# Exceeding Gcwr



## Morgueman (Dec 3, 2006)

I will be exceeding the GCWR of 12,000 lbs by approx. 500 - 1000 lbs when using my 2002 Toyota Sequoia SR5 2WD to tow my Outback 25RSS. This includes traveling fully-loaded with fresh water, full gas tank, full propane plus cargo) up to Lake Tahoe and maybe Yosemite (albeit very slowly) with my wife, two kids, and two dogs. I'll be using a Hensley Arrow hitch with Prodigy Brake Controller. I believe the weights of the TV and TT will be about equal.

How do you expect this setup to perform?
Any TV modifications, setup alterations, or driving tips to maximize towing performance and safety?

Thank you,
Eric


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## CamperAndy (Aug 26, 2004)

You will get a TON of responses on this but you will not get a consensus.

I had a Ram 1500 that I exceeded the GCWR by about what you indicated, when I was fully loaded including carrying firewood and my generator in the bed of the truck and I could do it but I was not happy about it. I now have much more TV and it is noticeable.

There will be a lot of people that will tell you that you will be fine for any number of reasons from, you have a Hensley to the manufactures always under rate the specs. I prefer to not test that theory and I suggest that you unload some weight by packing less and do not carry water and even taking two vehicles (wife, kids, dog and coolers are not in the calculation) to drop the weight in the TV.


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## bentpixel (Sep 2, 2006)

I'll second what CamperAndy said. The chase vehicle could come in handy: my DBIL had to buy and install two sets of chains 3 weeks ago to get through Donner Pass when returning to Truckee from the bay area. The HA cannot compensate for icing conditions. Towing over any of the ratings is a liablity risk I personally would avoid.

my $.02's.
Scott


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## NJMikeC (Mar 29, 2006)

I'm no fan of the Tundra or Sequoia towing a 25RSS having owned them. Adding water and going up the Sierra's is icing on the cake. I wouldn't worry about going up, as you will eventually make it but how about going down on those stellar fading brakes . Mine spooked me twice!

Your certainly stretching the bounds of ---- well--- everything!


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## PDX_Doug (Nov 16, 2004)

Eric,

I have to agree with the others on this one. While you may get away with this setup sometimes, you are taking a real risk here. And there is always the liability question if something were to happen. Also - and maybe more importantly - how much are you exceeding your axle ratings by? And if you are exceeding GCWR you probably are exceeding the axle ratings.

My first step would be to empty the tanks. If you need to carry water in, fill up right before you get to your destination. My second step would be to look at a more capable tow vehicle. Not what you want to hear, I know, but for the sake of your families safety (Not to mention mine if I happen to be on the same road!!), it's what you need to do.









Hmm... Looks like so far, maybe we do have a consensus!









Happy Trails,
Doug


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## Ghosty (Jan 17, 2005)

Actually, IMHO, you are well over your limit.

First - manufacturers exaggerate their towing capabilities for marketing reasons.

Second - most people consider anything over 80% of their rated tow capabilities as invading the safety envelope. .. you are using 100% as a baseline which, IMO, puts you well over to begin with ..

third - have a wreck or cause a wreck and the insurance company determines you were over safe towing limits, you can say goodbye to reimbursement plus probably be facing civil suit from those you caused damage to in the accident...


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## campmg (Dec 24, 2005)

I have to agree with my esteemed colleagues here. You can exceed weight limits and may arrive safely at your campground but I wouldn't recommend chancing the safety of your family and others on the road around you. I'm glad you're asking the question now and using the Hensley Arrow can help but it still doesn't compensate for basic TV capabilities.


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## Lazybonz(aka Bill) (Sep 23, 2006)

Hi
I thought I could get away with towing my 26 RKS with my 2000 1/2 ton Dodge.
It was within the "rated" capacity of the TV.
Sure, it would pull it. But I never felt entirely safe and in control. Additionally it was obvious what I was doing to the truck...I would have blown something up sooner or later. Hence the switch to the bigger TV.
You will be able to pull it, but I doubt you will enjoy it much.
Just my 2 cents
Bill

PS don't believe what the dealers tell you either! They would let you tow with a bicycle if it would sell a bigger trailer.


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## Carey (Mar 6, 2012)

Hi, I agree with the rest. Over gross is something not to be messed with. Why not just leave the water empty and fill it when you get close to your camping spot. Without the water you'll be closer to limits.

Carey


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## Rich in CO (May 30, 2005)

Ok count me in with the others. You are over the limit for your TV. I lived in Reno for 8 years and have spent a ton of time Tahoe & Yosemtie area, and those are some winding steep moutain roads. I would not load my family up & go any where with that set up. On the side of the coin if you do you will trash your TV in short order, and then you can get a bigger TV.


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## MattS (Oct 15, 2006)

I'll add another 'don't do it' post. Those roads are pretty rough on a TV. I would really be concerned with the stability in adverse weather. I'd make sure all the tanks are empty in the trailer. There's always some place to get water right near a camp site even if it isn't right at the site. Have you weighted everything loaded up on a certified scale to make sure that is really how much you are going to weigh?


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## Morgueman (Dec 3, 2006)

Okay, thanks to the feedback from all of you, now my DH is looking at replacing our 2002 Sequoia... we want to keep our precious cargo (and everyone else on the road) safe!

Do any of you have the 2007 Suburban or Yukon XL? The 3/4 ton is quite rare out here in SoCal, but our local dealers do have the 4x4 1/2 ton with 8,000 lb. towing capacity and 4.10 axle ratio... 5.3L or 6.0 L? Working out the math, this seems like it will be much safer than the Sequoia with our 25RS-S, and will actually get better gas mileage. 
Laurie


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## Husker92 (Feb 11, 2006)

I glad you're looking at upgrading your TV. Good choice! Saftey first!

Here's a link to a 3/4 ton in Northern Cal - Micheal Stead - Walnut Creek click here

Or try Cars direct.comclick here They will bring it to your house.


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## NJMikeC (Mar 29, 2006)

Laurie,

None of us likes to tell you to spend more money but trust me maybe 50% of us were in the same situation you were.

But while you are upgrading go right past the 1/2 ton and to the 3/4 ton. By going to the 1/2 ton you really don't improve that much over the Sequoia in the GVWR catagory, having said that the 6.0 will help and so will 4.10 gears.

I was told by a dealer friend of mine that the GMC 3/4 Tons are out but not the Chevy's. They will come out after the new year and he hasn't seen any yet.


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## PDX_Doug (Nov 16, 2004)

Laurie,

I agree with Mike. It's great that you are willing to upgrade, and the 'Burb would be a good step forward, but if you are going to do it, you may as well go all the way. The premium for a 3/4 ton over a half ton is not that much, and then you know you are good to go.

That's not to say that the 1/2 ton can't do it. I pull a bigger and heavier Outback with a 1/2 ton, and it does great. But all other things being equal, I would have gone 3/4 ton. In my case all the other things were not equal, so I made the choice I did, but if I were looking at a 'Burb, it would be 3/4 ton.









Happy Trails,
Doug


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## Camper Man (Jan 12, 2006)

Eric & Laurie: If you can trim your weight to under 12,000 lb GCWR, you can do it, but it will be slow and you might break your Sequoia in the process (like I did). We pull an equal-weight, Hensley-equipped 26RS with a Sequoia 4x4. (The 4x4 has a GCWR of 11,800 compared to your 4x2). Our last time at the scales, our GCW was 11,480 lbs packed for a 3-day weekend with 3 kids on board (but no water). Based on how close we were on that trip, we have taken a second car on every other trip and I am glad we did. Nine and ten percent grades which you will experience enroute to Nevada and Yosemite are murder; you will be in second gear all the way. While we've always been under GCWR, I am convinced that the funny sounds that developed in our transmission recently were related to pulling max weight with the Sequoia. (The good news is that Toyota willingly paid for our new transmission even though it was one year out of warranty. You may not be so lucky.) In the Spring, we are buying something more hefty and, like you, have considered the Suburban. The issue for us is finding something as supremely comfortable for everyday use as the Sequoia - but a 3/4 ton Suburban or 3/4 ton anything is not that vehicle. So we are looking at stout 1/2 tons - probably a Suburban, Tahoe or Avalanche to pull our 26RS (equipped with a 4.10 rear, they are all around 14,000 GCWR and rated to pull up to 8,200). Bob


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## Rubrhammer (Nov 27, 2006)

I'm a Delphi retiree and can get you the GM supplier pricing if you are interested. Gm (Delphi parent) is allowing us to refer 1 person a month for that pricing.
Bob


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## Morgueman (Dec 3, 2006)

Everybody,

Thank you to everyone for your honest opinions about exceeding GCWR. I've bitten the bullet and bought a 2007 Yukon XL with the 5.3L engine 1/2 ton, 4.10 axle ratio (ie. towing capacity of 8000 lbs). Real pricey







, but now I'm not worried about towing 6500 lbs, and I'll get good gas mileage (average 19.5 mpg) when not towing. Anyone interested in an '02 Sequoia?

Eric (and Laurie)


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## NJMikeC (Mar 29, 2006)

Eric,

Congrats! Likely money well spent and that is a very nice truck.

Don't dispair I believe that the Sequoia's have a very good re-sale value. I suspect that the gas mileage with the GMC will be better then the Toyota, although that 4.10 will chew up some of it.

Mike C


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