houses and it was thought to have been caused by the water softener. I was told thet platic pipe in not effected this way.

In the holding tank is there anything for it to work on? I think its just a Plastic tank and plastic valve.

David


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## tdvffjohn

With the acids in urine and the chemicals that we can use to break down what is in the black tank, I do not see what Calgon could do. The style PVC pipe that is used for the piping and valves I do not think quaulifies as plastic so to speak. Harming the rubber gasket I do not see.

A better explanation and why.....

John


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## h2oman

Not pH. Due to it's deionization it leaves charged molecules looking to bond with another charge. As has been noted that can be copper and or any other type of pipe material. It can seriously weaken the walls of tanks and pipes causing leaks. Hard water, or water high in mineral content (most specifically calcium carbonate) is non- agressive/corrosive due to the fact that all of its ions are bonded. Hard water will actually leave a crust on the inside of pipe that prevents water from stripping material off of the inside of the pipe. It is the complete opposite with soft or deionized water. Depending on what it is stipping off this can lead to an increase or decrease in pH.


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## Lmbevard

h2oman said:


> Not pH. Due to it's deionization it leaves charged molecules looking to bond with another charge. As has been noted that can be copper and or any other type of pipe material. It can seriously weaken the walls of tanks and pipes causing leaks. Hard water, or water high in mineral content (most specifically calcium carbonate) is non- agressive/corrosive due to the fact that all of its ions are bonded. Hard water will actually leave a crust on the inside of pipe that prevents water from stripping material off of the inside of the pipe. It is the complete opposite with soft or deionized water. Depending on what it is stipping off this can lead to an increase or decrease in pH.
> [snapback]66880[/snapback]​


I would have to disagree. The plastic should not be effected by soften/deionized water. After all, simular plastics are used to handle stong acids and bases all of the time in industrues. Deionized water will desolve more stuff than regular water so if you have older pipes in a house and then start using a deionizer, it would desolve impueities and could cause leaks in fittings that had filled with lime. It would not harm a plastic tank.


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## h2oman

Lmbevard said:


> h2oman said:
> 
> 
> 
> Not pH.Â Due to it's deionization it leaves charged molecules looking to bond with another charge.Â As has been noted that can be copper and or any other type of pipe material.Â It can seriously weaken the walls of tanks and pipes causing leaks.Â Hard water, or water high in mineral content (most specifically calcium carbonate) is non- agressive/corrosive due to the fact that all of its ions are bonded.Â Hard water will actually leave a crust on the inside of pipe that prevents water from stripping material off of the inside of the pipe.Â It is the complete opposite with soft or deionized water.Â Depending on what it is stipping off this can lead to an increase or decrease in pH.
> [snapback]66880[/snapback]​
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> I would have to disagree. The plastic should not be effected by soften/deionized water. After all, simular plastics are used to handle stong acids and bases all of the time in industrues. Deionized water will desolve more stuff than regular water so if you have older pipes in a house and then start using a deionizer, it would desolve impueities and could cause leaks in fittings that had filled with lime. It would not harm a plastic tank.
> [snapback]92928[/snapback]​
Click to expand...

Correct on the pH. Any flexible plastic or rubber fittings will have the plastisizers stripped out and they will fail. Including pvc glue.


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## h2oman

h2oman said:


> Lmbevard said:
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> h2oman said:
> 
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> Not pH.Â Due to it's deionization it leaves charged molecules looking to bond with another charge.Â As has been noted that can be copper and or any other type of pipe material.Â It can seriously weaken the walls of tanks and pipes causing leaks.Â Hard water, or water high in mineral content (most specifically calcium carbonate) is non- agressive/corrosive due to the fact that all of its ions are bonded.Â Hard water will actually leave a crust on the inside of pipe that prevents water from stripping material off of the inside of the pipe.Â It is the complete opposite with soft or deionized water.Â Depending on what it is stipping off this can lead to an increase or decrease in pH.
> [snapback]66880[/snapback]​
> 
> 
> 
> I would have to disagree. The plastic should not be effected by soften/deionized water. After all, simular plastics are used to handle stong acids and bases all of the time in industrues. Deionized water will desolve more stuff than regular water so if you have older pipes in a house and then start using a deionizer, it would desolve impueities and could cause leaks in fittings that had filled with lime. It would not harm a plastic tank.
> [snapback]92928[/snapback]​
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Correct on the pH. Any flexible plastic or rubber fittings will have the plastisizers stripped out and they will fail. Including pvc glue.
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Click to expand...

Actually, I'm going to take that back. There is no free ride for pH either. I don't wish to get caught up in flaming so I'll just speak my part and you can take it for what it is worth. I've been in the water industry for 25 years. I started running heavy equipment when I was 17 and put myself through college doing it. I studied water science at Rancho Santiago College, Cal State Fullerton, and Cal State Sacramento. I am a certified State of California Grade 5 Water Distribution System Operator and a California State Grade 2 Water Treatment Plant Operator. I am a Senior Water Quality Scientist at a water utility that serves 350,000 people. 
All plastics are not created equal. Those of you that have dirt bikes and quads can testify to this. How many times have you put your bikes away for a period of time only to find that there isn't as much gas in your tanks later? Where did it go? You also have to have specially perforated decals for your plastic tanks. The reason is because the gas vapors go right through the tank. If not for the perforations your decals would fall right off. When we get new storage tanks for out treatment plant chemicals we have to use tanks pre specified by industry standards for that specific chemical. You can't just say, "it's plastic". Now, I read that people are pouring bleach and deionizing agents down their black tanks. Up to now I haven't flamed or even acted alarmist about this. I only suggested that it's probably not a good idea. Especially for you midwesterners who already have soft water. I've seen oversoftened water destroy the inside fiberglass linings of hotwater heaters. Furthermore, when you put bleach down in your black tank it is mixing with your regular black tank chemicals. Some of these chemicals can/do contain formaldehydes and/or ammonias. Those are toxic gasses when they are combined. All, I'm saying is that those black tank chemicals you buy at CW are specially formulated to work with industry standard tanks. They pollute less too. Think about what happens to the septic tanks at the campgrounds. That's someone's property. They have to pay for the upkeep and maintenance from the damage by these cocktails. I sincerely hope I did not offend anybody with any of my words. If I did then I publicly apologize right now. This is just my $.02

John


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## BaseCamp

John,

Good explanation. One question, what do you think is the rate of damage to the pipes and tank? 5 yrs, 10 yrs, 15 yrs...?

I'm trying to weight the cost-benefit of care and smell free tanks vs the cost of replacing them.


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## h2oman

BaseCamp said:


> John,
> 
> Good explanation. One question, what do you think is the rate of damage to the pipes and tank? 5 yrs, 10 yrs, 15 yrs...?
> 
> I'm trying to weight the cost-benefit of care and smell free tanks vs the cost of replacing them.
> [snapback]94808[/snapback]​


I don't know. The reason I don't want to be alarmist is that it might have no effect at all. I'm only suggesting it's not a good idea. That is what the "quicky flush" devices are for.


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## ee4308

h2oman said:


> Furthermore, when you put bleach down in your black tank it is mixing with your regular black tank chemicals. Some of these chemicals can/do contain formaldehydes and/or ammonias. Those are toxic gasses when they are combined.
> 
> John
> [snapback]94610[/snapback]​


John,

Not meaning to high-jack the post, I feel sure everything in your post is correct, but I know for a fact that (learned the hard way) that bleach and ammonia don't go together cleaning floors. Liked to have wiped me out.


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## lilmismajik

Hi all,

This seems to be the topic of discussion in my household. We will be taking our first trip ever next weekend. We purchased a quickie flush but I am leary of installing ourself. I called camping world as well as your dealer for install pricing. CW stated they would cut a hole in the tank, the dealer stated they would run a hose. Something does not seem right with these differences. I am concerned about putting a hole in the tank and wonder if the quickie flush is really worth it or can I simply use the alternate methods of Calgon/detergent? Any suggestions? Thanks! 
Kimberly action


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## HootBob

lilmismajik said:


> Hi all,
> 
> This seems to be the topic of discussion in my household. We will be taking our first trip ever next weekend. We purchased a quickie flush but I am leary of installing ourself. I called camping world as well as your dealer for install pricing. CW stated they would cut a hole in the tank, the dealer stated they would run a hose. Something does not seem right with these differences. I am concerned about putting a hole in the tank and wonder if the quickie flush is really worth it or can I simply use the alternate methods of Calgon/detergent? Any suggestions? Thanks!
> Kimberly action
> [snapback]95056[/snapback]​


The calgon will help keeping stuff from sticking to the sides of the tanks
The QF will flush out the tanks better then you would believe
My tank was pretty well cleaned out before I installed the QF
I waited awhile then tested it
And you would beleive the stuff that came out. 
What a mess I had to clean up(Well I knew it workgood then)
Best Mod I ever did and would do it again in a heart beat

Don


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## tdvffjohn

I will echo what Don says. Major help in keeping it clean.

John


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## Ghosty

I have nothing to add except -- WOW - this has been read over 4400 times... I just wanted to jump on the wagon ..


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## MChief

Hi All, a newbie here, just purchased a OB 28bhs love the trailer so far, but bought it with a cloged black water tank, unknown till I tryed to dump, any Ideas ??? IT is almost full, from previous use, we haven't even had it out yet. so far everything else works great, by the way it is a 05> Thanks, Mchief


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## z-family




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## PDX_Doug

action *Welcome to Outbackers, MChief!* action 
Congratulations on the new Outback!

But what a crappy deal (pun intended)!









The first thing I would do, would be to call the original owners and ask them how THEY intend to rectify the problem. It's one thing to sell someone a trailer with a 'problem' or two. That goes with the territory. But there is NO reason you should have to deal with a tank full of their fermented human waste!

All I can say is, I sure to he** hope the previous owner was not a fellow Outbacker.









Happy Trails,
Doug


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## Doxie-Doglover

camping479 said:


> Pinned
> 
> Mike
> [snapback]36080[/snapback]​


what's pinned mean?


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## NDJollyMon

Pinned is something a moderator can do to a certain thread which will keep it at the very top of a page. We like to keep important threads 'pinned' so they are easy to find for everyone...and they don't get lost in the shuffle.


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## Doxie-Doglover

thanks for explaining pinned! 
I want to add our recent black tank story:

we had Lakeshore deliver our Outback to Missoula. This is a 2005 that had never been privately owned. However, it had been loaned to Fema person for 3 months to stay in after the hurricanes. For the most part, you cannot tell it had ever been used.It appears the person slept and used bathroom, and even that was barely noticeable. Anyway, before we had it delivered we had Lakeshore add some things to it, one being a gray/black tank cleaner outer thingy.It has a name, but I am too lazy to go out in the wind and look ! It has nozzles that shoot water into the tanks and when stuff is coming down the nozzle shoots water at it and basically shreds the stuff and it goes thru a see thru part. This was new for us. THANK GOD WE HAD IT INSTALLED: so we stayed in rv park for 3 days.We wondered why the monitor inside showed the black tank two thirds full so quickly, we hadn't looked at it right away.Rick was giving me , well, you know "crap" about using bathroom so much. Not funny.







So we start emptying and thought it odd that the more he rinsed, the more came out.Rinse, more,rinse, more...it was crazy and taking forever. It became obvious by watching the window, there was, uh, well, stuff coming out that we didn't put in. Really want to know? well, for instance-corn(which got Rick going with comments about how much corn they eat in the south,he thought he was pretty funny), paper towel remanants....etc. Uh-Oh I said, this was not cleaned out well, if at all.I suggested we take hose inside and fill tank all the way full, that should do the trick.It sure did, 4 times! We filled the tank full and let her go 4 times, there was no end to the stuff coming out.Twice it became very clogged, it appeared to be paper towels and perhaps the wrong type of toilet paper. By opening and closing the water jet valve thingy repeatedly, it would shred the clog bit by bit and then whoosh, it would clear. The fifth time we filled the black tank from the inside, it finally ran clear. Due to the nature of the situation, I nominated myself to stick the hose inside the toilet and move it around to help . That hose is now in a landfill in Montana







. I am sooooo glad we had that contraption added to the trailer, had we not had it, we would not have seen what was coming out and therefore not known the nature of the problem. It wasn't until after the 4th fill that the monitor finally read empty. The 5th fill was for good measure.
Tawnya


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## PDX_Doug

Tawnya,

Now THAT sounds like a fun time!
Just be thankful you found it early on!

Happy Trails,
Doug


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## Doxie-Doglover

ohhhh...could you imagine if we had that when the Tri-City heat hits????????ugh!









yep, so glad we found it. We spent 2 hours on that! I consider this a success story!


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## Oregon_Camper

Hahahahaha....I can just imagine you guys running around the trailer blaming each other for "using" the potty sooooo much...HAHAHAHAH


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## Doxie-Doglover

Now Jim, THAT scenario would be funny, however, he didn't use the potty even once. He went to the restrooms right there or we were out and about when he needed to "go". I am the one who needs the built in throne







(the little yellow guy is praising the built in potty Gods) and I make sure it doesn't get lonely







.Ok, go ahead and laugh! Sure beats using a coffee can!









( is it normal when trailer shopping to go check out the bathroom first???it's not?? hmmmm....good thing I uh...didn't EVER do that!







)

one more thing....most people would never admit they need the potty but hey, I ain't shy as you will learn!


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## ED_RN

I asked the gentleman who my PDI yesterday about the Calgon. He said he wouldn't recomend it, that it could eat at the seal and gaskets. Anyone have a problem after using it?


camping479 said:


> I think I've finally got this black tank thing figured out after lots of frustration and leftover odors.
> 
> I first started using nothing but a sewer hose to drain, that didn't work as the tank never seemed to drain completely and would always smell really bad the next time we went out, so I needed to do something.
> 
> Enter the flush king. I though this would solve the problem. The only thing was it took forever and lots of water to do the trick. I would spend 45 minutes flushing away and the tank still would have some "residue" in it. The kids would be in the truck and my wife sitting on the bumper patiently waiting for me to finish so we could hook up and go.
> 
> So my next step was to get a quickie flush, it was a bit of a pain to install, but it has really done the trick as far as cleaning the tank. I empty the tank and turn on the quickie flush and let it clean away while I do other things. After five minutes or so (y-guy turned me onto this) I close the flush king valve and let the tank fill up and then drain it. I now have a squeaky clean black tank.
> 
> To clean it even better, I've started using calgon water softener (got that tip from the thread on the GEO method). When I emptied the tank today and backfilled it, the water had all this scaly stuff in it which I am asuming is buildup coming off of the sides of the tank due to the water softener.
> 
> These few things have cut my black tank cleanup time by 3/4 compared to the flush king alone and produce a clean, odor free tank. We don't really do any dry camping, but one advantage of the quickie flush at a dump station would be it is pretty quick, a 2 or three minute flushing would be good enough to get the tank just about completely clean.
> 
> Mike
> [snapback]13525[/snapback]​


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## tdvffjohn

No problems here. I would think the small amt you use mixed with the sewarage and black tank chemicals could do very little if any. Its only a water softener and doesn t a washing machine have rubber seals and gaskets, just thinking









John


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## h2oman

tdvffjohn said:


> No problems here. I would think the small amt you use mixed with the sewarage and black tank chemicals could do very little if any. Its only a water softener and doesn t a washing machine have rubber seals and gaskets, just thinking
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> John
> [snapback]127046[/snapback]​


I know I've spoken fo this before so I hope I don't offend anyone. Softening makes water agressive in that it removes ions that have attached to the hydrogen and oxygen molecules. That means that the unattached molecules with search out anything to bond with. That means your rubber gaskets and seals. It will destroy them over time. If you use it don't store it with Calgon in the tank. Use it when on trips when you are going to dump after a short period.

John


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## tdvffjohn

Thanks for the reminder







I do remember reading you comments before and forgot.









John


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## NAturedog2

camping479 said:


> My sensors work great now. I still use tank treatment. I buy odorloss packets from camping world. It has no odor and is supposed to lubricate the valves too.
> 
> Here's the GEO method, I downloaded it off of RV.NET.
> 
> Everyone who owns an RV should be concerned with maintaining its wastewater tanks. Problems with wastewater tanks that can be avoided should be avoided. Wastewater tank repair is expensive. Due to health concerns, many service facilities will not work on wastewater tanks and lines until the tanks have been completely emptied and sanitized. This may be quite difficult when the tank(s) is in need of repair. So, common sense dictates that the tanks should be kept relatively clean at all times. Additionally, improper use of the wastewater tanks can lead to a build up of solid wastes, which in itself may cause the system to fail.
> 
> Iâ€™ve discovered very simple, effective, and inexpensive methods of maintaining my wastewater tanks in a relatively clean condition at all times. I developed these methods myself through my understanding of chemistry, physics, and biology with a smidgen of common sense thrown in for good measure. I also read my RV ownerâ€™s manual. Although we are not full time RVers we use our fifth wheel camper at least one weekend a month. We never use public bathing and toilet facilities. In other words, our wastewater tanks are fairly heavily used. Since IÂ¡Â¦ve met a number of RVers who donâ€™t seem to know how to maintain their wastewater tanks I thought many RVers would find my tips useful. If you have not been maintaining your tanks I believe you will be pleasantly surprised the first time you employ these tips. I do these things and they work.
> 
> 1. DUMP A FULL TANK
> 
> When you are camping and your RV is connected to a sewer/septic intake, leave the drain valves closed until the tank is full and ready to dump. Dumping a full tank provides a sufficient quantity of water to flush solids from the tank. Leaving the drain valves open allows the water to drain off without flushing out solid waste. That solid waste will collect in the tank(s) and cause problems over time.
> 
> 2. DUMP TANKS IN ORDER FROM DIRTIEST TO CLEANEST
> 
> In other words, dump the black (commode) water tank first, then dump the galley tank, then dump the shower and bathroom sink tank. This way you will be flushing out the dirtiest water with progressively cleaner water.
> 
> 3. USE WATER SOFTENER
> 
> **Calgon Water Softener link**
> 
> This stuff is amazing and it works. Buy a couple of boxes of powdered water softener at the grocery store. Youâ€™ll find it located with or near the laundry detergent products. I prefer Calgon Water Softener because it dissolves quickly in water. Cheaper water softeners work just as well but dissolve more slowly. Dissolve two (2) cups of the water softener in a gallon of hot water. Then, pour the solution down the drain into the empty tank. Use two cups of softener for each wastewater tank in your RV. The tankâ€™s drain valve should be closed otherwise the softened water will just drain out. Then use the tank(s) normally until it is full and drain it normally. Add a cup of laundry detergent to the black (commode) water tank at the same time. This will help clean the tank. The gray water tanks should already contain soap through normal use.
> 
> The water softener makes the solid waste let go from the sides of the tanks. If youâ€™ve ever taken a shower in softened water you know that after rinsing the soap from your body your skin will feel slick. Thatâ€™s because all the soap rinses away with soft water. Softened water also prevents soap scum from sticking in the tub. Get the connection? With softened water gunk washes away instead of sticking. The same thing applies to your RVÂ¡Â¦s wastewater tanks.
> 
> I use one of those clear plastic elbow connectors to attach my sewer drain line to the wastewater outlet on my RV. It allows me to see how well things are progressing during a wastewater dump. Before I began using water softener regularly the black water tankâ€™s water was brown, the galley tankâ€™s water was brownish, and the bathroom tankâ€™s water was white. The first time I added water softener to the tanks the water coming from the black water tank was actually black (not brown) and the kitchen tankâ€™s water was also black (not brownish). The bathroom tankâ€™s water remained white. That told me that the water softener had actually done what I had intended for it to do and made solid waste, which had been stuck to the interior of the tanks, let go and drain away. I added water softener to all the wastewater tanks for the next few dumps to be certain all the solid waste possible had been cleaned away. The wastewater only appeared black on the initial treatment. I now add water softener to each tank once after every few dumps to maintain the system.
> 
> Occasionally, I pour a gallon of liquid bleach into each tank to sanitize and disinfect them. I no longer use the blue toilet chemical because it isnâ€™t necessary. I have no odors coming from my black water tank. Generic brand liquid bleach is cheap and very effective.
> 
> 4. USE A WATER FILTER ON YOUR FRESH WATER INTAKE LINE
> 
> Most fresh water contains sediment. Sediment will accumulate in your wastewater tanks and your fresh water lines. It also tends to discolor your sinks, tub/shower, and commode. I use the disposable type and have found that they eventually fill up and begin restricting the fresh water flow resulting in low pressure. Thatâ€™s how I know itâ€™s time to get a new filter. It works, itâ€™s cheap, it avoids problems, do it.
> 
> SOME OTHER THOUGHTS
> 
> -- I believe occasionally traveling with partially filled wastewater tanks that contain softened water promotes cleaning by agitating the water. The same goes for chlorine bleach.
> -- I believe this process works faster and more efficiently during warm weather. However, I know it works well even during cool/cold weather.
> -- I believe the process works best the longer the water softener remains in the tanks. So, I donâ€™t add water softener during periods of heavy wastewater generation. I wait until I know we wonâ€™t be generating wastewater quickly so that the softened water remains in the tanks for several days before dumping.
> -- I add a small amount of chlorine bleach to the fresh water tank twice a year to disinfect and sanitize the fresh water tank and fresh water lines. A weak chlorine bleach solution will not hurt you. However, it certainly makes the water taste bad. When we have chlorine in the fresh water system we use bottled water for drinking and cooking until the chlorine is gone.
> -- My tanks are plastic and my pipes are PVC.
> -- Donâ€™t be afraid to use your tanks. Just use common sense about their care and maintenance.
> -- These tips are inexpensive to do. Some of them donâ€™t cost anything. You have nothing to lose in trying them and I encourage you to do so. I actually feel a certain amount of pride in the condition and cleanliness of both my waste and fresh water systems. Naturally, these tips make dumping a much more pleasant and sanitary procedure.
> -- If you have odors in any of your water systems these procedures should eliminate them. Odors indicate a sanitary problem and degrade the enjoyment you derive from your RV.
> -- When my RV is parked and not in use I place stoppers in my sink and tub drains. This allows the wastewater tanks to vent through the vent pipes to the outside instead of through the drains into the RV.
> 
> Mike


Thanks for the info. this is very helpful to new outbackers!!


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## renegade21rs

kk5fe said:


> I was just going by what the dealer told me... go figure.


Sometimes, the dealer doesn't know what he's talking about.


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## MO7Bs

What is the easiest way to get to the black tank to install a quickie flush on the 31rqs?


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## Oregon_Camper

bricker417 said:


> What is the easiest way to get to the black tank to install a quickie flush on the 31rqs?


Pay someone....


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## MO7Bs

Oregon_Camper said:


> What is the easiest way to get to the black tank to install a quickie flush on the 31rqs?


Pay someone....








[/quote]

Thought crossed my mind. But what a finding experience with my sons...playing with a swewage tank!


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## schooly

great information. We are camping now and I plan to go buy some water softener to use when we empty the black and grey to go home tomorrow. My black tank never goes below two thirds full when emptied. Hope this we get it down further.

Also, any advice on the portable tote tanks for long stays a campgrounds without site sewer hookups? We are fairly new to all this and plan to camp 10 days next month and use the portable tank to empty the black and the grey as needed.while on site. Seems like I read somewhere that these should only be used for grey water. However, I am not sure our black water tank will hold out for 10 days without being emptied.


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## bradnjess

schooly said:


> great information. We are camping now and I plan to go buy some water softener to use when we empty the black and grey to go home tomorrow. My black tank never goes below two thirds full when emptied. Hope this we get it down further.
> 
> Also, any advice on the portable tote tanks for long stays a campgrounds without site sewer hookups? We are fairly new to all this and plan to camp 10 days next month and use the portable tank to empty the black and the grey as needed.while on site. Seems like I read somewhere that these should only be used for grey water. However, I am not sure our black water tank will hold out for 10 days without being emptied.


There's no problem using a tote for black, some just prefer not to as it can be messy if not careful. I'd recommend dumping at about 1/2 full if you're going to use one though, and leave enough room so you can flush your hose w/ gray water. They get pretty heavy when full, mine is 32 gal and I filled it to full one time and 'bout blew out my back. When we camp w/o full hookups we utilize the bath house (if there is one) as much as possible, especially for showers. Good luck, feel free to pm me if you have any more questions.

Brad


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## bradnjess

Schooly, I just reread your original post and noticed this was your first post.

 Welcome to Outbackers!!









You ought to introduce yourself on the new members check in page so everyone can welcome you to the group.

Brad


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## schooly

thanks for the welcome and the reply to my question about the tote tank. Iwill introduce myself at the new member forum as well.

thanks again


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## grytza

Does anyone know where to find Calgon (or a water softner)? I've been to Target, Walmart, and a couple other stores. No one has powder water softner. I also looked on like but it was for 12 boxes for $81. I'm thinking I don't need that much.

Any big box store carry it?


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## Southpaw

Great thread, thou I thought I could make it throu the entire thing, I got bored once I hit the Ph arguement!










My question is how do I wond my tanks without having to drag the garden house thru the TT into the bathroom? I purchase a sink connector from the local RV Store however....C A P S,.,,CAPS CAPS CAPS...Nicholas Backstrom scores; Caps up 2-1 (hockey's on)...however, none of the connectors seem to work in my Outback!


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## Roscoe

Does anyone have the "no-fuss flush" system on their camper? The hoses at dump stations just have a cut of hose that we can't really hook up to the no fuss flush outlet. Is this necessary? Can we just add water to the toilet after dumping?


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## RVdogs

*Has anyone used the **FloJet RV Waste Pump Kit* *? Wondering if that would be easier and less expensive than buying/installing a quickie flush system.*


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## camping479

Southpaw said:


> Great thread, thou I thought I could make it throu the entire thing, I got bored once I hit the Ph arguement!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My question is how do I wond my tanks without having to drag the garden house thru the TT into the bathroom? I purchase a sink connector from the local RV Store however....C A P S,.,,CAPS CAPS CAPS...Nicholas Backstrom scores; Caps up 2-1 (hockey's on)...however, none of the connectors seem to work in my Outback!


Just saw this post, I did this mod a while ago so I don't have to drag the hose thru the trailer.

Mike


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## sheplady

Hi Mike! I have to say a big thank you to you for your posts on this topic. My husband and I just bought our 2004 outback 28rss and had a bunch of black water tank trouble on our two week camping trip. My husband who is now armed with your good advice is returning to the campground this weekend with water softener in hand and will be using your methods to clean and keep the take smelling great! Thanks from the newbies,

Linda and Ralph


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## jodeelynn

I also dump the remaining ice cubes from the coolers in there to agitate and assist with cleaning on the way to dump the tanks!


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## Randy A

I know this is an old thread, but it contains some great information; especially for a new camper owner like myself.


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## Doxie-Doglover-Too

so I have a question! our new 2012 Cougar has the quickie flush already installed. So just exactly when do you turn the dang thing on? Empty black tank and then turn it on? turn it on while emptying? empty and then fill all the way up and then re empty? hmmmmm. I ask because I emptied tank and then turned it on with the valve open, stuff came out after turning it on and after a few minutes it was running clear so I turned it off and came in and looked down toilet with flash light and there was stuff still in it. Soooo, I turned it on, closed valve , let it fill up, opened valve and let it drain again and then let it run some more. Then when I looked in toilet saw nothing. Perhaps someone knows the correct combination of when to turn it on verses the valve open and closed to get the job done?


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## julie

It all sounds good but have been told and read on several other forums that bleach should never be used in the waste water tanks, it can cause deterioration of the tanks and make for some really hefty repair bills.


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## Chuggs

Doxie-Doglover-Too said:


> so I have a question! our new 2012 Cougar has the quickie flush already installed. So just exactly when do you turn the dang thing on? ...


It's an never ending experiment!

If I'm in a campsite with FHU...the routine that I use is...

When I get to the campsite... I remove the cover to my dump tube and attach a Valterra Hydro Flush (clear 90 degree elbow)...to that I attach the Valterra T-58 twist on gate vavle...to that I attach my Rhinoflex hose...and the other end, I use the sewer adapter ring for a good snug connection. The hose get's placed on the Camco Sidewinder hose support.

Now, I'm good to go. Usually have to come out and pull the grey handle a couple of times during the week.

When I'm ready to packup to go home...

I hook up the tank rinser...and start it up. Then I pull the Black handle. When the contents are empty...and the runoff starts to appear like it's not got lots of debris in it... I do something to agitate the black tank.

Close the T-58 gate vavle...the Hydroflush will start backing up with water...and your quickee flush system will start filling the black tank with fresh water... then I momentarily open and close the grey tank valve. This depends on having a pretty full grey tank... the grey soapy water rushes back into the black tank...stiring stuff up. Then pull the t-58 vavle and whoosh it comes out and brings lots of nasties with it. I repeat this a few times... Then it's always nice to go inside and dump a bowl of water down the toilet...again to dislodge stuff that's hiding. After a couple of these... just let the the flushing adapter continue spraying...and you can open and close the T-58...letting water backup in the black tank, and then rush out. After a few of these...you'll see the water is almost totally clear in the hydroflush.

When I'm happy it's running clean...I close the black tank vavle...let the sprayer go just a little longer to get some water in the black tank...and shut it off. I move the hose to the fitting on the hydroflush...

Now dump the grey...open the grey vavle and the T-58 vavle...and let everything run out. Close the T-58 and turn on the water to the hydroflush to back wash the grey tank a little...and then pull the T-58...close the Grey Tank vavle... Let the hose rinse a little with fresh water...turn off the water...disconnect your devices and store them...

Get a disinfecting wipe...and clean your hands...

Go inside...and dump some Orange scented deodorizer and calgon liquid water softener down the toilet...

dump some lemon scented grey tank deodorizer down the sink...and flush it down with fresh water.

Done! Good to go the next time out...and no fowl odors in the camper.

If you let the camper stand for too long...you might make sure there is some water in the toilet bowl...and water in the sink P-traps...to make a water seal to prevent fumes from going into the camper.


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## LaydBack

Doxie-Doglover-Too said:


> so I have a question! our new 2012 Cougar has the quickie flush already installed. So just exactly when do you turn the dang thing on? Empty black tank and then turn it on? turn it on while emptying? empty and then fill all the way up and then re empty? hmmmmm. I ask because I emptied tank and then turned it on with the valve open, stuff came out after turning it on and after a few minutes it was running clear so I turned it off and came in and looked down toilet with flash light and there was stuff still in it. Soooo, I turned it on, closed valve , let it fill up, opened valve and let it drain again and then let it run some more. Then when I looked in toilet saw nothing. Perhaps someone knows the correct combination of when to turn it on verses the valve open and closed to get the job done?


Not to stir debate, but I do things a bit differently. Since the quickie flush has a rotating part inside the black tank, my thought process is that the moving part does not want to meet all the resistance that a full or somewhat full tank might offer. For that reason, I dump the black tank first, then I start the quickie flush with the waste valve still open. I watch the clear adapter to see what I'm getting, and then after a while, I close the waste valve with the quickie flush still running. I allow it to fill some, to create flow, then open valve, and repeat this process several times. My assumption is that the flush system is designed to spin freely and shoot water at the walls of the tank to knock off any thing that's stuck to the tank. I don't think it's meant to be an agitator, and I'd hate for it to break off in the tank.

Now, that being said, I was actually logging in to reply to this thread because I just used the macerator for the first time. We dry camped at the local raceway last weekend, so I figured I'd give it a try. Based on my experience with it, I don't think I'll ever go without one. I usually use the method I described above, as we usually have full hookups and I typically take my time and do it while I'm breaking down camp. After using the macerator pump to dump at home, I really don't believe that most people I've observed dump at the campgrounds are getting their tanks anywhere near clean. Having the macerator made quick work of dumping....I'd say my tank was at least 2/3 full, and it had it emptied in what I think was less time than conventional dumping with the sewer hose. I had my clear adapter hooked up, so I was able to keep constant monitor of what was coming out of the black tank. I know it took more than double what my usual routine would be, and every bit of 50 minutes to an hour. The pump acts as the valve, so all I had to do was start and stop the pump while I allowed the quickie flush to run continuously. Keep in mind that this waste was from last weekend, we came home early Sunday, so it's been sitting for 3 1/2 days, and I use the rv safe blue johnny on the spot stuff and a regular rv holding tank treatment, and rv toilet paper. I'd have to say that after 40+ minutes of continued flushing, with me running the pump intermittently, but regularly, there were still lots of sizeable chunks and clumps of toilet paper and waste. I stopped after about an hour, or a little over an hour. At that point, I'd say the water was flowing about as clearly as it was going into the tank, and there were no more sizeable particles. Granted, no one's looking to get drinking water out of the thing, but I've always thought, and am pretty sure many others do too, that I do a pretty good job of flushing the black tank at every dump, but after seeing how much is still there after my normal routine, I think I'll do the at home flush with the macerator pump, a little more routinely.


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## pep_

LB, what type of macerator pump/setup do you use? Do you use one that is bolted and hired wired or one of the bayonet removable types? After reading this I did a search at Camping World and found a few different types. I like the idea of this a lot. I don't have the quickie flush as our OB came with a garden hose attachment to flush water into the black tank. As far as I know all it does is fill clean water in the black tank anyways.


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## LaydBack

pep_ said:


> LB, what type of macerator pump/setup do you use? Do you use one that is bolted and hired wired or one of the bayonet removable types? After reading this I did a search at Camping World and found a few different types. I like the idea of this a lot. I don't have the quickie flush as our OB came with a garden hose attachment to flush water into the black tank. As far as I know all it does is fill clean water in the black tank anyways.


I have this http://www.pplmotorhomes.com/parts/rv-toilets-tanks/Flojet-macerator-portable-kit.htm?utm_source=google&utm_medium=partsshopping&utm_campaign=partsfeed

In addition to what I said in my last post, one thing I noticed is that while the pump was on, the water would look far clearer than what it really was. It was when I would stop the pump, that would allow the water to collect and I could see how dirty it was. So, I'd bet most people who use a clear adapter, and don't have a second valve, never know how still dirty things are.


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## H2oSprayer

LaydBack said:


> My assumption is that the flush system is designed to spin freely and shoot water at the walls of the tank to knock off any thing that's stuck to the tank.


The Quickie Flush doesn't actually rotate. It is basically a plastic tube the sticks about 2 inches into the tank with several holes drilled into it at different angles that sprays water in different directions.

When we dump, depending on how full the tank is, I'll spray water into the tank via the Quickie Flush to not only fill the tank but to get the water moving and the solids suspended in the water and off the bottom of the tank. After the tank has emptied, I'll refill it and redump it a couple of times until the water is running clear. After I am done emptying the tank, I'll close the valve and count to 30 before I turn off the water to the Quickie Flush, allowing the tank to fill a little bit. I'll then go inside and add my black tank treatment. The last thing that I do is to make sure there is an inch or so on top of the toilet valve to insure the O ring does not dry out.


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## Chuggs

I agree...

I place the Floject Macerator on the end of my Valterra Hydroflush when I'm at home. It does the same thing that the T-58 twist-on gate vavle does...it stops the flow, so you can read what's in the inspection window (clear section).

I know other's will be amazed if they do it this way. When I first started out...I used a Camco Dual Flush... I could see what was passing by...but it's not until you stop the flow...and see what "heavy" particles settle to the bottom that you realize --- it's not soup yet!

I don't waste peoples time at the campground dump station...I'm in and out in a flash...but when I'm at home or using a FHU site...I do a much better job of rinsing the residue from my tanks.


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## LaydBack

H2oSprayer said:


> My assumption is that the flush system is designed to spin freely and shoot water at the walls of the tank to knock off any thing that's stuck to the tank.


The Quickie Flush doesn't actually rotate. It is basically a plastic tube the sticks about 2 inches into the tank with several holes drilled into it at different angles that sprays water in different directions.

When we dump, depending on how full the tank is, I'll spray water into the tank via the Quickie Flush to not only fill the tank but to get the water moving and the solids suspended in the water and off the bottom of the tank. After the tank has emptied, I'll refill it and redump it a couple of times until the water is running clear. After I am done emptying the tank, I'll close the valve and count to 30 before I turn off the water to the Quickie Flush, allowing the tank to fill a little bit. I'll then go inside and add my black tank treatment. The last thing that I do is to make sure there is an inch or so on top of the toilet valve to insure the O ring does not dry out.
[/quote]

I haven't been in the tank to look, but mine certainly sounds like there's something rotating in the tank. I know for sure that they make them, and my setup seems like this, or a variation of it.
http://www.amazon.com/Camco-40126-Tornado-Rotary-Rinser/dp/B000BUU5TU


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## Insomniak

Not sure which tank flush Keystone is using, but ours doesn't sound like it's rotating. I use exactly the same method as LaydBack, with the Flojet macerator and you can really get the black tank squeaky clean. It's amazing what comes out even after 30 minutes of flushing and refilling. The last couple of times, I haven't been quite so compulsive about getting every last chunk out of the tank. I figured what the heck, it's a black tank after all and will be a mess immediately after setting up camp. It's definitely a good idea to flush the tank thoroughly once in a while to keep the sensors working and to get the butt corn out of the gate valves.


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## Chuggs

Our's isn't the tank tornado either. It's just a fixed spray head quickee flush type.

I do like the way that keystone installed the one in our 5th wheel. They run the tubing from the connection point up thru a hole in the floor under the sink in our bathroom. There it connects to an anti-siphon device...and the return line goes back down thru the hole in the floor and returns to the black tank where it's connected to the sprayer. It's nice to know that there's no way you can accidently siphon pooh water out of your black tank and into the aux water hose you use for the tank rinser.

I have heard people complain that the spinning head on the tornado has been known to come off occaisionally. It can really bind up a macerator pump...if the loose part makes it out the chute while you're pumping...


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## CamperAndy

LaydBack said:


> My assumption is that the flush system is designed to spin freely and shoot water at the walls of the tank to knock off any thing that's stuck to the tank.


The Quickie Flush doesn't actually rotate. It is basically a plastic tube the sticks about 2 inches into the tank with several holes drilled into it at different angles that sprays water in different directions.

When we dump, depending on how full the tank is, I'll spray water into the tank via the Quickie Flush to not only fill the tank but to get the water moving and the solids suspended in the water and off the bottom of the tank. After the tank has emptied, I'll refill it and redump it a couple of times until the water is running clear. After I am done emptying the tank, I'll close the valve and count to 30 before I turn off the water to the Quickie Flush, allowing the tank to fill a little bit. I'll then go inside and add my black tank treatment. The last thing that I do is to make sure there is an inch or so on top of the toilet valve to insure the O ring does not dry out.
[/quote]

I haven't been in the tank to look, but mine certainly sounds like there's something rotating in the tank. I know for sure that they make them, and my setup seems like this, or a variation of it.
http://www.amazon.com/Camco-40126-Tornado-Rotary-Rinser/dp/B000BUU5TU
[/quote]

If it is rotating it is a Tornado flush.


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## LaydBack

I'm not certain that it's rotating, maybe I'm just hearing the anti-siphon or something. At this point, I'm kinda hoping you're right Chris. My black tank has been replaced under warranty, but I can't imagine Keystone sending anything different than what they're installing. At any rate, like Insomniak said, after 30 minutes, most would be surprised. I guess a second valve between the clear adapter and sewer hose, would be a cheaper alternative for those wanting to see, but I doubt they'd want to do the thorough flush at a campground, after seeing the time it takes. I guess it's good whomever resurrected this thread.


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## Doxie-Doglover-Too

CamperAndy said:


> My assumption is that the flush system is designed to spin freely and shoot water at the walls of the tank to knock off any thing that's stuck to the tank.


The Quickie Flush doesn't actually rotate. It is basically a plastic tube the sticks about 2 inches into the tank with several holes drilled into it at different angles that sprays water in different directions.

When we dump, depending on how full the tank is, I'll spray water into the tank via the Quickie Flush to not only fill the tank but to get the water moving and the solids suspended in the water and off the bottom of the tank. After the tank has emptied, I'll refill it and redump it a couple of times until the water is running clear. After I am done emptying the tank, I'll close the valve and count to 30 before I turn off the water to the Quickie Flush, allowing the tank to fill a little bit. I'll then go inside and add my black tank treatment. The last thing that I do is to make sure there is an inch or so on top of the toilet valve to insure the O ring does not dry out.
[/quote]

I haven't been in the tank to look, but mine certainly sounds like there's something rotating in the tank. I know for sure that they make them, and my setup seems like this, or a variation of it.
http://www.amazon.co...r/dp/B000BUU5TU
[/quote]

If it is rotating it is a Tornado flush.
[/quote]

Andy,
I don't know which one they put in our new Cougar 31sqbwe but the hose hooks up clear way over not far from where the city water hook up is and the black tank is way over at other end of trailer. Anyway, as soon as I turn water on I can hear spinning that I swear sounds like it is right there where the hose hooks up instead of way down at other end where the tank is. Very puzzling to me. I have to go over to dealers today so going to see what they think


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## LaydBack

Doxie-Doglover-Too said:


> My assumption is that the flush system is designed to spin freely and shoot water at the walls of the tank to knock off any thing that's stuck to the tank.


The Quickie Flush doesn't actually rotate. It is basically a plastic tube the sticks about 2 inches into the tank with several holes drilled into it at different angles that sprays water in different directions.

When we dump, depending on how full the tank is, I'll spray water into the tank via the Quickie Flush to not only fill the tank but to get the water moving and the solids suspended in the water and off the bottom of the tank. After the tank has emptied, I'll refill it and redump it a couple of times until the water is running clear. After I am done emptying the tank, I'll close the valve and count to 30 before I turn off the water to the Quickie Flush, allowing the tank to fill a little bit. I'll then go inside and add my black tank treatment. The last thing that I do is to make sure there is an inch or so on top of the toilet valve to insure the O ring does not dry out.
[/quote]

I haven't been in the tank to look, but mine certainly sounds like there's something rotating in the tank. I know for sure that they make them, and my setup seems like this, or a variation of it.
http://www.amazon.co...r/dp/B000BUU5TU
[/quote]

If it is rotating it is a Tornado flush.
[/quote]

Andy,
I don't know which one they put in our new Cougar 31sqbwe but the hose hooks up clear way over not far from where the city water hook up is and the black tank is way over at other end of trailer. Anyway, as soon as I turn water on I can hear spinning that I swear sounds like it is right there where the hose hooks up instead of way down at other end where the tank is. Very puzzling to me. I have to go over to dealers today so going to see what they think








[/quote]
Doxie, sounds like you're hearing what I hear. I don't know what would be spinning that far away from the tank, so it's probably not spinning we hear, just something that sounds like spinning. Mine is only 3', if that, from the tank, so it just seemed probable. I think I'll pass on the rotating one, and just stick with a thorough flush and the macerator. It's nice to have the dump/flush at home option.


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## kbuck 300 RB

I know that this is an older tread, however i am a new member and found this information very helpful. I have owned both a travel trailer and a motorhome in the past but have never seen the trips that I have read from this post. Again, great information.


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## STinVA

Hello all,

I own a 2003 Outback by Liteway 28BHS. The last time we took the camper out, my wife was conducting the 3rd round of flushing our black water tank with the Flush King. During that round, we got distracted and left the water running too long. Our first indicator this had happened was seeing water running out of the front of the camper from the underbelly. We were parked slightly downhill so the water ran from the rear of the camper to the front. Most of it seemed to run out of the front right corner of the camper (passenger's side of vehicle if towing). We immediately turned the water off and the water soon stopped flowing. The black tank was still full and required draining as usual. No water came inside the camper.

What we don't know is, where did the water escape from after the tank was apparently over-filled? Did we crack the tank or a pipe? Is there some sort of pressure-relief or overflow valve that opened to let the water escape without rupturing something? Did I mention we are glad she was on her 3rd round of flushing when this happened???

We recently got enough nerve at home to put some water in the tank using the Flush King. We first put about 5 gallons in it and saw no leaks. We went up to about 15 gallons and did not see any water leaks. I would like to try filling it to a higher level, but thought I would solicit some responses/thoughts here first.

Any help would be most appreciated. I thought I would try posting this question in the Black Water 101 thread vs starting a new thread. I've got a faulty water-heater too, but I'll put that on in a different topic.

Thanks.

STinVA


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## CamperAndy

The connection between the vent stack and the tank may not be glued and that is the most likely location for the water to have come from.


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## STinVA

CamperAndy said:


> The connection between the vent stack and the tank may not be glued and that is the most likely location for the water to have come from.


Thanks Andy. Just curious,,, if what you said is the reason water came gushing out of the underbelly,,,,, what would have happened if the vent stack and the tank were glued?


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## CamperAndy

STinVA said:


> The connection between the vent stack and the tank may not be glued and that is the most likely location for the water to have come from.


Thanks Andy. Just curious,,, if what you said is the reason water came gushing out of the underbelly,,,,, what would have happened if the vent stack and the tank were glued?
[/quote]

Watch the movie RV with Robin Williams. Your answer is in that movie.


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## STinVA

CamperAndy said:


> The connection between the vent stack and the tank may not be glued and that is the most likely location for the water to have come from.


Thanks Andy. Just curious,,, if what you said is the reason water came gushing out of the underbelly,,,,, what would have happened if the vent stack and the tank were glued?
[/quote]

Watch the movie RV with Robin Williams. Your answer is in that movie.
[/quote]

I googled it and watched the clip. Wow would that have been an ugly, stinky mess! Hopefully the water pressure at the campground wasn't high enough to do that, but I don't ever want to test it.

If that is my problem,,, it doesn't seem like that big of a deal as long as we don't overfill the black tank.


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## sonomaguy

My question here is, on most packets of chemical treatment it says not to use any other chemicals. Can you still use this method with toilet tank treatments and not worry about fumes of any sort? Or any other hazards? I know everything here is owner beware, just checking before I venture on.


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## Anne3358

Sounds like a great solution to our black tank sensor problem. Where does one buy Calgon? We have looked at Target, Lowes, Safeway, Albertsons and Amazon. Amazon carries liquid Calgon. Does liquid or powder have the same cleaning effect on the black tank?


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