# Solar In The Pacific Northwest?



## thefulminator

Going to pick up the new 250RS is a couple days and am going through any add-ons I want to have the dealer install. I always take my batteries off the trailer during the winter and keep them on float chargers in my garage. My storage lot wants an absurd amount of cash to keep the trailer plugged in. Now I'm wondering about having a solar panel installed just to keep the batteries topped off but I'm not sure how viable that would be in Western Washington and if so what wattage I would need. Would like input from those who have experience with solar panels on their trailers.


----------



## Insomniak

Not sure about the amount of sun where you are, but I put a 20 watt panel on top of our a/c unit and it keeps the batteries fully charged at all times, even though it's laying flat. I'd think a 50 watt panel would be more than enough, and you can find gobs of them on EBay. I wouldn't pay the dealer a ton of money when you can do this easily yourself. The a/c unit is the perfect place to mount a small panel and you won't put any holes in the roof. Run the wires down the fridge vent, under the trailer, up to the front a-frame, connect everything to a 7 watt charge controller and you'll be in business!


----------



## H2oSprayer

I have also been considering adding a solar panel for keeping the battery topped off during storage. I don't know much about solar setups, so I'm wondering if the following items would be sufficient to keep the battery charged while in storage:

LiteFuze® 30W Mono-crystalline Solar Panel 30 Watt

Sunforce 7 Amp Charge Controller

From those that know about solar power; I am open to other suggestions.

Insomniak: Any chance you may have a photo you can share of the panel mounted to the AC shroud?


----------



## ORvagabond

I store my trailer all winter and when I purchased it I had the dealer install a Blue Sea battery disconnect on the frame by the propane tanks and I simply turn it off during the winter and the bateries are fine in the spring.


----------



## Insomniak

H2oSprayer said:


> I have also been considering adding a solar panel for keeping the battery topped off during storage. I don't know much about solar setups, so I'm wondering if the following items would be sufficient to keep the battery charged while in storage:
> 
> LiteFuze® 30W Mono-crystalline Solar Panel 30 Watt
> 
> Sunforce 7 Amp Charge Controller
> 
> From those that know about solar power; I am open to other suggestions.
> 
> Insomniak: Any chance you may have a photo you can share of the panel mounted to the AC shroud?


I do have a couple photos somewhere, just have to find them. Basically, I used 1" square aluminum tubing from Home Depot, cut into two 20" or so lengths. Drill 2 holes in the top and bottom of each piece of tubing to align with the holes in the a/c shroud, larger hole on top to accommodate a big screwdriver, smaller on the bottom to hold the bolt head & washer. Remove & re-use the bolt/washer from the shroud to fasten the aluminum tubing while at the same time reattaching the shroud. Use four stainless steel L brackets and fasteners to attach the solar panel frame to the aluminum tubing, and that's all there is to it. I used a medium duty extension cord with the ends cut off as my wire from the panel to the charge controller and fastened it along the frame and propane line with zip ties. Very simple mod and only took about an hour.


----------



## thefulminator

I used to work in a battery shop that sold car/truck/bus/heavy equipment batteries. I know they will discharge by themselves over time. What you really don't want is for them to be flat in the winter. I've seen batteries with deformed cases from the water in them expanding from freezing.

_From Trojan Battery:_
_The freezing temperature of the electrolyte in a fully charged battery is -92.0oF. At a 40% state of charge, electrolyte will freeze if the temperature reaches approximately 16.0oF._

My new 250RS has a factory battery cutoff switch in the front storage compartment. I still like the idea of a solar panel just for piece of mind. At the prices shown on H2OSprayers links, the total cost would be less than replacing a pair of batteries. Also, I've used low voltage landscape lighting wire for other projects. It is UV resistant and was identical to the wire in my Jayco tent trailer except for jacket color.


----------



## Leedek

*Myth : Solar doesn't work in cool, cloudy, or foggy climates.*
*Fact: *Solar panels work just fine in ambient light and will produce significant energy in the fog or on overcast days. In fact, solar panels are actually _more_ efficient at cooler temperatures than hot ones. Although this might seem counter-intuitive, consider that solar panels on a rooftop in cool, foggy San Francisco produce only one percent less electricity than one in nearby Sacramento, where it's sunny and hot. Consider too that Germany leads the world in residential solar right now, and doesn't have a sunny climate. (This from Top 10 Solar Myths  )

From everything I have been able to find: A 30 watt panel will keep two 12 VDC batteries up to charge. I'm one for over engineering so I agree with Insomniak that the 50 watt panel is the way to go.









Thanks for a good question and discussion. I can see another mod in my future.


----------



## willingtonpaul

can't recommend solar enough....i have 340 wats on the roof and another 250 watts of portable panels for when i am parked in the shade....

do you ever do any dry camping, or want to have that as an option ? 'cause for about $200 you could put on an 80-100 watt panel and gain alot. it would:

1. give you more low light / overcast capacity
2. give you some dry camping options for not having to start a genset

you could put on something like this:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/100-W-Watt-100W-Monocrystalline-PV-Solar-Panel-and-Charge-Controller-12V-RV-Boat-/251147929404?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3a7995473c

you just need some mounting clips and you are good to go. i never plug my trailer in at home, and never take the batteries out in the winter, no matter how cold it's gonna be. i use tilting brackets, so i can tilt the panels up in the winter so i can catch the sun low on the horizon and the panels can shed snow. an added bonus is that i can clean and condition the roof under them, so it is a consideration. you could use these brackets (the same as i use) if you wanted to be able to clean under it....

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Solar-Panel-Universal-Rooftop-Solar-Panel-Tilt-Mount-Kit-40W-to-100W-Panels-/111044487048?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item19dac46788

and yes, cooler temps are better for a panel(s) and a battery(ies). the ultimate is a system that incorporates a MPPT charge controller with a battery temp sensor to take advantage of those cooler temps. but for your needs, a PWM controller would likely be more than enough.....


----------



## KTMRacer

I have a small (20ish watt) panel for my smaller home made toyhauler. It keeps the battery charge during the winter in our cloudy portland winters. My outback would draw more standy current if I didn't turn off the battery disconnect switch. But if the switch is off, it really won't take much to keep the battery topped off.

Haven't done so on my outback since it is covered in the winter, but the batteries will self discharge even with the disconnect switch. So, every few months I hook up my portable solar panels (160W) for a day to bring them back up.


----------



## Insomniak

Ok, here's the photo. A real simple mod that probably cost me less than $100


----------



## thefulminator

I really like Insomniak's AC mount. Will have to see how big the cover on the AC on the new trailer is after I pick it up tomorrow. My trailer points North when stored so I would probably just do a flat mount.

There is a 50W big brother to the panel H20Sprayer posted.

LiteFuze® 50W Mono-crystalline Solar Panel 50 Watt 

Also a 100W panel on Amazon that gets really good reviews for a few bucks more. The size may be an issue.

RENOGY 100 Watt 100w Monocrystalline Photovoltaic PV Solar Panel Module 12V Battery Charging


----------



## H2oSprayer

Thanks for adding the photo Insomniak. I really like the idea of adding it to the top of the AC unit rather then adding more holes to the roof. Any tips on running the wires down?


----------



## Oregon_Camper

Insomniak said:


> I used a medium duty extension cord with the ends cut off as my wire from the panel to the charge controller and fastened it along the frame and propane line with zip ties.


Where is the controller?

Where does the wire go after we see it disappear in the lower right hand corner of your picture?


----------



## Insomniak

The wire runs down the fridge vent, which is easy to do once you remove the cover. You can then pull it down from the roof into the fridge access area on the side of the trailer. I drilled a hole in the bottom of the access hatch, ran the wire into the cabinet where the AC/DC converter lives, and shoved it down the hole where all the wiring comes up from the underbelly. From there, I just cut a little hole in the underbelly plastic, fished the wire through and pulled it up to the A-frame on the front of the trailer. The propane line was conveniently right there, so I zip tied the wire to the pipe, all the way to the front. The charge controller is hidden under the propane tank cover, where it's somewhat protected from the elements. I considered mounting the controller inside the trailer by the electrical panel and making my connections there, but I couldn't find a good spot for it.


----------



## willingtonpaul

i ran my wire down the fridge vent also. if you do it, just be certain to completely silicone seal the hole you drill in the bottom or side of the fridge compartment. if there was ever a propane leak there, you want the propane to leak out the vented area and not seep into the trailer or underbelly. running the line down the fridge vent is definitely the way to go.

here is a thread from nathan that shows how to do it properly.....

http://www.outbackers.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=30622

he wired the charge controller right into the panel, which saves running wiring right to the battery(ies). when researching my system i was told by a solar expert that doing it that way reduces the efficiency of the system; that wiring the panels right to the charge controller and then from the charge controller directly to the battery was the best way to do it so as to not have voltage drop. also, having the charge controller as close to the batteries as possible (like with an inverter) is best. i ran my cable the same as insomniak, and then into the front storage compartment, where i mounted the charge controller, and then ran a short wire right to the batteries.

and if you really want to know the status of the batteries, i highly recommend installing one of these:

http://compare.ebay.com/like/390574679168?var=lv&ltyp=AllFixedPriceItemTypes&var=sbar

it is an awesome tool to know exactly what you are taking or putting back and the voltage of the battery bank.

here is a link to a thread on my install and system, in case it helps. i kinda went overboard with my system, as we dry camp alot. not what you are looking for, but you can see the tilt mounts and how i ran the wires.

http://www.dogandtrailer.com/camper-modifications/solar-array-performance/


----------



## wileydog

Just installed the Renology 200W kit on my 2012 250RS. Bought off ebay....super fast shipping. New to solar, but the quality seemed pretty good. With the kit and extra parts, think the total came to around $450. I installed the two 100W panels in the space between the middle vent and refrig vent, in line with each other...the first panel was about a foot from the front cap. I turned the panel wiring so that they were next to each other and almost across from the vent. I left about a 6 inch space between the front and rear panel. I ran a blue flex tube down the vent and passed the wires through that...will keep the wires safe from heat. Sealed the hole with silicone and wired the charger just under the propane alarm. I used 4 gauge wire (had to reduce to 10 gauge for about a 6 inch run to wire into the controller as the 4 was too large) in another blue flex tube and ran under the trailer to the batteries (probably about 15 feet of wire...but should hold the charge since I used 4 gauge). Once you get the converter out, you can see the wires coming up from under the trailer...I just used a long screw driver to push through the bottom cover, then drilled the hole larger so that I could push the flex tube up (be careful of the wires that are in there)....went straight in. Zip tied the tube with the wire to the batteries along the propane pipes. Dicored the mounts on the roof....also bought a 4 foot, 1.5 aluminium angle beam...cut into two sections of 22 inches and used to make a barrier at the front edge of the first panel to help keep it safe from anything that might hit it in travel...and block the space in the front so that wind would not push up while towing, used dicor to hold in place.

Everything worked, I don't think I will ever need to worry about dead batteries when I get the trailer. Also, will be trying some boondock camping at the end of the month...can't wait to see how the solar panels work out.

Also took the time to install a cyclone for the black tank vent since I was up there.

So far, so good!

Next mod is to put in awning LEDs (wired today, but thought it was going to ran, so did not want to put the strip in yet), I routed the wire along the existing awning motor wire...keeps everything nice and neat. I drilled an angle into the front storage compartment and taped into the light that is there. I will be adding a switch later...it has not arrived in the mail yet. I am also thinking of making better rear storage by replacing the bed step with something larger and cutting a hole to make more space........

Did not take pics....sorry.


----------



## willingtonpaul

awesome, you are going to love having solar.


----------



## Tourdfox

Once you have solar , You will never look back. Been boondocking for yrs with solar. Last yr i also converted to 4 x 6 volt batteries. Your going to wonder why you never put solar on sooner.


----------



## 2011 210RS

I bought the Renogy 100w panel and 30A controller. It is overcast, the shades are closed and the panel is putting out 8vdc with ambient light only. I am installing them this week. I will keep you guys updated.


----------

