# 28rsds - What Do You Tow It With



## campinhappy (Oct 25, 2007)

I'm really confused about all the weights and figures. So I just wanted to know what those who have a 28RSDS tow with?

I'm planning on doing this with a Suburban 1500 with 373 rear end. Am I going to regret it?


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## ftroop (Sep 1, 2006)

As it says below, I tow with an '02 Suburban 2500, with the 8.1 liter and 3.73 gears. It tows like a dream, attacks the Socal mountains with no problems. A 1500 is going to struggle, i would definately recomend moving up to the 2500, if possible. Stronger suspension helps with the length and weight. I think you would be at the max for your towing capacity, also. My set up maxes out at 10,500 lbs. My dad used to say that you are doing well if you give yourself a 25% cushion in your max towing capacity. It's advice I have felt to be worthwhile and I feel a lot safer!! Good luck!


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## campinhappy (Oct 25, 2007)

Now I just have to figure out how to tell the wife


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## Y-Guy (Jan 30, 2004)

I has a 28RSS and towed with my Avalanche 1500, it wasn't a speed demon but did fine. Wish I had put on air bags as the rear end of the Av was pretty soft. When I started towing with our F350 though I didn't even know the Outback was behind me.


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## Shizon (Oct 22, 2007)

I just picked up my 28rsds last weekend, so I have only towed it home. But, I have an 07 Toyota Tundra 5.7 DC. 
Sean


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## baileys crib (Sep 12, 2007)

I pull with a Ram 1500 with the 3:55 and I am at the limit. It pulls really smooth, but the gas mileage is terrible and it is a little sluggish on hills. I will upgrade to a 2500 or 3500 at some point, but for now I will stick with the 1500. Good luck!


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## mom2countrykids (Sep 25, 2007)

We use a gas Ford Excursion. It won't win any speed records, but it pulls and handles safely. We won't talk about gas mileage or lack there of. Now if anyone has a diesel excursion for sale......


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## Sayonara (Jul 23, 2007)

Run the numbers as well!! GVWR, GCVWR, FAWR, RAWR add ~1000lbs to the dry weight of the trailer and dont forget the people and gear in the truck. The numbers are the reality check. Peoples opinions wont help you any if an accident happens and your held liable because you overloaded your TV. most insurances will back out if they hear you were not complying and in some states its illegal. making a decision based on someones opinion that it handles safely wont help if you ever get in a bad accident in a overloaded TV. 
Be safe and have fun!! I had to go through this reality check a few months ago. I was very surprised at what i was missing.


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## Insomniak (Jul 7, 2006)

As shown below......

Sometimes just for fun we hook up the neighbors 31RQS to the rear bumper and pull that too. Gas mileage suffers a bit though.


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## rasvms (Jan 5, 2007)

My TT/TV combination works according to the numbers but I was concerned about the wheel base of the TV. I went with the Hensley hitch for this reason and have been very pleased. Power has been a minor issue on a couple of long hill climbs but not enough to warrant thoughts of upgrading. I travel with the tanks empty. Highway mileage around 9 mpg.


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## Fanatical1 (Jan 9, 2006)

Sayonara said:


> Run the numbers as well!! GVWR, GCVWR, FAWR, RAWR add ~1000lbs to the dry weight of the trailer and dont forget the people and gear in the truck. The numbers are the reality check. Peoples opinions wont help you any if an accident happens and your held liable because you overloaded your TV. most insurances will back out if they hear you were not complying and in some states its illegal. making a decision based on someones opinion that it handles safely wont help if you ever get in a bad accident in a overloaded TV.
> Be safe and have fun!! I had to go through this reality check a few months ago. I was very surprised at what i was missing.


I agree completely with DT here on the importance to check the weight limits of your Suburban and trailer.

I had a 1500 Suburban and tow a 26KBRS which is about 700#'s lighter than your trailer. The Suburban did a reasonable job towing on flat lands in 3rd., but would not pull it in overdrive. Going up slight grades it would want to shift into second to maintain speed. I personally did not feel that this set up would go up any type of mountains safely. After a summer of towing I have since upgraded the tow vehicle, and am happy I did.... My opinion is that even if the weights are "good to go", you will not be happy towing with the Sub.

Others may feel differently and that's fine... My brother in law tows with a 1500 conversion van and thinks nothing of being in first gear with his foot to the 
floor going up steep grades.


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## BritsOnTour (Sep 15, 2006)

We also tow with a 2500 suburban (4.10 gears), have not struggled with pulling at all (even with full water tank), nice to have the comfort of knowing we can throw anything in the camper and still be fine on weight. Would recommend getting equilzer hitch and prodigy brake controller.

Also had to upgrade tv when looking for tt! Previously had a 1500 conversion van and it was not going to cut it!!

As others have said, check the weights carefully - be safe!

Dave


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## PDX_Doug (Nov 16, 2004)

First of all...








*Welcome to Outbackers!*








Glad to have you aboard!

We have been very successful towing our 28RS-DS with a Nissan Titan. We have towed with this combo for three seasons now, including a 3,000 mile trip in extreme conditions this summer (try 115 degrees one day, 9,000 feet altitude the next), and the truck has always performed very well.

I do have to agree with Sayonara though. Run the numbers, and accept what they are telling you. Beyond that, you will figure out soon enough whether your current 'Burb is up to the task or not.

Most of all... Be safe!

Happy Trails,
Doug


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## Nathan (Jan 2, 2007)

Like the others said, check the numbers. Plan on ~1000 lbs for a TW and see if they work. I pull with a 1/2 ton truck, but am probably right on the edge. When everything is right it does a great job. When something bad happens (strong wind gust, panic stop, etc), it becomes.... more exciting.....









If weights are within spec, then your Burb should pull the trailer. Whether you like how it pulls is another question. None of the manufacturers will tell you how fast you will get up that hill when maxed out on weights. Again, my 1/2 ton with a 5.4L does an acceptable job, but it has to work.

In short, for both of the above reasons, I often daydream of Diesels...


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## whodey (Feb 9, 2007)

First, Welcome to Outbackers!

When we first bought our 28rsds, I had a 05 silverado 5.3L ext cab w/4.10 rear. It pulled OK, but no such thing as OD. Kept our trips close to home. Last trip with the chevy, had to get in the left lane to exit, went to pass, nothing was there. Hit the red line, backed off and waited for a good samaritan to let me over. That's when I got MY diesel. Doesn't have all the options as the chevy, but pulls like a champ. Now I'm ready to do some long distance camping.

Mike


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## campinhappy (Oct 25, 2007)

Sayonara said:


> Run the numbers as well!! GVWR, GCVWR, FAWR, RAWR add ~1000lbs to the dry weight of the trailer and dont forget the people and gear in the truck. The numbers are the reality check. Peoples opinions wont help you any if an accident happens and your held liable because you overloaded your TV. most insurances will back out if they hear you were not complying and in some states its illegal. making a decision based on someones opinion that it handles safely wont help if you ever get in a bad accident in a overloaded TV.
> Be safe and have fun!! I had to go through this reality check a few months ago. I was very surprised at what i was missing.


Where do I find all of the numbers? I've looked in the manual and it basically shows the GVWR and Tow Capacity with the way I read it the tow capacity is at GVWR. I'm seriously confused.

Also, we looked for a good 2500 suburban (gently used) when we bought our latest 2000 model, and they weren't to be found. I checked on E-bay the other day and there were only 4 in the nation on Ebay







. I've heard that if you're not pulling a load the 2500 rides pretty rough...any opinions?

Thanks,


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## Justman (Jul 22, 2006)

I wouldn't pull it with anything but a 2500 with at least a 6.0 liter engine and 4.10 rear end. I personally don't like the way my Yukon XL tows our 25RS-S. Not enough power...

Trust me -- You won't be happy trying to pull it with at 1500.

What's good though is that you're asking the right questions of the right people. There are quite a few people on this forum. Most of them know quite a bit more than me. I've leaned on them heavily for info in the past and they've always come through.

I can feel your pain about searching for a 2500 Burb. They're hard to find... I have a guy in my church that had to special order a new one because they couldn't find a used one anywhere close by.


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## beachbum (Nov 27, 2006)

You should also see a GCWR Gross Combined Weight Rating, total of tv and tt. You should also see max tongue weight in TV manual. GVWR includes all the gear and fuel and people/animals and the tongue weight of the trailer.
Most people wind up OK with combined weight but get nailed on the GVWR because a heavy tongue weight will put the tv over the limit. 2500 trucks get very close on the GVWR with big trailers because of this. Diesels especially because of the extra weight of diesel/transmission combination. You will be pushing the weight envelope of the 1500 truck.
But didn't I see on another post that you went ahead and got the Ford F350??








david


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## campinhappy (Oct 25, 2007)

So do I have to go and weigh the burb to get my base, then add in a value for the family, fuel, and then see if the tongue weight puts us over the GVWR?


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## mswalt (Sep 14, 2004)

I


> can feel your pain about searching for a 2500 Burb. They're hard to find... I have a guy in my church that had to special order a new one because they couldn't find a used one anywhere close by.


I haven't checked lately, but when I was looking, I found several within a 3-hour drive of Abilene. Never have regretted it.

When not pulling, even with the recommended 80 PSI in rear tires, it drives really well. I couldn't be happier for the DW to use it as her daily driver. I know she's about as safe as she can get in an SUV.

Good luck.

BTW, hope your test drive with the new Outback goes off really well.

Mark


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## Sayonara (Jul 23, 2007)

campinhappy said:


> So do I have to go and weigh the burb to get my base, then add in a value for the family, fuel, and then see if the tongue weight puts us over the GVWR?


Thats what I did. I weighed my F350 with just me in it. That gave me the GVW (gross vehicle weight with me). Then add all you gear, people, tongue weight etc and compare it to the GVRW (gross vehicle weight rating). On our last trip I stopped at a Flying J and weighed the whole rig. on these types of scales it will give you the FAW (front or steer axle weight), RAW (rear or drive axle weight), TAW (trailer axle weight) and GCVWR (gross combined vehicle rating.) you can comper the GVW, FAW and RAW to the GVWR, FAWR and the RAWR. These ratings should be on the drivers side door pillar. If you have the time and the family has the patience, disconnect the TV and weigh the loaded TV and TT seperately. I forgot to do this. at that time but was able to get back and get the GVW.
Good Luck!


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## ftroop (Sep 1, 2006)

campinhappy said:


> Run the numbers as well!! GVWR, GCVWR, FAWR, RAWR add ~1000lbs to the dry weight of the trailer and dont forget the people and gear in the truck. The numbers are the reality check. Peoples opinions wont help you any if an accident happens and your held liable because you overloaded your TV. most insurances will back out if they hear you were not complying and in some states its illegal. making a decision based on someones opinion that it handles safely wont help if you ever get in a bad accident in a overloaded TV.
> Be safe and have fun!! I had to go through this reality check a few months ago. I was very surprised at what i was missing.


Where do I find all of the numbers? I've looked in the manual and it basically shows the GVWR and Tow Capacity with the way I read it the tow capacity is at GVWR. I'm seriously confused.

Also, we looked for a good 2500 suburban (gently used) when we bought our latest 2000 model, and they weren't to be found. I checked on E-bay the other day and there were only 4 in the nation on Ebay







. I've heard that if you're not pulling a load the 2500 rides pretty rough...any opinions?

Thanks,
[/quote]I find that the 2500 rides quite well empty, smoother than the "98 Explorer i had and way smoother than my old 89 F-250 4X4. Just my two cents!!


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## campmg (Dec 24, 2005)

I bought my 2003 Yukon XL 2500 last year and it came with pretty cheap tires. They were new but cheap. The ride was very rough. After a tire went bad last month I replaced all four with a set of Michelins. They're pricey but have improved the ride a bunch. Now the downside is that they seem softer which helps the ride but I think hinders the tow performance. Passing semi's and winds tend to blow me a bit like when I had 1/2 ton Yukon with P rated tires. I'm still tinkering with the hitch but overall not sure the improved ride is worth the degraded tow performance.


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## malibutay (Sep 5, 2007)

I tow mine with a Dodge Ram 1500 Hemi with 3.92 gears and I have plenty of power but the suspension in the rear was a little loose for my taste. I put some super springs on and now the truck is alot more stable and firm. I think a 3/4 ton would be better and a 1 ton better than that and maybe a aircraft tug would be even better but I pull with what I got and hey the salesman said it would work









All Kiding aside I did the numbers and really sweated over it before I bought it. I have pulled it fully loaded over 400 miles 1 way and It pulls great in my opinion but I do things when I load to keep down the weight like not putting in ice till I get to the campground and I try to spread out the wieght so its not all on the hitch.

TV Curb Weight = 5095 lbs (this is unmanned but including fuel and standard equiment)
TT Curb wieght =6000 lbs (wieghed at scale)
Gross Combination Weight Rating (GCWR) = 14000 lbs

I have 2905 lbs of stuff I can bring including family to hit the GCWR

or the TV has a 8750 lbs towing capacity or 6000 lbs-8750lbs = 2750 lbs of more towing capacity


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## wtscl (May 22, 2007)

I have a 2004 Toyota Tundra Double Cab 2X4. I could probably use a larger TV, but it handles it pretty well. If there are a lot of big hills, I do struggle a little. If DW would let me, I would trade it on for the '07 Tundra. I also put Firestone Air Bags on to help with the squat and that works GREAT!!


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## ilovemydog (Aug 18, 2006)

wtscl said:


> I have a 2004 Toyota Tundra Double Cab 2X4. I could probably use a larger TV, but it handles it pretty well. If there are a lot of big hills, I do struggle a little. If DW would let me, I would trade it on for the '07 Tundra. I also put Firestone Air Bags on to help with the squat and that works GREAT!!










Hey, we have a 28FRLS Outback Fifth wheel, and we have been considering a 2007 Tundra Double Cab 2X4 with the towing package. What do you think of this????? Since you pull with a Tundra......... Our weight is 7825 and carrying capacity 1975. We have looked into the 2500 Ford Diesel. I like the Toyota better, but not sure of the weight. Any input would help.


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## Nathan (Jan 2, 2007)

DebbieGA said:


> I have a 2004 Toyota Tundra Double Cab 2X4. I could probably use a larger TV, but it handles it pretty well. If there are a lot of big hills, I do struggle a little. If DW would let me, I would trade it on for the '07 Tundra. I also put Firestone Air Bags on to help with the squat and that works GREAT!!










Hey, we have a 28FRLS Outback Fifth wheel, and we have been considering a 2007 Tundra Double Cab 2X4 with the towing package. What do you think of this????? Since you pull with a Tundra......... Our weight is 7825 and carrying capacity 1975. We have looked into the 2500 Ford Diesel. I like the Toyota better, but not sure of the weight. Any input would help.
[/quote]

Debbie, check the pin weight on that trailer and the capacity of the tundra. I would be suprised if you weren't over weight when going out to camp.


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## Collinsfam_WY (Nov 9, 2006)

X2 to the pin weight on that Tundra. I strongly suspect that once you calculate your actual "loaded for camping" weights, your 5'er will annihilate (is that too strong of a word?) the max payload of that Toyota truck.

-CC


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## 7heaven (Jun 4, 2005)

Here's our rig, it pulls quite well. It's hard to tell the TT is back there sometimes!


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## MJRey (Jan 21, 2005)

DebbieGA said:


> I have a 2004 Toyota Tundra Double Cab 2X4. I could probably use a larger TV, but it handles it pretty well. If there are a lot of big hills, I do struggle a little. If DW would let me, I would trade it on for the '07 Tundra. I also put Firestone Air Bags on to help with the squat and that works GREAT!!










Hey, we have a 28FRLS Outback Fifth wheel, and we have been considering a 2007 Tundra Double Cab 2X4 with the towing package. What do you think of this????? Since you pull with a Tundra......... Our weight is 7825 and carrying capacity 1975. We have looked into the 2500 Ford Diesel. I like the Toyota better, but not sure of the weight. Any input would help.
[/quote]

Sadly the Tundra's payload rating just isn't enough for most fifth wheels and is only marginal for many trailers. At best the DC 4x2 has a payload capacity of about 1,700 lbs. I would say that just about any fifth wheel will have a pin weight of more than 1,000 lbs. Then add in the hitch and people and there's not much room left. I really wish the Tundra had a payload capacity that was a better match for it's otherwise excellent towing capacity. I would be driving a Tundra CrewMax right now if Toyota had done a better job of engineering the new truck. As it is I'm still looking at other options for a new tow vehicle and it's not likely Toyota will address the payload deficiency until at least the 09 model year. Nissan seems to have figured it out and greatly increased the payload ratings on the Titan in 08. They didn't change the tow ratings much but the payload capacity is now a better match to the tow rating.


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## Txcamper (Apr 3, 2006)

Mountains are no problem with my loaded 28RSDS being towed by my loaded F350 PSD.


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## Chris562 (Nov 29, 2007)

I have a 95 Chevy 1500 Z71 4x4 5.7 V8. I bought the 28RSDS because my dealership said it would pull it just fine. I am new to RVing so I didn't know anything. I got the WD Reese and controller and took off for my first trip back in October. I really thought I was going to blow my engine. I worry now that I will. I would like to take mine down to Gatlinburg but I don't think my truck will make it over Jellico Mountain. My truck is really good shape for being 12 years old. I put a new HD water pump on it and flushed the cooling system and replaced with new coolant. I was told the tranny would go out first because it's the same used in the S10 and Camaros that year. I love my Outback but it's apparent it's over the weight limit for my truck.


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