# Deposit On 28rsds But Still Negotiating (update)



## Allsixofus

First let me start with we are truly bummed out today...







I went to the local dealer who told me.... and this is a quote from their website.... 
"Shop all the rest, but
Buy from the Best!
*We will beat any competitor's price.*
Bring in any ad or quote from the "other guys" and we will beat their price.
*Save thousands*
on every coach in stock!"

We were still negotiating on the price after I left a deposit on Monday... the unit had a "SOLD" sign on it with our name when we arrived today... only to find out they would NOT MATCH... never mind even come close!! They were $2000 higher to start and then wanted to add tax, title, tag and processing fee....









I am really ticked off right now... more later after I have a chance to rationalize this... but let me ask you guys... would I be out of line to call the Sales Manager and complain about the misleading webpage or is that just sour grapes?









Thanks!


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## Castle Rock Outbackers

Wow...so sorry. What a let down. And you are right...when purchasing don't forget about the taxes and plates. In our county in Colorado, the plates on the 26 RS were over $500. We were so fortunate to have a trailer longer than 26' feet which propelled us into a higher tax rate.









Randy


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## Ghosty

Complaining to the Sales Manager will do nothing -- he IS one of the employees that had to approve this...

Before you read on though its important to know: Did an actual employee ever say that they would match/beat any price or did you only read that on the web????? (VA actually has a new law that says that basically just because its on the web does not mean that a dealership actually approved it -- I bet you the website is NOT hosted by the dealership but some third party --)

Also - and just my two cents -- but if you were still negotiting on Monday why did you leave a deposit..???? Once you leave a deposti they sort of got you mentally and financially -- hopefully you put the deposit on credit card or cehck where you can stop payment.... if the clown is not going to honor his own website then he is going to also give you a hard time abut getting the money back... be very careful that he doesn't use the excuse that he spent your money already on "prepping" the trailer...

If you stillwant to deal with the dealership (and let me tell you after you do what I propose you do then you need to understand that you can NEVER go back to that dealership)..

1. Show them the Ad about beating any price.. tell them that you want in writing that they will not met the price as they described in their ad ... when they say why .. tell them you plan on hiring an attorney and that you plan on suing them for product misrepresentation and violation of the false advertising law of your state (of course thats only a bluff but sometimes you dont have to get past step one to make them blink)

2. Tell them that if they do not BEAT the price that you present to them that you will: 
a. Contact the State Attorney Generals office and file a formal complaint to the "bait and switch" and "false advertising" law that EVERY state has.
b. File a complaint with the local Better Business Bureau (no teeth behind the BBB but a formal compalint on file is one more nail in their coffin)
c. You will write a letter to the editor of any newspaper they are advertising in and complain that the paper knowinglysponsoring a Bait and Switch operation. (yes I understand that it was a website but the odds are that they also advertise in a local / regional paper)
d. Write Keystone and tell them that yu are extremely saddened that such a dearlership is allowed to even carry Keystones products. (now that one in itself is hurtful to the dealership since most of these dealers really on good reports from customers to up their quota for next year)

Now the chances are that the dealership may actually do what their ad says -- but be warned -- yu better do a PDI from hell and mke sure that the unit is raod ready -- becuase those guys will never support you again for any reason...

personally -- I just find a better dealership... Lakeshore in MI or Funtime in TX has the lowest prices I have ever seen and they both were a pleasure to do business with....

and fianlly -- left up to you of course but posting the name of the dealership may stop someone else from gtting screwed n the future...


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## tdvffjohn

All good advice Posting his name here will also hurt him.


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## Reverie

I agree with TDVFFJOHN. Usually I don't like dragging any names into it but if a dealership is willing to put it out there on the web or through any other medium, then they had darn sure back it up.

This site has come to the attention of a whole lot of potential buyers. Almost every day we get a new member who is considering buying. I think we could steer them away from the bad actors and towards those that are reputable. I say, put their name out there and let us check their site. If they are pulling a fast one we can at least steer the people that think enough of us to join, away from them.

Just one man's opinion. Your cards and letters are always welcome.

Reverie


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## Allsixofus

Ghosty... great advice... you bring up some interesting points...

1. Price match: I asked specifically when we were sitting in the unit on Monday about price matching... the quote from the salesman was "we probably won't honor a fax from Michigan but we also are not going to squabble over a couple of hundred dollars to lose a sale!" So... I bet this is not the first time they have had a quote from Lakeshore that they would not honor... I held true to my story that I was willing to drive 13 hours each way to save $1500.

2. Deposit: I wrote a check.. the salesman (who was fantastic by the way) told me that they never had any intention of cashing it as it was "good faith" money and they would return the check at any time or would apply it to the final paperwork. The interesting part of the whole fiasco today was that the salesman could not unstaple the check from the folder fast enough as he broke the news that they would not honor the price matching. He even told me that he did not blame me for driving to save the money. The real shot to the heart was that the Sales Manager told the salesman to tell me.. "we have only had that unit on the lot for 16 days and I know I can sell it without matching"...

3. The salesman told me that the Sales Manager told him after he put the "Sold" sign on it on Monday that if someone else came in and wanted the unit and would sign on the dotted line right then that I was out of luck.

I like your ideas about the AG, BBB, Keystone, and newspaper... once I can discuss this unemotionally I am going to call the dealership.

Thanks for the input!


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## MJRey

Allsixofus,

Just find another dealer, you'll never be happy dealing with those guys no matter what they do in the future. I used my version of "No Haggle Pricing". I made it as simple as possible by prepurchasing things like the hitch and brake controller and by not having a trade-in. I then got a loan prearranged with my Credit Union. Finally I narrowed the dealers down and went to one about 90 miles away. I offered them a price that was %25 off of the sticker price. They came back with a price almost $1500 higher and I politely said no thankyou and started to leave. On my way to the truck where my wife and kids were waiting the salesman caught me and said they would agree to my price but that they "Weren't making any money", Yeah Right! I then put down a deposit and came back a week later to pick up the trailer.

Now I did this the first week in February and it may be getting too close to spring and summer and the dealer thinks that by waiting he can get someone who hasn't shopped around to pay the high price. You'd be surprised at how many people just pay whatever price the dealer puts on the trailer.

Take your time and you'll eventually find one at a reasonable price. The father of a friend of mine is retired and delivers trailers for RV Dealers. When he is delivering them he has all of the paperwork including the invoice with the price the dealer pays listed. He told me that for most travel trailers and fifth wheels the MSRP is about %30 above the invoice price. Therefore shooting for %25 off of the sticker price is not unreasonable and still gives the dealer a fair profit. The dealership also gets you as a customer for their other services such as parts and service.

Good Luck,


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## johnp

I had a deposit on a 27rsds this week but my dealer will not budge off the sticker price. I tried getting him to even come close to Lakeshore's price but said they can't match them. Every way he put on paper came out to the same price 10k higher than Lakeshore. So now I must decide how bad I want the new rv and deal with a dealer 1000 miles away.

John


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## Ghosty

I used the " find by fax" method...

first I got a quote from Lakeshore and FunTime RV ... I then called 10 dealers in the local 400 miles radius and asked them if they could beat these prices ... in writing ... to include VIN number and final out the door purchase price ... none of them would even get within a thousand ... some becuase they knew that they only had one on theri lot and that someone would buy it... others becuase the weather was getting better -- today we hit 84 degrees..... so I went to FunTime and got this one ...

I made sure that I had the OUT THE DOOR -- trailer plus TTL - hitch, controller, everything (tanks filled, extra battery, etc) all in writing and all on a price invoice...

I told the dealer that I would not pay one extra cent no matter what the "opps we forgot to add this when we quoted the price" ...

The hardest part was actually adding extra paper to the fax machine... LOL


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## Bull Elk

Just out of curiosty, how much difference in price is there for a 28rsds with all options and one without the options? I noticed with Outbacks that many things are standard, but there still is a few options. I paid close to what allsixofus was quoted and that was right at about 75% of sticker price with all options. Does Lakeshore include all the options that are available?


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## Castle Rock Outbackers

I don't think any dealers order trailers without the options. Can't imagine trying to sell an Outback without the stand alone options or the designer packages:

Outside Camp Kitchen 
Oven 
4-Stabilizer Jacks 
Outside Shower 
2 Security Lights 
Tub Surround 
6 gal. Gas/Electric DSI Water Heater 
14â€ Spare Tire Kit 
Exterior Aluminum Picnic Table

Confort Package:
TV Antenna/Cable Hook up 
Microwave 
AM/FM/CD Stereo 
A & E Awning 
13,500 Ducted Carrier A/C (w/Remote)

Designer Package:
Oval Mirror 
Wall Border 
Cloth Shower Curtain 
Laundry Hamper 
Bathroom Accessories 
Brushed Nickel Coat Hooks 
Utensil Rack 
Sofa Pillows 
Innerspring Mattress 
Bedspread 
LP/Battery Cover 
Chrome Bumper Cover 
Catch-All Tray 
Raised Panel Refrigerator 
Recessed Cutting Board

Seems to me on the Outbacks that the only option you really have is what interior color you want.

Randy


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## Bubba-j

Sorry to hear of the misfortune.
Bad business is just that, "Bad business". We'll find these types throughout life and I think it's safe to say every dog has their day, so IMHO, they will get theirs. The dealership that thought they'd take a reasonable person for an unreasonable ride got busted. I'm glad you got your ticket back (deposit).

I joined this group and asked a question concerning buying an Outback FW. I was answered by many of the members and was given some real sound advice. Because of this great advice, in July I will drive to MI (Bonners Lakeshore RV--salesman name is John), and save six, yes count them, $6000 AND that's without my trade! The dealer in Ga where my stuff is stored (I'm in the military stationed in Korea) sounded as if I was getting the deal of the century, but I really wasn't. I'm not sure what he was thinking when he told me the deal he would give me, but I guess he thought I'd never find out that there are other dealerships that are willing to, and are capable of, making some pretty extraordinary deals. Thank God for Outbackers.com!

Our drive each way is over 900 miles and I plan to make a four-day trip out of it with the family. I figure we'll stay a night in a hotel on the way up, then camp on the way back to GA getting used to the new digs. Later I have a class in Florida, and then we're traveling to CA (our next assignment).

I'd recommend that anyone close enough to Lakeshore to make a reasonable drive, to make the drive and get "the deal of the century!" I'm pleased that the forum gave me this vector towards Lakeshore. I look forward to picking up the FW and getting on our way back in our beautiful country.

Good luck!


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## Allsixofus

OMG... I certainly cannot replay the two 30 minute conversations I had with the Sales manager here but let me sum it up with this quote... after telling him that I would drive to Michigan to save $2000.... then when a warranty service issue comes up I will take it to them for service... he says... "and you will be treated like a second rate citizen... I am sure you will not be satisfied with the level of service you get!" I told him that I am sure Keystone would love to hear that one of their sales representatives treated their customer that way... he told me that he would service the unit but it would be under his timelines and all of the customers that bought from him would come ahead of me!

I asked how he thought Keystone would feel about them discriminating against one of their product owners in that manner and he told me to feel free to contact Keystone...

He tried to tell me that in order to provide the high level of service their customers had come to expect that he could not sell units at that price. I told him that I was truly disappointed in the manner in which this was handled... he told me that he was disappointed that we could not come to an agreement.... I told him that we did in fact come to an agreement and he in fact set the conditions by advertising that they would "beat any competitors price"... I showed him the competitors price and he backed out of the deal.. SHAME ON HIM!

I asked for a statement in writing stating that they violated their advertised claim to beat all competitors prices... "that would not be in our best interest".... DUH! I told hiim that he could either have the owner send me a letter stating that or I would have an attorney do it on my behalf as I would like to include the letter with my package to the Attorney General and BBB.

After he explained the various differences in prices due to freight, prep, etc... I offered to pay the difference btwn freight to MI and freight to VA.... "just add that to my total"... still no deal...

I AM SEETHING... I have never been treated this way in my life... it is now the principal of the entire deal that will drive me to take action.

I had to break it to my kids tonight at dinner that we were not getting a camper... NOT A FEEL GOOD THING... I am so bummed...


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## Allsixofus

OBTW... www.dixiervsuperstore.com ... check it out for yourself... but don't be fooled!

Ghosty- thanks for the earlier advice... I wonder what kind of response I will get from Keystone... surely they will not condone this type of behavior from one of their authorized dealers.


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## Bull Elk

Allsixofus said:


> OBTW... www.dixiervsuperstore.com ... check it out for yourself... but don't be fooled!
> 
> Ghosty- thanks for the earlier advice... I wonder what kind of response I will get from Keystone... surely they will not condone this type of behavior from one of their authorized dealers.
> [snapback]27507[/snapback]​










Allsixofus - After looking at the website, it is clear what you are upset about. How could they advertise that way and then act like such a horses rear-end when challanged. Best of luck and I hope things work out for you and your family.


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## Ghosty

All6ofus...

two quick things...

First ....I would call the OWNER of the dixie rv superstore directly. Apparently he has a pretty good reputation in the RV industry according to looking him up on google. Last thing he probably wants is allot of negativism. He may also NOT be aware of the price gouging that his sales manager is doing. Looks like the sales manager may only have been there for less then a year. Worth a try. But I would not talk to anyone but the owner/president... tell whoever is answering the phone that is going to tell you that he is too busy to talk to you (menaing that he is going to talk to his sales manager first to get his side of the story), that you are filing a BBB and an AG compliant and that you want to talk to him before doing that just out of courtesy.... i wouldn't go into allot of "he said she said " stuff but that bascially his website -- which by the way IS paid by and hosted by his RV dealership -- that his website says that they will match any price -- and that apparently there is some cofusion onthe sales managers part as to what that exactly means... (keep in mind that the sales manager is probably his daughters husband's brother third cousin that he owes something too.... LOL

-------------------------

Second...i would start thinking "Thank God i didn't purchase this expensive trailer from those idiots"... lots more good honest dealers out there that are willing to sell to you ...

just a thought off the top of the head ... when i was looking at prices Lakeshore was the best price ... they also offered in the price when i was talking to them that they would deliver the first 500 miles free... that would only be 400 miles from your house since you are about 900 miles out from Lakeshore......

I decided to go with FunTimeRV although they were 500 dollars more since they were also 1300 miles closer and with the price of gas, wear and tear on the truck and having to take leave to go and get it, it seemed actually cheaper to go to FunTimeRv...

just food for thought...

anyway ... good luck ... don't let this bother you -- you will look back on this and be happy that you didnt get it from these idiots ... but you might want to try the fax method .... seemed to work for me and a few others great ... and its virtually no work for you at all ... just get a quote sent to you from lakeshore and FunTime and then take those quotes and begin contacting dealers within your area... tell them up front what the price is that they need to match and that you have a fax for proof ... and ask them for their OUT THE DOOR PRICE (THAT SHOULD INCLUDE EVERYTHING) ... negotiating AT the dealership is a no win for anyone except the dealer -- if they have a price you can live with they should be able to fax the vin number and purchase invoice over to you, signed by a salesperson -- call them and put a deposit on it over the phone via credit card -- and the first time you see the dealership is to pick up the trailer...

good luck


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## johnp

That home page looks cut and dry to me. Maybe a call to the BBB or AG's office might help. I think a road trip to MI is in your future.

John


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## Bubba-j

Allsixofus,
Indeed, relax and have a homebrew. Have two! There's got to be a three-day weekend upcoming that you can all load up and travel West and pick up a trailer, right?

From the sounds of it, this guy is a loser. Don't let him ruin your 2005 experience from the start. Chalk it up to his loss. Forget it and Drive on man! Take the kids for a surprise trip. My son doesn't understand the trip thing yet but in July he will!


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## Highlander96

All6oufus,

Travel 200 miles North up 301 to Leo's Vacation Center in Gambrills, MD 800-559-4793.

We ordered our 2005 21RS from them and it is due to come off of the line on March 24. They have been great to deal with and we used the Lakeshore Ad to beat their show price by roughly $1K. They are also the headquarters to the MD RV Association and have a very good reputation. They may have to order your unit, but if you have to it could be an easy day trip. BTW........When I was looking and talking to Hunter at Lakeshore Freight is almost the same from Goshen to MI as it is from Goshen to Baltimore. Don't ask why, but it was.

Sorry you are going through this. It is a very unnerving experience!!!!!!

Good Luck!

Tim


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## 1stTimeAround

AllSixofUs,

In the Richmond area you can purchase from McGeorge's Rolling Hills RV. I was satisfied with buying the 28RSS, I did have some problems with the TT being too much for my tow vehicle at the time, however I chalk that up to my inexperience as well.

They, like any dealer want to sell you a TT, however I did feel like the salesman was fair and the sales manager, was very decent during the issues with my tow vehicle at the time. We were working on an even trade, with no money loss, before I decided to go with the Dodge.

Give them a shot if you like, they just added a brand new repair facility and are up to something like 10-12 bays now. They have a huge lot of RVs to choose from and mine was there in 3 weeks.

Good luck

Jason


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## Allsixofus

Thanks for all the replies... I talked with FuntimeRV yesterday.... I also talked with a dealer down at Murrells Inlet, SC who is calling me back today... I will call the other today...

Thanks for the great advice... I am calling the dealership today to try to get an appointment to go in and talk with the owner.... more to follow...

~Scott


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## California Jim

Unfortunately with RV sales as strong as they are the dealers have less incentive to sell at the deeper discount levels. They can simply let you walk and wait for the next guy who may be emotially attached and ill informed. Cha-Ching! They just trippled their profit and the sales guys do a little dance in the office when no customers are looking. I know, I've been a sales manager for a long time.

Keep searching and stay positive. You'll find that rig and at a good price too.


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## mswalt

allsixofus,

I'm with Jim.....hang in there until you find the right price. You will.

Until then, relax and have fun looking.

Mark


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## missouricamper

Just for grins, I emailed your RV dealer and asked "could you give me details on your 'best' pricing?" so far, no response.... maybe you could have the DW call and ask for details like she is a brand new client.

No matter what, I'd still buy from someone else. Who wants to play games with that much money. Tell me what it costs and quit wasting my time -


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## campntn

Link em to this forum and this string. bad pr on the internet is bad pr WORLDWIDE.


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## Allsixofus

missouricamper-
If you initiated the request from their webpage... you will never get a response... I tried that method twice with no response.... when I finally went in there in person I told them about it and obviously it has not been fixed... would be interested to see their best price but will bet you that it is $22,700 plus tax, title, tag, hitch+labor and $195 processing fee...









Thanks
Scott


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## tdvffjohn

Maybe we can ALL e mail them and tell them the word is out. Bad business is bad for business!


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## Armand_C

Sorry to hear about your troubles. Just hang in there, things will work out. Even if that dealer did beat the price, I would still be hesitant about buying anything from them after pulling those stunts.


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