# New Tv - Ford E-350 Extended "bus" -concerns



## hoover67 (Mar 7, 2005)

We have our new tow vehicle. It is a '03 Ford E-350 Extended Van (technically it is classified as a bus). It has the towing package and is ready to go. I am concerned about towing a large OB - such as the 28rss or 28rsds with this van. The hitch is quite a ways from the rear wheel axle. The tow rating is around 7400lbs. I believe. I assume we need some sort of weight distribution system. Should the over hang of the rear end cause me significant problems. We have a PU at the moment and it is as if we are not towing anything.

Thanks


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## PDX_Doug (Nov 16, 2004)

hoover,

If it were me, and your van is what I am picturing, I think I would stick with the pickup as a tow vehicle. You hit the nail on the head regarding the rear overhang. Not only is that likely to have a serious effect on manuvering and stability, but the 'lever arm' created by the long overhang is going to have the effect of increasing tounge weight on the rear axle. It's a little like a wind chill factor (it feels colder than it really is), the tounge of the trailer dosen't weigh anymore, but because of the long overhang, it feels heavier to the van.

A little experiment you can try, that may better demonstrate this: Hold one arm straight out to your side. Try to hold a weight (say 10 pounds) in the hand of your outstretched hand. It will feel pretty heavy. Now move the weight up to the top of your outstretched arm (near the shoulder). You will notice that the weight does not feel nearly as heavy. Yet is still the same 10 pounds.

Also, the tow rating you give is right at the limit for the bigger Outbacks you mentioned. You really have no reserve. And with a van of that size, you are going to be tempted to really load it up, which will further reduce your available towing capacity.

So, as I said, I think you may be better off using your truck.

Happy Trails,
Doug


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## 1stTimeAround (Sep 22, 2004)

Keep on Truckin'!!

Jason


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## tdvffjohn (Mar 10, 2005)

The overhang obviously is the concern. The van is a 1 ton chassis so I would assume with a weight dist hitch set up it should be ok. Most vans do not have a long overhang and I would be curious to know how long yours actually is. On my sons dually from the center of the axle to the rear of the bumper is 50 in and my suburban is 53. How much longer is yours.

If given a choice I would stay with the truck but your first line was 'we bought our new tow vehicle' so.....................the 1 ton chassis is the key on the van. As Doug said you could easily overload yourself as the 28RSDS will be close to 7000 when loaded for camping.

John


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## kjp1969 (Apr 25, 2004)

Pullrite lists a hitch for your van. Like a Henlsey, it makes your trailer and TV think there's a 5th wheel setup back there (sort of) and solves the stability problems you're (rightly) worried about. Pullrite hitches are about 1/2 the cost of a Hensley Arrow. Not cheap, but one or the other is probably the best solution for your situation.

www.pullrite.com

Kevin P.


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## PDX_Doug (Nov 16, 2004)

Kevin,

That PullRite hitch is an interesting concept. I have never seen it before.
Is there anyone around here that actually uses one? I would be interested in thier first-hand experiences and opinions.

Happy Trails,
Doug


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## hoover67 (Mar 7, 2005)

Well, we sold the 20.5 year old truck which was not our original tow vehicle last week. We have been towing with a G-20 Chevy Hi-Top conversion van. With our sixth child soon to be born, we had to move up to a larger vehicle. We found that the Suburbans/Sequoias and such did not have enough room for six children (5 of which are boys) even though some are little. (Carseats take up a lot of room besides the fact getting in and out was a major pain) We ended up with the extended even though we were looking for the regular length. What can I say, $10K less is a lot of money. We just happened to get this van in perfect condition for a great price. We do want to move up to an Outback but may have to get something smaller like the hybrids with three fold out beds (shorter and lighter). The outback dealer did not think it was a problem using an extended van of course. We spoke with them before we bought the van. I am very familiar with the laws of physics in regards to levers so that is why I thought I would bring up my concerns to people who have no vested interest in making money off of my decision. I appreciate any advice and cautions.

I looked at the pull-right site. Are you suggestion that I need to replace the receiver hitch that came as a factory option? I will try to get out this evening and measure from the axle to the hitch.

Thanks.


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## kjp1969 (Apr 25, 2004)

The pullrite completely replaces the factory hitch receiver with a different design- it physically changes the pivot point of the hitch from aft of the rear bumper to just inches aft of the rear axle. Any trailer movement is therefore transmitted directly to the tires of the vehicle, eliminating the lever created by the big 'ole overhang in your extended van. The Hensley hitch does the same thing, using a fairly simple "4 bar problem" than any engineer would be familiar with. Either way, you get the benefits of a 5th wheel setup without a truck chassis.

Both hitches are expensive, but by all accounts they work (I can speak for the Hensley from personal experience, not the pullrite). Either way, you're right to question the stability of an extended van and deal with the setup before the purchse. If it were me (and I'm no expert, just a schmo who wrecked a trailer and TV from sway) I'd choose a lighter smaller trailer or cough up the extra dough for one of these hitches.

Kevin P.


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## dmbcfd (Sep 8, 2004)

When specifying a new tow vehicle for work, I was surprised to learn that the 2006 E-350 extended 15 passenger van is not rated to tow anything. I did not research the older models, but I can't help thinking they must have learned something?

Steve


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## CamperAndy (Aug 26, 2004)

Here is a link to the Ford Towing guide for the E series vans. Depending on what engine you get you can tow from nothing to a whole bunch.

Ford E Series Towing Guide


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## hoover67 (Mar 7, 2005)

Interesting. It seems that there are conflicting views on this. On the original sticker of the van, it gives a tow rating with the towing package. I suppose if I stay under 75-85% of that weight I should be okay. I assume that the 28rss or 28rsds would be pushing it. Too bad this stuff is not cut and dry.


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## Fire44 (Mar 6, 2005)

Ford makes their extended passenger and cargo van by extending the body and leaving the wheelbase the same, that gives you a large overhang out the back. GM extends the wheelbase of the van, giving you a large turning circle but keeps the towing ability about the same.

For example (2005 spec's)

GM Reg van (12 passenger) Wheelbase 135" Overall length 224.1"
GM Ext van (15 passenger) Wheelbase 155" Overall length 244.1"

Ford reg van (12 passenger) Wheelbase 138" Overall length 211.9"
Ford ext van (12 passenger) Wheelbase 138" Overall length 232"

GM's overall length grows 20" when extended and the wheelbase grows with it.
Fords overall length grows 20.1" when extended and the wheelbase stays the same.

Gary


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## hoover67 (Mar 7, 2005)

Yes. I looked at the difference in the dimensions. I did like the longer wheel base on the Chevy but I also liked the wider body of the Ford. I just assumed that I would be able to tow what the sticker listed. It looks as if we will need to stick with the PU or perhaps the 3500#hybrid camper.


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## CamperAndy (Aug 26, 2004)

Dont get too hung up on the over hang. It affects sway and there are controls for sway. You did not list your engine or gear and that affect tow rating. As you can see in my earlier post (with the link) the E series vans can tow a lot if properly equipped.


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## hoover67 (Mar 7, 2005)

We had planned to add weight distribution and anti-sway systems. I unfortunately have the 3:55 rear end and the 5.4L engine. According to the chart, I would be within limits for towing. Just being skeptical! I realize you cannot always trust what is written on paper.


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## CamperAndy (Aug 26, 2004)

hoover67 said:


> We had planned to add weight distribution and anti-sway systems. I unfortunately have the 3:55 rear end and the 5.4L engine. According to the chart, I would be within limits for towing. Just being skeptical! I realize you cannot always trust what is written on paper.
> [snapback]49992[/snapback]​


Your biggest problem is not the tow rating of the Van or the weight of the trailer (but it is really really close) it is the extras associated with the 6 kids. You can figure on 125 to 175 pounds per kid for each kid and their stuff. That will knock a 1000 pounds off your towing really quick.

I could see you getting a 26rs but nothing bigger and you would be really limited on towing in flat areas and carrying very little stuff.

Another option is to take 2 vehicles. Costs more on gas but cheaper then a new TV. You can carry a couple of kids in the van and the DW can follow in another car with a few of them. Spread the weight around.

Good luck on what ever you decide.


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## hoover67 (Mar 7, 2005)

We already have the new van. Did not want to take two vehicles to visit Grandparents and on outings without the camper. With the babies it is hard for both of us to do the driving. Someone has to break up the fights. We will definitely look for the smaller trailer. Once we remove one of the seats, we should free up some more weight. We always travel VERY LIGHT. I cannot deal with a lot of clothes and toys. Thanks for the info!


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## 7heaven (Jun 4, 2005)

hoover67, If you have the V10, towing up to a 28RSDS/RSS should be no problem. Ours handles like a champ. Good luck!


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## hoover67 (Mar 7, 2005)

7Heaven,

Unfortunately it is a V8. We would have gotten a V10 but this was such a good deal. What type of hitch/weight distribution/anti-sway system did you put on it?

How big is the hit in gas mileage do you get with your 28RSS? How many people do you have in the trailer? Is is crowded? Could you fit in the 26RSS?

Thanks.


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## 7heaven (Jun 4, 2005)

We have the Equalizer brand weight distribution/anti-sway system. We had to read the manual and adjust it (added 2 washers).

We have 7 people in the 28RSS and fit fine. The dinette is still open, so the 8th person could fit there.

We had the 5.4L when we first got the TT and decided to upgrade the TV to the V10. It's a tough decision and it took quite a while to find a standard wheel base V10 12 passenger.

I would take the whole family (if possible) to the OB dealer and spend Quantity time in each TT and see how it feels. Personally, if you are set on keeping your TV, I would go with the 26RS.

Gas mileage towing between the two wasn't that much different, about 8.

Good Luck!


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## DANJOGAVINMO (Apr 17, 2004)

I think CamperAndy posted the 2005 towing guide, Hoover67 mentioned that the van was actually a 2003. Don't think it changed the numbers though.

Here is the link for that:
https://www.fleet.ford.com/showroom/rv_trai...003_ESeries.pdf

And if it is a 5.4L 3.55, I read the guide to say 6200LB. Then minus passenger weight, tongue weight, gear in van, that is what you have left.

The 26RS might be do-able and honestly sleeps as many as 28RSDS. If you pack light enough in the trailer you might be within your guidelines but not with much margin to spare. I am too an advocate of the "tow 75% of your tow rating", but if you are willing to go into it expecting slow pulls up hills, etc, then maybe it will work for you.

My gut feel tells me you need to be thinking of something even lighter than the outbacks.


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## 7heaven (Jun 4, 2005)

Unfortunately, the passenger vans are referred to as Wagons, so the chart reads 5,600 pounds. The seats and carpet must weigh 600 pounds. It cost me about $5K to upgrade to the V10, but it was definitely worth it. Good Luck hoover67, and keep safety first. Hope it all works out for you.


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