# Turn-off Fridge While Gasing Tv?



## FLYakman (Jan 26, 2006)

Recently,I had someone tell me that when I stop to gas up the TV I should go inside the OB and shut the refridgerator off. I was told the reason was some type of spark could occur while gasing the TV and there could be a major problem.

I've been camping a few years now and have never heard of this. I cannot remember ever reading about this on this site. Is this true?

I'd like to hear any comments on this as we are leaving for out West on Saturday.

Rayman


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## Ridgway-Rangers (Apr 18, 2008)

While I have heard of many fires at the pumps, I can honestly say I have never heard of the TT refrigerator causing a fire. In most cases, the TT is too far away from the TV while fueling. Any vaporized gas would have dissipated. If you pour gas in a metal tub and light it with an open flame, you will be surprised to see actually how close the flame needs to be to ignite it. 
I have never turned off the fridge while fueling and probably never will.








Keep cool,
Brian


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## Steve McNeil (Aug 30, 2004)

Rayman,

I too leave mine turned on while fueling. I have heard this before, but as Brian said, the refrigerator is usually far enough alway from the pump.

Have a good and safe trip.

Steve


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## PDX_Doug (Nov 16, 2004)

We always turn ours off. My DW will hop out as I pull into the station, and take care of it before I pull up to the pump. On the way out, she will do the same just before I pull out onto the street.

You might want to check local laws for a definitive answer. Here in Oregon it is the law.

Happy Trails,
Doug


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## ORvagabond (Apr 17, 2009)

I was told that you need to turn the propane off as you do not want a flame with gas fumes in the air..similar to turning your vehicle off while gasing up...seems like a good practice.


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## johnp (Mar 15, 2004)

Ok I know they say you should but:

1..the fridge flame is 4' off the ground

2..the fridge on mine is on the opposite side so 8' away

3..I always use the outside end pumps

Now this doesn't apply to everyone or makes it right

I have been known to shut it off but not all the time

Filling the mounted propane tank under the frame.. ALWAYS SHUT IT OFF..

Ok let the blasting begin

John


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## CamperAndy (Aug 26, 2004)

AKvagabond said:


> I was told that you need to turn the propane off as you do not want a flame with gas fumes in the air..similar to turning your vehicle off while gasing up...seems like a good practice.


Turning off the propane will not fix the issue in question. If you turn the propane off the DSI for the fridge will try to light propane that is not there. If you are going to turn it off you need to turn off the fridge controls on the fridge. You can actually leave the propane open.


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## akdream (Mar 21, 2006)

I have never even thought about it. It seems to me that it would take a lot of fumes to get to the TT in a heavy enough concentration to cause problems.


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## FLYakman (Jan 26, 2006)

This is very interesting. I'll tell you now that the recomendation came from Charlie at Holman who did our PDI on 5/13. I questioned him on this and he was firm that the FRIDGE should be shut off.I to him I'd shut the LP off at the tanks but he said no it would have to be the FRIDGE that was shut off.

I have never heard this before my recent PDI

Rayman


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## Compulynx (Oct 15, 2008)

You guys seem to forget that the fridge has an ELECTRIC igniter, that creates a spark, whether the gas is on or not. Therefore I would highly recommend turning off the fridge before refuelling an LP tank.

As for gassing up the TV. My unit is a rear kitchen unit, and the fridge vent is at the rear of the camper, almost 35 feet away from my fuel filler, and on the opposite side, so I do not even bother to turn it off. And I never run down the highway with the hot water heater on, so do not have to worry about it either.

C


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## HootBob (Apr 26, 2004)

I normally turn off our fridge when gassing up Just to play it safe.

Don


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## grock52 (Sep 6, 2008)

Your refigerator and hot water heaters both have electronic ignightors. If the gas concentration is just right ..boom. If you have bothered to read your trailer book and refer and hotwater heater books they will advise you to turn off switchs to deactivate in any area where explosive hazard exisits. Some states require deactivation to be leagal,you are responsible to know. Remember insurance companies will pay for damages up front, then turn around and sue you for class action and then drop your coverage . This is the age we live in, claiming to not know your equipment only get rolled eyes by the legal system. Oh, and have fun out on the road this summer!


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## Oregon_Camper (Sep 13, 2004)

I never turn mine off while filling up.


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## Oregon_Camper (Sep 13, 2004)

PDX_Doug said:


> Here in Oregon it is the law.


Doug...did you read this law or did someone tell you? I'd like to read more about it.


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## hyewalt34 (May 9, 2004)

I never tow with the valves open and have never had a problem keeping things cold or frozen, even on 3-4 hour trips in our 100* Central California summer weather. I just don't see a reason to take the chance of a fire.

Walter


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## Partsman Ed (Aug 26, 2008)

I am with Oregon Camper, I would be interested as to know if it the law in Oregon as that is where we reside. I know for a fact that my dad never shut off the fridge when pulling into a gas station, and this is before all the new vapor recovery nozzles were installed on the pumps.


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## Oregon_Camper (Sep 13, 2004)

AKvagabond said:


> I was told that you need to turn the propane off as you do not want a flame with gas fumes in the air..similar to turning your vehicle off while gasing up...seems like a good practice.


I might be way off here but I think the reason your asked to turn off your vehicle is to control the excessive exhaust, not the risk of the vehicle igniting fumes. All types of race cars fuel up with the cars running and their fuel is WAY more explosive than gas.


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## russk42 (Sep 10, 2007)

I never turn mine off. The only time I turn anything off (LP) is when i go through a tunnel. The risk associated with the fridge spark or flame (at the gas station) is infinitesimal. The gasoline/air mix ratio has to be in a very narrow range to ignite, and it would have to diffuse into the fridge combustion chamber at that same ratio. 
I worked at a gas station many years ago: we'd frequently see vehicles drive in with mufflers dragging and sparking---not to mention the backfiring (remember backfiring?) Never had a fire, and to the best of my knowledge, the state never passed a law prohibiting dragging mufflers at a gas station.
BTW, here in VA the most pertinent law is no smoking or OPEN flame within 20 feet of the pump.


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## Nathan (Jan 2, 2007)

Hmmm, must be spring since this topic came up again.









I don't shut it off. I always figured that the fridge was 25' behind and on the other side as my filler. Of course now I have Diesel, so it's even less of an issue due to reduced fumes. I can tell you that when I caught the gas station with the rear bumper, nothing exploded.








My closest call was the flat last year that crushed the propane lines







. When I went out to change the tire, I could smell the propane and I shut it off at that point.

Of course I also carry my cell phone in my pocket while fueling despite the signs saying I should leave it in the car.


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## MO7Bs (Apr 11, 2009)

If I remember my fire science course correctly...

The fuel to air ratio is critical to an explosion. Gas is heavier than air and the spark for the fridge is about 4 foot off of the ground. By my rough calculations...it would take a lot of spilled fuel, at the base of the fridge, in a geologic depression big enough to hold basically the entire gas station on a calm day with little other traffic to disturb the vapor interface, to even set up the right conditions.

Now a tunnel...I would turn off the propane and the fridge. Many, many, many gasses can accumulate in a highly confined space like a long tunnel that is essentially a low collection point for heavier than air gasses. Also, if you have an accident on an open interstate, the wind takes care of the leaking propane. In a tunnell, the traffic is actually part of the airflow equation. An accident big enough to rupture your propane system would more than likely be big enough to stop traffic and then things might get interesting.

Others will agree and yet others will disagree, but there are so many ignition sources in a standard fueling station that my little fridge isn't going to add significantly to the problem. Statistically anything is possible, but probabilities negate most alternatives.

Just my $0.02...it will stay on while fueling, off when traveling through anything but the shortest of confined spaces.

Paul


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## ROB & JUDY OUTBACKERS (Mar 9, 2007)

Quick science class: Remember the fridge spark only sparks when starting the fridge. When you turn off the fridge, you must re-start it when you finish fueling your TV. Guess what? That is when you get the spark that could cause a fire. There is no reason to turn off the fridge to fuel you TV.


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## Scoutr2 (Aug 21, 2006)

johnp2000 said:


> Ok I know they say you should but:
> 
> 1..the fridge flame is 4' off the ground
> 
> ...


My exact logic. If I can't get an end pump, I turn off the fridge, though.

Mike


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## Scoutr2 (Aug 21, 2006)

ROB & JUDY OUTBACKERS said:


> Quick science class: Remember the fridge spark only sparks when starting the fridge. When you turn off the fridge, you must re-start it when you finish fueling your TV. Guess what? That is when you get the spark that could cause a fire. There is no reason to turn off the fridge to fuel you TV.


Umm . . not to be argumentative, but the spark ignites a flame, which is always ON when the fridge is in operation on propane. The spark would be less of a threat than the flame, if you can't get the flame source safely away from the pumps.

Also - if I feel the need to turn off the fridge, I pull well away from the pumps before I go in and re-ignite the fridge burner.

Mike


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## tdvffjohn (Mar 10, 2005)

This gets asked all the time and actually still leaves the person without an answer definitively. Read, make your decision based on others actions.

I leave the fridge on always.

Anyone who has ever been a mechanic or even done there own tune ups have probably opened a hood in the dark and seen sparks from old and bad spark plug wires. It can be a neat little light show. I have never heard of a fire caused by those sparks so my fridge 30 feet from the pump seems ok to me. Yea, I know, you need to shut a vehicle off when fueling but you still need to drive on and off the island when others are fueling. I would be more worried aboit my DW getting hit by a car or the TT getting rear ended when I stop to shut the fridge off. Around here, there is barely enough room to get the rig off the road when fueling nevermind stopping before the pumps and after.

If someone can show me a copy of a law that states otherwise in any state, I would like to read it. Not saying they don t exist, I would just like to see one. But , there is nothing wrong with doing what you think is safer or better.

John


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## dmbcfd (Sep 8, 2004)

Everyone has their reasons for turning the fridge off or not and I'll bet they made their decision based on everything working as it should while at the pump. I make a living dealing with things after they go wrong. We're a fairly intelligent group here, and I'm sure we're all quite capable of using a self serve gas station without doing something stupid, but what about the other knuckleheads out there? Most of the fire prevention regulations were written for these missing link types, and probably after someone got hurt or killed, and property was damaged. Yes, gasoline fumes have to be within the explosive range, and they are heavier than air, and the flame which operates the refrigerator is up high and far from your fuel tank fill.

What about the guy filling his boat up on the trailer at the next island 3 feet from your refrigerator and 3 feet above it?

What about the guy spilling gas all over a gas can in the bed of his truck?

Yes, vapor recovery nozzles are great, why do I still smell gas?

What about someone intentionally spilling or spraying gas in your direction, even if you're not the target?

Your owner's manual tells you to shut it off, the sign next to the fuel pump tells you to shut it off, I'm suggesting you shut it off. I'm guessing your insurance company would ask "did you shut it off".

The fridge stays cold for a long time, shut it off a hundred miles down the road at a rest area if you think the next gas station will be too crowded or dangerous to get out. Remember, these are recreational vehicles. Recreation means fun, let's keep it fun and safe.

I'm getting off my soap box now.

Steve


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## MO7Bs (Apr 11, 2009)

dmbcfd said:


> Everyone has their reasons for turning the fridge off or not and I'll bet they made their decision based on everything working as it should while at the pump. I make a living dealing with things after they go wrong. We're a fairly intelligent group here, and I'm sure we're all quite capable of using a self serve gas station without doing something stupid, but what about the other knuckleheads out there? Most of the fire prevention regulations were written for these missing link types, and probably after someone got hurt or killed, and property was damaged. Yes, gasoline fumes have to be within the explosive range, and they are heavier than air, and the flame which operates the refrigerator is up high and far from your fuel tank fill.
> 
> What about the guy filling his boat up on the trailer at the next island 3 feet from your refrigerator and 3 feet above it?
> 
> ...


Steve,

I assume (and we all not what that get's us into) from the bc and fd in your handle that you are a Batt Cheif in a Fire Dept.

So I will defer to your comments as the ranking expert, but the fact remains that there are many, many, many more likey ignition sources in the average fuel stop than my fridge.

Also, does your department employ a Fire Science guy or have an academy? If so, do you think you could get them to design just such a training excercise? I think I will try to get something worked out with MU for their fire school. This would be an awesome test to play out in an academic setting for all fire fighters and the public. I mean we train on all other kinds of vehicles and fires, why not a gasoine fire complicated with an open propane source?

Paul


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## hyewalt34 (May 9, 2004)

I mentioned this thread to a friend at work and he told me a "you won't believe what happened to me" story.

He was towing his 35 foot Sunnybrooke 5'th wheel back from a week on the N. California coast last week and at a lunch stop thought he heard something coming from inside the rig. Opening the door, he could smell propane and the alarm was sounding. Here's what caused it: A couple of bottles of booze from the cupboard above the stove had fallen out and had hit one of the range knobs and opened it up! This could have turned out really bad...... He told me from now on he's traveling with the valves closed.

Walter


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## CamperAndy (Aug 26, 2004)

hyewalt34 said:


> I mentioned this thread to a friend at work and he told me a "you won't believe what happened to me" story.
> 
> He was towing his 35 foot Sunnybrooke 5'th wheel back from a week on the N. California coast last week and at a lunch stop thought he heard something coming from inside the rig. Opening the door, he could smell propane and the alarm was sounding. Here's what caused it: A couple of bottles of booze from the cupboard above the stove had fallen out and had hit one of the range knobs and opened it up! This could have turned out really bad...... He told me from now on he's traveling with the valves closed.
> 
> Walter


Just imagine how sad he would have been had the bottle broke. Needs to put a lock on that cupboard.


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## Oregon_Camper (Sep 13, 2004)

CamperAndy said:


> I mentioned this thread to a friend at work and he told me a "you won't believe what happened to me" story.
> 
> He was towing his 35 foot Sunnybrooke 5'th wheel back from a week on the N. California coast last week and at a lunch stop thought he heard something coming from inside the rig. Opening the door, he could smell propane and the alarm was sounding. Here's what caused it: A couple of bottles of booze from the cupboard above the stove had fallen out and had hit one of the range knobs and opened it up! This could have turned out really bad...... He told me from now on he's traveling with the valves closed.
> 
> Walter


Just imagine how sad he would have been had the bottle broke. Needs to put a lock on that cupboard.
[/quote]

Dang it Andy...you beat me to it!!!


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## Fanatical1 (Jan 9, 2006)

CamperAndy said:


> I mentioned this thread to a friend at work and he told me a "you won't believe what happened to me" story.
> 
> He was towing his 35 foot Sunnybrooke 5'th wheel back from a week on the N. California coast last week and at a lunch stop thought he heard something coming from inside the rig. Opening the door, he could smell propane and the alarm was sounding. Here's what caused it: A couple of bottles of booze from the cupboard above the stove had fallen out and had hit one of the range knobs and opened it up! This could have turned out really bad...... He told me from now on he's traveling with the valves closed.
> 
> Walter


Just imagine how sad he would have been had the bottle broke. Needs to put a lock on that cupboard.
[/quote]

Could have been a tragedy! Just goes to show you how important those door locks are....


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## dmbcfd (Sep 8, 2004)

Steve,

I assume (and we all not what that get's us into) from the bc and fd in your handle that you are a Batt Cheif in a Fire Dept.

So I will defer to your comments as the ranking expert, but the fact remains that there are many, many, many more likey ignition sources in the average fuel stop than my fridge.

Also, does your department employ a Fire Science guy or have an academy? If so, do you think you could get them to design just such a training excercise? I think I will try to get something worked out with MU for their fire school. This would be an awesome test to play out in an academic setting for all fire fighters and the public. I mean we train on all other kinds of vehicles and fires, why not a gasoine fire complicated with an open propane source?

Paul
[/quote]

Hi Paul,

Thanks for the promotion! I'm only a lieutenant. We have a state run academy, but they don't do any scientific stuff there. The academy is funded through all the insurance companies doing business in the state, so they concentrate on making safe effective firefighters to minimize loss (and claims I'm sure). Every cadet trains on flammable liquid, and gas fires before graduating, but it's mostly suppression exercises, not so much determining cause, etc.

Regarding John's request for laws, I've been on vacation this week, so when I'm back in the office next week, I'll look it up. The signs on the pumps just say "per order of state Fire Marshal". I thought they used to give the law and chapter as well? That could have been back when we had to squeeze fuel out of the dinosaurs.

I agree, there are many sources of ignition probably beyond our control, but we can control this one.

Steve


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## MO7Bs (Apr 11, 2009)

"Control"...you don't know any firefighters who have control issues, do you??

We are all so laid back!









I will get with the University and my old Academy instructor and see what they can do. Our fire science instructor was a true pyromaniac, everytime I think of him the only thing I can say is "I'm glad he's on our side." because he could do some real damage!

Paul


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## Lmbevard (Mar 18, 2006)

I'm afraid I have to admit that I usually run with my gas valve open and the fridge operating on propane. I have a Diesel, and the place I usually fuel up is seperated from the rest of the pumps so I am a little safer than most people having it on, BUT last year I had a flat tire on the 5er and did not know it (could not see it or feel anything). It eventually flew apart and whipped out the gas line going to the stove. I ended up lossing 1/2 tank of propane before some one stopped me to let me know I had a problem. Thank goodness nothing happened, but it has taught me a lesson, if something could go wrong, it will. Most of our trips are less than 2 hours and if I have the camper packed the night before and the fridge on, I am safe to turn it off and shut off the propane. And it is a lot safer towing with out having to think of what might have happened.


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