# Picking Up New 2008 Sydney 31rqs In The Morning



## Cheyenne (Oct 15, 2007)

And freaking out a little. Looking for a little hand holding and encouragement. (husband is laughing at me). I've been lurking here for a few days and you all seem so nice and friendly, so I thought I'd reach out. I have butterflies in my stomach tonight. We've been tent campers for a long time and we have 3 little boys. We live in an area of New York that gets a lot of rain and we have a new little dog (her name is Cheyenne and DH jokes that the dog just cost us $40,000). Anyway, I like to take her everywhere with me so a travel trailer seemed like a great idea. Of course we liked the biggest, most expensive one on the lot







and DH has never been one to shy away from something new. He's great at fixing things and he loves cars. We bought a new Durango with a HEMI to pull the trailer. I hope it's enough...I've been reading about it alot and he says not to worry...he did his homework first. I guess I just wanted to say hi and for you guys to tell me we're gonna love it and that we can handle it, even though the whole experience is brand new and we went straight from a tent to a very looong trailer. Are we nuts?


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## WillTy3 (Jul 20, 2004)

Welcome to Outbackers and enjoy the new rig and the new TT experience!!

Will


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## Sayonara (Jul 23, 2007)

Congratulations on the new TT purchase !! You will love that trailer. We looked at that one and the 32BHDS and opted for the 32BHDS but both were very nice. You should be excited thats a great trailer. This site will provide you with a tremendous amount of information and friendships. The people are great.

Please do not be offended by my next coments. I am not an expert and am sure others will chime in here but keep in mind, you mentioned that you have not trailered anything ever and the people here are experienced. THey will only be looking out for your safety by their comments and recommendations, as am I.

About your TV. (tow vehicle) I want to be sure that you and your DH have done your homework on the tow capacities of your TV. THe trailer we bought (32BHDS) is very similar in length and weight. We had a 2004 F150 with all the heavy duty tow equipment. As you can see from my signature, we now have upgraded. you may not need a 1-ton diesel but my thoughts are you will need something close. PLEASE do you homework before buying that trailer. I have a DW and 2 DD's and did not feel comfortable traveling with my family with the F150 TV we had. It just would not handle an emergency situation properly. surely it would pull it down the road but the capacity limits when compared to the ACTUAL weights of the TT and equipment were compromised.

as an example...
Add up the: TT dry weight + 250lb for propane +40 for batteries + 1000 for gear + 2 adults + 3 children + a safety factor and im SURE you will be over the GCVWR and Trailer rating and quite honestly all of the capacities of your vehicle.

You may not want to hear this but MY gut feeling is that your Durango will NOT be a safe TV for that trailer. Take your time and be safe. You have the opportunity now to make a change if you find you need to. But if you buy it without properly researching, you might find yourself in trouble.

Again, i dont mean any disrespect with my comments but we just went through the situation of thinking our F150 would tow our trailer and after 2 trips we bought the 1-ton diesel.

Please be safe and keep us posted.


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## johnp (Mar 15, 2004)

Hi and welcome. Great choice in trailers. But I hate to tell you the Durango may pull it but not legally. The 31 has a gross of 9600 lbs and the Durango is only good for just over 6000 lbs. Then there is the issue of the short wheelbase of the truck and the 35' worth of trailer behind it.If you must tow with it you might want to look into a Hensley Arrow hitch and upgrades to the truck like tranny coolers and air lift bags for the rear. Be carefull with that setup and drive slow.

John


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## Cheyenne (Oct 15, 2007)

Thank you so much for that thoughtful response, Sayonara. I do appreciate any and all advice and I have been paying particular attention to posts about towing capacity as I felt pretty fearful about this over everything else. (the length is a big issue to me too but DH is very confident he can handle it and I believe him). He read everything he could get his hands on about this and talked to the dealership where we bought the truck and also where we bought the trailer. I wish so much that we had found this website before we bought as I think it would have put my mind at ease about some things alot sooner.

I know he also spent some time at rvtowingtips.com and was careful to examine the Dodge towing capacity page with all specifications. The trailer is 7300 pounds and our vehicle says we can tow up to 9,000 pounds. Is it your opinion that this is still not enough? I think I better have him read your post.

Again, thank you. I am not at all offended by your comments. Safety is VERY important to us too. I hope they didn't steer us wrong at the dealership just to make a sale.


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## Cheyenne (Oct 15, 2007)

John,

Just read yours too....appreciate the comments. I'm not sure if we're missing something here but if we are, I so hope you will tell us. We recognize we are not experts here and we are definitely listening. I'm worried, guys. What are we missing?


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## kjdj (Sep 14, 2004)

Cheyenne said:


> John,
> 
> Just read yours too....appreciate the comments. I'm not sure if we're missing something here but if we are, I so hope you will tell us. We recognize we are not experts here and we are definitely listening. I'm worried, guys. What are we missing?


In a word Wheelbase.

Your Durango can tow the weight if the weight were a boat, another car, or tractor.

A box 8 feet wide, 11 ft tall, and 35 feet long is a whole lot different.

What area of this big country are you going to be towing this beast?

Welcome and best of luck.


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## Sayonara (Jul 23, 2007)

Cheyenne said:


> I hope they didn't steer us wrong at the dealership just to make a sale.


If they did, it would not be the first time. Especially the RV dealers, making the sale is top priority. Do not be fooled by looking at only the Tow Capacity of your truck. that is what i did. After towing it twice and talking to the people here i realized that that is only one of the MANY things to take in concideration and quite honestly it might be the least important.

Another thing to learn.... Your OB will be MUCH heavier than the advertised 7300 lbs. that is the DRY weight from the factory the weight does not include the Propane, batteries, gear, accessories, water, waste etc. REad the links below for a lot of good information.

Look HERE for some more info. Look in to all of the links and read it well.

Especially THIS.

and THIS.

and THIS.

I learned a lot from these above sites. Most of what you read there is NOT subjective, its fact and in some cases THE LAW!! If you were to have an accident with an overloaded TV you will be liable and your insurance might not cover you. I, myself, just a few months ago went throught this and learned that there is a lot more to towing than just hoping the trailer fits in to the the tow rating. Ill bet a dollar to a donut that if your in the freeway at all with that TT taking it home, you will look at each other with concern. IT WAS TOO MUCH FOR MY F150 !!!! the mothion that it put on the truck when trucks would pass us you could tell that the trailer was controilling the situation. I have towed things my whole life but never at my trucks limits. this was the first time. buying our OB and talking to the people here really taught me a lot. Im just trying to return the favor.


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## Cheyenne (Oct 15, 2007)

Hi Everyone,

DH here. This is an exciting and big purchase for us. Hopefully, the information I was able to obtain from the Dodge web site regarding our Durango was accurate. It came with the factory tow group (tranny cooler, PS cooler, HD suspension, class IV receiver, factory trailer harness, etc) & the 5.7L hemi. They rate it for GCWR 14000, Tow capacity 8950. I spent a lot of time at www.rvtowingtips.com where there are charts on wheel base vs trailer length, and a handy spreadsheet for towing capacity to insure we aren't exceeding the vehicle's capabilities based on the trailer specs & vehicle specs. The trailer is getting a Reese dual cam sway control hitch (the RV dealer is familiar with these - if there is a superior one made by someone else - let me know...) I also installed a Tekonsha P3 brake control - it's the newer model. I liked the wiring fault detection and adjustability.

We have a lot of our relatively local area to explore in upstate NY. I'm not planning any cross country treks with this setup. It certainly would be nice to have a heavier duty TV, and if we end up getting an appetite for long trips I'm betting it may have to happen.

What do you all think?


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## Sayonara (Jul 23, 2007)

Cheyenne said:


> I'm worried, guys. What are we missing?


Wheelbase, GVWR, GCVWR! 
Read those links. and remember That trailer will weigh much more than the 7300 lbs. you will be adding gear, clothes, tools, toys, bikes, chairs, blankets, propane, water, batteries, accessories, TV's on and on. Id bet you could easily add 2000lbs of extras. Plus id also challange that the trailer is actually more than the 7300lbs dry (ours was) from what i learned about the manufacturers innaccuracies in weighing.


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## Cheyenne (Oct 15, 2007)

We're reading! We're reading! We'll be safe, I promise. (not that the promise of a faceless internet woman probably means much..hee hee)


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## kjdj (Sep 14, 2004)

I urge you to take the rig for a test tow on the interstate before you sign.

I bet we're messing-up your DH's force you to let him trade the Durango buy the CTD he really wanted.


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## Cheyenne (Oct 15, 2007)

Very funny, Kevin.







Why do I have the feeling you are right and after reading all of this we're going to end up getting rid of my beloved minivan? (don't laugh - I swore I'd never be caught dead in one and then ended up loving it) Then he'll give me the Durango (won't that be nice of him) and he'll get once of those big ol' honkin trucks you guys are talking about.









I have a feeling Cheyenne is gonna cost us alot more than originally thought.


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## Sayonara (Jul 23, 2007)

John,
Congratualtions to you !!! That is one nice trailer !! Im offering my advice based on my experience from just 2 months ago. I started with an 04 F150 SuperCrew HD tow package, long wheelbase etc. I was convinced after reading online and running the nunbers and having towed my whole life that we were going to be just fine..... Then we hooked it up and went on a couple trips. You are pulling a Freeway Billboard behind you. every gust of wind pushes that thing around like you would not believe. before getting in to the numbers. ill tell you what i did to confirm my thoughts after towing a few times and talking to the people here. I hung out at our RV dealer waiting for some warranty work to be completed and asked RV'rs as they came and went how they liked their TV's. I wanted all the experience I could get to help me decide if I should take the plunge that i was feeling i was going to need to take. (buying a bigger TV) Hands down, that convinced me.

Now, first, do not use the 7300lb weight as a Trailer weight. That is a dry weight from the factory. You MUST use the 9650. i failed to use this too. your trailer will have 4 tanks, 2 grey and 1 black and 1 fresh water (170 gallons of fluid capacity x 8lbs per gallon = 1360 lbs), it will have 250lbs in propane. 50lb in batteries, gear, accessories, toys, bikes, equipment, TV's, clothes, blankets, food, pop, beer, junk, on and on.
To summarize....your trailer weight will most likely be too high.
Unfortunately i dont have the time to run all of the numbers now but i know my F150 was too short for the 32BHDS, IM sure the Durango will be too.
For your GCWR take the 9650 + the weight of your Durango + 2 adults, children, dog, gear, clothes, fuel, etc.
Remember tongue weight when adding up your GVWR. that trailer will have about a 1000lb tongue weight.

Only you can make the final decision. Also, remember your legal obligation. I did not know a lot about this. If your found to be towing over your capacities and be in an accident, you insurance may not cover you. Look in to it.

Be safe, and take care. THere are many others here that can help you a lot more than i can. It just hit home with me since i just went throught it all and our trailers are almost the same. YOu will love that TT and you will really enjoy the site here. Tons of info and really great people.


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## Sayonara (Jul 23, 2007)

Cheyenne said:


> I have a feeling Cheyenne is gonna cost us alot more than originally thought.


THATS EXACTLY WHAT WE THOUGHT AFTER WE BOUGHT OUR 1-TON DIESEL!!! THe TT and Truck ended up costing the same as a new Motorhome would have!!! And i could have then drove a really good gas mileage car to work everyday!! Haa!!


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## johnp (Mar 15, 2004)

One day on rt 90 in the wind or a semi passing you doing 85mph and that 3/4 ton truck will look real nice. That trailer will control your truck. It out weighs your truck and is twice as long. Good luck and be sure to check the trailer out make sure EVERYTHING works to your liking BEFORE you sign the paperwork. Have a safe trip home with it.

John


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## California Jim (Dec 11, 2003)

Remeber the scene from the old "Jaws" movie when the shark comes up on the stern of the boat and shortly after one of the guys says "we're going to need a bigger boat" ? Well in your case the shark is the 31RQS and the Durango is your boat.

It's late and I'm too tired to present my fine sounding argument. But I'm almost positive a new tow vehicle will be in your near future if you complete the purchase. We have seen your scenario too many times in the years I've been here at the site to think otherwise.

Sorry to be Chief Darkcloud, but I believe time will show this to be true.

Be carfull out there.

Jim


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## Sayonara (Jul 23, 2007)

California Jim said:


> But I'm almost positive a new tow vehicle will be in your near future if you complete the purchase. We have seen your scenario too many times in the years I've been here at the site to think otherwise.
> Jim


Im one of those scenarios !!


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## Cheyenne (Oct 15, 2007)

Thank you all so much for your input. I'm afraid at this point, it is a done deal. We signed the paperwork Friday and are picking it up in the morning. I don't think there is any turning back now. The dealership is 15 minutes away, all quiet backroads. We planned to take it out this weekend to a local campground 40 minutes away (also backroads) to try it out and then we are storing it until spring. It looks like we still have alot to learn. I'll let you know how it goes tomorrow - we're going to camp in our driveway.







The boys are so excited.

I wish we had found you all before we actually signed the paperwork but I am glad we've found you now. At least we have the long winter to think about it all, read even more, and figure out what to do come spring.

We look very forward to being a part of this community. Thanks for laying it all on us gently.

'night all....


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## ALASKA PFLOCK (Jun 24, 2007)

Cheyenne said:


> Thank you all so much for your input. I'm afraid at this point, it is a done deal. We signed the paperwork Friday and are picking it up in the morning. I don't think there is any turning back now. The dealership is 15 minutes away, all quiet backroads. We planned to take it out this weekend to a local campground 40 minutes away (also backroads) to try it out and then we are storing it until spring. It looks like we still have alot to learn. I'll let you know how it goes tomorrow - we're going to camp in our driveway.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Cheyenne- I pray that you and your family are safe on your first trip out. Please understand this prayer is genuine.


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## Cheyenne (Oct 15, 2007)

Picking up in 45 minutes.....we'll take it slow and easy this morning. I'm not sure either one of us got much sleep last night. Think we just unwittingly enrolled ourselves in the "School of Hard Knocks."









I'll come back and post to let you all know how it went. Thank you again for all the wonderful advice. (and prayers







)


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## egregg57 (Feb 13, 2006)

I saw this thread while camping this weekend. I hope everything went okay for you. As a 31RQS owner for some time now and having the opportunity to tow it with three different vehicles, I can say from experience that the weight of your 31RQS is going to be very close to 9K with everything you need in it, no water in the tanks.

I understand you have already purchased and would strongly caution you from traveling on any major roads where cross winds, passing trucks or other large vehicles are near.

I love the 31RQS and most others will tell you the same. But the "Nimits Class" TT is going to move your Durango around in a most uncomfortable fashion. Please look into a tow vehicle with a 10K+ tow capacity!!

Please be safe and take it slow till then.

Eric


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## Sayonara (Jul 23, 2007)

Cheyenne said:


> Picking up in 45 minutes.....we'll take it slow and easy this morning. I'm not sure either one of us got much sleep last night. Think we just unwittingly enrolled ourselves in the "School of Hard Knocks."
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Whoo Hooo !!! Your going to love it!!


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## mountainlady56 (Feb 13, 2006)

OMG!! You better believe prayers will be sent up for you, your husband and your sons' safety. No, I'm not meaning to scare the begeezes out of you, but what you are doing is not safe, in my opinion, as a 31RQS owner, and the other members who have tried to convince you of such. I hope, for your sakes, that there is absolutely NO wind blowing, there are NO trucks on the road and God is keeping a special eye on you at this time.
Like you, my vehicle dealership said my then-truck would do the job on a 27RSDS I had prior to the 31RQS. The trailer dealership SURELY wasn't going to tell me any different, as they wanted to make a sale!! I had a 5.3L GMC Sierra, and it strained like crazy pulling the 27RSDS, and there's no way I would consider hooking it to a 31RQS. Yep, I went to a diesel, and I have a Reese dual-cam high performance sway control, heavy duty hitch and weight-distribution bars.
If it's not set up correctly, even on a heavy-duty truck, you can get into trouble. Yep, I'm a lady, but I LISTENED to advise on here from more experienced people, plus, I had several years experience towing under my belt.
Also, for those who don't know, the "dry weight" doesn't even include the awning, or any options, according to keystone's website, and the Sydney is the KING/QUEEN of options!!
Best of luck and God bless!
Darlene


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## Rip (Jul 13, 2006)

I would never pull this trailer with anything less than a 3/4 ton!!!!!!!!!!!!! and a Hensley!!!! IT"S JUST BIG AND LONG!!! And with out the right set-up it will push and pull you all over the road and you will never want to take it out again!!! Listen to the people that been there!!!!!!!!! And take their advice!!!! Or just pull it at 10 MPH!!!!!!!!!!!


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## Lady Di (Oct 28, 2005)

Welcome to the forum!









By now you are likely well into the PDI, but will definitely be praying for a safe return home for you.

You might want to reconsider that 40 minute away camping trip. That could be a VERY LONG and scary 40 minutes.

Be safe!


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## campmg (Dec 24, 2005)

Sayonara said:


> [quote name='Cheyenne' post='254354' date='Oct And i could have then drove a really good gas mileage car to work everyday!! Haa!!


Yeah but it wouldn't look as cool in your signature pictures below all your posts.

Sayonara has offered some well thought out and researched advice. Without running the numbers, I would think that size Outback is too much for a Durango. I have a 25rss that I wasn't too comfy towing with a 1/2 ton Yukon. Not sure your wheelbase or supsension is a great combo for such a large camper.


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## Nathan (Jan 2, 2007)

Welcome to the group, and Congrats on the new TT! I'm sure you will love it. There have been many replies to one theme (some more strongly worded than others







). It sounds like you did your best to do the homework on this. I think what you are hearing now are the real life experiences of the physics in action. I don't have anything as long as you do, and have more wheelbase, but have had some ah-ha moments. I suspect on a calm day it will do fine. A strong wind, or a panic situation is where you will hit the wall. Just 1 panic avoidance manuever with mine got me to start looking at larger trucks (the second one got me pricing them...







)! Now, both situations were someone doing something stupid in front of me, and in both situations, they turned out happy only because that person got out of my way







.

You have a good hitch (if setup correctly







), a good brake controller, and a 1/2 ton chassis. A 3/4 ton or 1 ton chassis doesn't make you invincible, but it will give you an extra margin of safety! Don't worry, we'll all be here to help you with that Powerstroke/Cummins/Duramax discussion!!!


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## tdvffjohn (Mar 10, 2005)

http://www.outbackers.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=5875

http://www.outbackers.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=19049

Here s 2 threads you could read.

The only thing I will add is that it does not matter how short the trip is or how close the location is, the TT, TV combination is still what it is. It does not matter whether you go one exit on the highway or 50, you re still on the highway.

Congrats on the new trailer and hope you can join everyone at a rally next season.

John


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## Cheyenne (Oct 15, 2007)

You guys are all so awesome. I'm thrilled to be part of a community already that is so responsive and full of wonderful and caring advice. It's neat..what the internet does.

Well..I am currently typing from inside our brand new trailer sitting in our driveway.







We took it slow and made it safely. We had a very calm day, and traffic was light. Your prayers must have been heard this morning. My husband is about as happy as I have ever seen him. We have a tea kettle on the stove. Lunch on the table. He just went inside to drag one of the tvs in here and the kids are due home in a couple of hours. It's so exciting.

I hear what you are all saying. I know a new tow vehicle is probably in our very near future. That's okay with me. Sooner or later, the minivan will be a past chapter in our lives but what a way for it to go out...hmmm?

Thank you again for making us feel so welcome. We will be hanging around here alot if you let us....

Big hugs to you all.


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## Cheyenne (Oct 15, 2007)

PS....I'll have Jim post some pictures later. I'm not very good at that.


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## tdvffjohn (Mar 10, 2005)

[quote name=
Thank you again for making us feel so welcome. We will be hanging around here alot if you let us....

Big hugs to you all.








[/quote]

Let you?, its mandatory. Enjoy the new TT









John


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## Lady Di (Oct 28, 2005)

Welcome home to you and the Outback. So glad you made it home safely.

Enjoy your new home away from home, and don't stop smiling. You have the right to do so.

By the way, your dog is definitely a fortunate pup. Give her/him a hug for us.


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## 'Ohana (May 20, 2007)

Welcome to the Outbackers and Congrats on the New TT








Have fun and enjoy your new home away from home









obnj crew


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## Sayonara (Jul 23, 2007)

Enjoy it !! Have fun!!


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## Fanatical1 (Jan 9, 2006)

Wait until the kids see it at home for the first time!!







They will be sooooo exicited....

Congrats on the new trailer your going to love it!!

Mark


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## Calvin&Hobbes (May 24, 2006)

Whoo hoo! Another Nimitz Class Outback! Welcome aboard! I'm with everyone else in regards to being safe and carefull with your TV- If the TV is going to remain, I'd look at the Hensley to even up the playing field somewhat. (You can find a good used Excursion with a big ole honkin V-10 or better, a Diesel...then you wont even know the RQS is back there!)
Again, welcome aboard!!


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## ntputter17 (Aug 17, 2007)

That really is a nice trailer, congrats.......

Kirk


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## hpapa4 (Apr 11, 2007)

Welcome to Outbackers and congratulations on the new Outback


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## kyoutback (Jul 12, 2004)

Well, how did the first night camping in the driveway go?


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## Cheyenne (Oct 15, 2007)

It was awesome guys!







We're doing it again tonight. Figure we'll probably just live out there all week until we have to put her away for the winter on Monday.

I turned my head for 5 minutes and I couldn't find the kids. Next thing I know there was a parade of children underneath bedspreads, sheets, blankies, favorite books, backpacks, and snacks. The little one looked up at me and said, "We're goin' campin mom!" I smiled and thought...things sure are different from when I was a little girl...but the feeling is still the same, isn't it? Adventure in a deluxe fort is just as cool as adventure in a good old fashioned one.

We took some pictures and as soon as I can tear DH away from the TT, I'll have him post them for me. We had some friends over tonight and we had a blast sitting out there talking about all the fun we are going to have next summer. We've had lots of TV discussions too and will be contemplating that all winter long.

Wish you could all come over for a campfire tonight...just one more before the cold weather forces us back inside....


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## Cheyenne (Oct 15, 2007)

Hi Again!

Cheyenne's DH here







As she promised I'm posting some pictures of the rig (an '04 Hemi Durango + Outback 31RQS Sydney), and our maiden voyage.

First a big thanks to everyone for the advice surrounding our TV. Upstate NY in the Fall can be amazingly beautiful, and very windy. Before our maiden voyage of about 80 miles round trip, I took the rig out as much as I could on backroads and highways to see how it felt - good or bad. When conditions were good (little or no wind) the rig was well behaved - even with passing semis or busses. When the trailer got slapped by our gusty Fall winds it wagged the TV. Wasn't horrible but we'll be looking for a 3/4 or 1T TV over the long winter here. The longer wheeelbase, firmer suspension, and heavier chassis should help a lot - and folks here with the 31RQS that have that sort of TV are pretty satisfied with it. For our maiden voayage, the hitch was set up right, and the tires were at full pressure (though they are not the preferred LT tires). The route to our first outing in the Outback







was mostly on sheltered backroads and the weather forecast (wind wise) was OK. I kept it under 50 and the rig was well behaved.

We had a great time. The driveway camping let us run through all the systems on the trailer, so when we got to our campsite thing went smoothly. No problems backing into the site, though I should have done a little better on the side to side leveling







. The tank gauges don't seem very accurate, and it didn't help having the level off an inch or so side to side. We took in the Fall colors, sat on the beach and watched the clouds, ate way too much







, and the whole world slowed down for a couple of days. Ahhhh.

Oh, pictures? Sure!
*The Rig*









*Starting to set up the campsite*









*Our View up*









The TT's all winterized and stored now till Spring. But that won't keep me from working on upgrades all Winter!!


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## Sayonara (Jul 23, 2007)

Cheyenne said:


> and folks here with the 31RQS that have that sort of TV are pretty satisfied with it.


Ill second that! You will really notice a difference! 
Congrats on your first trip!! You have a very nice TT! The pictures are great! Have fun with the mods and keep us posted!


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