# Tier Down Rings , Wood Screws Only



## Keith (Oct 17, 2009)

Just bought a new 2010, 280 outback with the cargo area in the front. When looking at the hold down rings I found that they are only surface mounts, with 2 wood screws into the floor. This is never going to hold my Harley, had I used them and it tipped over I would have been really mad. A buddy of mine has a 2008 or 2009 year and they are recessed and have 3 screws, not sure if they only go into the floor or have support plates under them. Any one experienced this and how did you solve the problem?


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## Carey (Mar 6, 2012)

Maybe buy some recessed mounts. The older models just went into the wood also. They had a 3/4 wood backer plate under the screws.

I made my own mounts and used no.14 screws and metal lags. I think they were about 3/8 or so around. Id want 3 or 4 screws holding a harley. What they put in there is prolly good for a dirt bike and thats about it.

Carey


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## FlashG (Jun 23, 2007)

I have a new cargo trailer with the motorcycle D rings installed with 4 bolts through the frame.

I added two extra D rings. and went through the 3/4 inch plywood and bolted them.

My brother has a Raptor toyhauler and Harleys - the dealer had to drop the belly cover to install the tie-downs.


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## Keith (Oct 17, 2009)

There seems to be 2 layers of flooring seperated with space or foam. It is about 2 inches thick, has anyone ever drilled thru both layers to bolt the tie downd to the floor?


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## ELSEWHERE (Sep 16, 2007)

Keith - Have you loaded your bike into the Outback? What model Harley is it? I'm curious how it fits. Before I bought our trailer I looked at several toy haulers that might take my Road King Classic. Because my bike is a couple inches short of 8' long tip to tip if I loaded it crosswise in a trailer it would have to be at an angle, which I wasn't sure would work very well depending on the room available. Because of that concern and my wife's requirements in the floorplan I ended up buying a longbed truck to load the bike in utilizing ramps, wheel chock and straps.

I'm not real familiar with tie down equipment in trailers but I've seen both flush mount d-rings and tracks mounted in toy haulers. I would think d-rings would be thru-bolted with backing plates, not just screwed to the plywood floor. My bike weighs close to 800# and I sure wouldn't trust my $20,000+ investment to d-rings mounted with wood screws! A track mounted with several screws might be a different story. You might get some info on mounting techniques by looking at web sites like www.discountramps.com.


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## Keith (Oct 17, 2009)

I have a full dress Harley and it fits cross wise, a friend of mine has a Road Kind and it also fits on an angle. I called the factory and they informed me that the floor is 3/8 plywood than foam than another 3/8 plywood. They also said there was NO crossbeams within the two layers. They also said that they would not trust the D-rings to hold a heavy load like this.
The problem is when the bike is in, the tie down rings are in the wrong location and must be moved. I do not feel confident using just 2 - 1 1/2-inch wood screws. My thought is to use E-track and drill through both layers of flooring and using a backing plate on the bottom and bolt it together. For the front tire chock, I found one that looks like it will fit into the corner, after the bed is removed. To get a full dresser into it the front tire needs to be into the corner. I also had to build a ramp extension to reduce the entry angle so as not to bottom out at the hinge point.


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## ELSEWHERE (Sep 16, 2007)

Keith said:


> I have a full dress Harley and it fits cross wise, a friend of mine has a Road Kind and it also fits on an angle. I called the factory and they informed me that the floor is 3/8 plywood than foam than another 3/8 plywood. They also said there was NO crossbeams within the two layers. They also said that they would not trust the D-rings to hold a heavy load like this.
> The problem is when the bike is in, the tie down rings are in the wrong location and must be moved. I do not feel confident using just 2 - 1 1/2-inch wood screws. My thought is to use E-track and drill through both layers of flooring and using a backing plate on the bottom and bolt it together. For the front tire chock, I found one that looks like it will fit into the corner, after the bed is removed. To get a full dresser into it the front tire needs to be into the corner. I also had to build a ramp extension to reduce the entry angle so as not to bottom out at the hinge point.


Sounds like your plan should work. The E-track's capacity ratings seem to be high enough so the only issue would be mounting. I would think you would want to load the E-track up with wood screws or, better yet, a backing plate (large washers?) like you're talking. If you're taking the bed out then it sounds like you're only going to use the room for a garage and storage so what you mount on the floor wouldn't be an issue, until the first time your wife trips over it. But if that room is for the Harley what's she doing up there anyway?! There's lots of different styles of wheel chocks on the market. I debated between the Condor and the WheelDock. I went with the WheelDock because it kept the bike closer to the front of the truck bed and the wheel-capture setup worked better for me. With the Condor you have to roll the front tire over a plate held in place by a horizontal pin which cams over and holds the tire in place. With only a few inches before the back tire started down the ramp I didn't want to be trying to jerk the bike back, out of a hole. That's not a problem with the WheelDock. I've hauled the bike about 7,000 miles and it hasn't budged. I'd highly recommend the WheelDock unless the crossbar wouldn't work for you. I don't know if you've heard this but I was told once not to compress the bike's suspension when tying it down. Not to sure of the reasoning but I ratchet mine down until I just start to see bike movement. With the front tire captured in the secured wheel chock and a strap off each corner of the bike, it doesn't move.

When you mentioned extending the ramp that reminded me of a video, I think it was Keystone's. A guy on a Harley softail was unloading out of the trailer and as he went down the ramp it looked like he momentarily high centered on the ramp's hinge point. With 10' loading ramps I avoid that problem but it's still damn steep riding UP the ramps! Really have to stay focused. What's interesting is I can walk it most of the way up other than when the back tire is still on the ground and the front tire is about 3' up the ramp. The first time I loaded it I found out my 32" inseam wasn't long enough to reach the ground! Those few feet I'm actually riding, not walking, up the ramps are real fun!

Let us know what you end up with and how it works for you. I'd be interested to hear.


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## marker (Aug 14, 2009)

I have been following this thread with interest as I am now getting concerned about tie downs based upin this info.

For what its worth, I do not use a wheel chock. I simply tie down in four places and the wheel comes off the wall and everything has stayed put on one short trip and one from Ontario to Florida (where I am now).

My bike is a fair amount lighter than a full dresser, so perhpas I am OK. I am thinking that with the recessed tie downs, this also helps to hold them in place. Certainly there has been no sign of things coming apart so far, but I am going to look at doing some kind of reinforcing or a back-up tie down in case one fails.

There is some pics in my flicker account.

Pics


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## ELSEWHERE (Sep 16, 2007)

marker said:


> I have been following this thread with interest as I am now getting concerned about tie downs based upin this info.
> 
> For what its worth, I do not use a wheel chock. I simply tie down in four places and the wheel comes off the wall and everything has stayed put on one short trip and one from Ontario to Florida (where I am now).
> 
> ...


At first I thought you were tying the bike down while on the kickstand. That would make me real nervous! With my luck I would have the one kickstand in 10,000 with a flaw in the casting and it would snap, pulling a D-ring out of the floor and dumping the bike. I'm kind of surprised the bike isn't moving a little. The reason I say that is you've got the bike balanced upright, at an angle in the trailer, with the front tire turned to one side and at least two of your tie downs attached to low points on the bike. I would expect it to be wobbly. I don't know where your fourth tie down is but I see one that runs to the triple tree. That's high enough, I would think, to help keep the bike from getting floppy. It looks like the strap barely clears the front of the tank. Be careful, if it comes in contact with the tank you'll mess up your paint. Is the fourth tie down running to the triple tree from the other side of the bike? The two straps to the foot boards are so low that I doubt they are contributing much to keep the bike upright, just keeping the lower portion of the bike from moving around. I'm certainly no expert but I don't think I'd feel real comfortable tying my bike down like that. Is there any way you can come off the back corners of the bike up high? Like off the passenger backrest, if it's strong enough? That would get you higher to help avoid lateral movement of the upper portion of the bike. Unless the floor is slippery I think your main concern would be keeping the upper portion of the bike from moving around. Based on what Keystone told Keith I would suggest mounting four D-rings, thru-bolted with backing plates, off of, and as far away as possible, from the four corners of the bike. Then I would make every attempt to keep the bike end of the straps attached as high as possible on the bike.

I feel comfortable with my bike securement for several reasons. Number one, according to the manufacturer the WheelDock will hold the bike on it's own, with no tie downs (although I wouldn't try it). So with the bike loaded there shouldn't be any fore and aft movement. I run straps to each side of the truck bed from the top of my front crash bars, just under the front of the tank. I run two more to the rear corners of the bed, which gives a little rear tension in addition to the side stability, from a tube that runs around the top of the rear fender behind the base of the passenger backrest. With this setup the front tire isn't going anywhere and I have four straps coming from high points on the bike going to the four corners of the truck bed.

Hope this helps some and gives you some ideas to consider. We're leaving Friday to spend time in the S.W. and Mexico this winter but next winter I really want to ride the Florida Keys on the bike. Enjoy your trip.


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## marker (Aug 14, 2009)

After many years of hauling my bike south in the back of the pickup I have learned that the straping to keep the bike upright is only needed at the front, and also to ensure that the front wheel cannot slip out. YO\ou do not need anything fancy. Straping at the rear of the bike is only to ensure that the back does not swing around and therefor can be very low.

I was a bit sceptical without a front wheel chock as well, but the strapping I have shown in the pictures, is more than adequate on my yrips. It simply doesn not move at all! My only concern is the the strenght of the tie down brackets. If I was to add any of the chocks mentioned in previous posts I do not think the bike will fit in.

I would like to hear from anyone that employs a wheel chock and see some pics.

Gary


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## Keith (Oct 17, 2009)

Well here is what I ended up with so far.
Wheel chock and E-Rail all bolted through the floor with backing plates on the bottom side.
I had a factory rep call me yesterday, and he said the floor is constructed as such. Bottom 1/4 plywood than foam insulation than 2 more sheets of ¼ inch plywood at 90 degrees to each other. He also said that there were wood inserts where the D-ring are located that were formed into the foam. He did not know how long there were.


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## ELSEWHERE (Sep 16, 2007)

Damn that's a mean looking dog!!


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## Keith (Oct 17, 2009)

The dog is not mean, she just does not like her picture taken. I think she thinks it make her look fat.


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## ELSEWHERE (Sep 16, 2007)

I was kidding about the mean part. She looks like she's about to fall asleep standing up. I would be the last to call her fat, just well fed, like our dog.


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