# The Risks Of Back Wood Camping



## Tangooutback (Apr 16, 2010)

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100815/ap_on_re_us/us_inmate_escape_family_s_tragedy;_ylt=Ahy9Ko6mWcATWj4nmDNuI9JbbBAF;_ylu=X3oDMTNtaHM1bjEyBGFzc2V0A2FwLzIwMTAwODE1L3VzX2lubWF0ZV9lc2NhcGVfZmFtaWx5X3NfdHJhZ2VkeQRjY29kZQNtb3N0cG9wdWxhcgRjcG9zAzcEcG9zAzcEc2VjA3luX3RvcF9zdG9yaWVzBHNsawNzbGFpbm9rbGFjb3U-

It is not safe to venture off road alone.


----------



## Carey (Mar 6, 2012)

Plenty safe when a bazooka is brought along. Sad story... It is a tough world out there. I see the worst things not fit for this forum on a daily occurance.


----------



## Nathan (Jan 2, 2007)

A very sad, and very random event. I have no idea how you would protect yourself from these types of things...


----------



## Scoutr2 (Aug 21, 2006)

My 9mm S&W always goes along with us on trips and I keep it right beside the bed. It may not save my life, but I'll go down tryin'!

Mike


----------



## deanintemp (Apr 3, 2007)

Scoutr2 said:


> My 9mm S&W always goes along with us on trips and I keep it right beside the bed. It may not save my life, but I'll go down tryin'!
> 
> Mike


----------



## Tangooutback (Apr 16, 2010)

Scoutr2 said:


> My 9mm S&W always goes along with us on trips and I keep it right beside the bed. It may not save my life, but I'll go down tryin'!
> 
> Mike


Where do you stand in the eyes of the law when you cross state line with a firearms in your vehicle/trailer?

What charge are you going to face if you survive an attack thanks to the weapon you had in your vehicle?

Many years ago there was a case of a tent camper in Yellowstone who fired couple of shots with his pistol into the air to chase an intruder bear who stuck its head inside his tent. He tried to scare the bear away by beating on pots and pants and neither the bear was scared nor it brought help from other campers nearby. The bear did not beat a retreat until he discharged his weapon.
The warden came later and arrested him for carrying a firearm into the park and for discharging the firearm. They found the bear later unhurt, but that changed nothing.

With a bear at least you get to identify the danger right away. With escaped convicts it is most likely that they initially come on to you in such a friendly way that you never see the danger sign and not able to bring your weapon to bear in time.

The best defense is to travel in large group if you want to go off road. One old couple in the back woods is really very vulnerable.


----------



## Scottps (Jan 21, 2010)

Tangooutback said:


> My 9mm S&W always goes along with us on trips and I keep it right beside the bed. It may not save my life, but I'll go down tryin'!
> 
> Mike


Where do you stand in the eyes of the law when you cross state line with a firearms in your vehicle/trailer?

What charge are you going to face if you survive an attack thanks to the weapon you had in your vehicle?

Many years ago there was a case of a tent camper in Yellowstone who fired couple of shots with his pistol into the air to chase an intruder bear who stuck its head inside his tent. He tried to scare the bear away by beating on pots and pants and neither the bear was scared nor it brought help from other campers nearby. The bear did not beat a retreat until he discharged his weapon.
The warden came later and arrested him for carrying a firearm into the park and for discharging the firearm. They found the bear later unhurt, but that changed nothing.

With a bear at least you get to identify the danger right away. With escaped convicts it is most likely that they initially come on to you in such a friendly way that you never see the danger sign and not able to bring your weapon to bear in time.

The best defense is to travel in large group if you want to go off road. One old couple in the back woods is really very vulnerable.
[/quote]

I do see your point, but as of this past January they made it legal to have guns in national parks.


----------



## Scoutr2 (Aug 21, 2006)

Tangooutback said:


> My 9mm S&W always goes along with us on trips and I keep it right beside the bed. It may not save my life, but I'll go down tryin'!
> 
> Mike


Where do you stand in the eyes of the law when you cross state line with a firearms in your vehicle/trailer?

What charge are you going to face if you survive an attack thanks to the weapon you had in your vehicle?

Many years ago there was a case of a tent camper in Yellowstone who fired couple of shots with his pistol into the air to chase an intruder bear who stuck its head inside his tent. He tried to scare the bear away by beating on pots and pants and neither the bear was scared nor it brought help from other campers nearby. The bear did not beat a retreat until he discharged his weapon.
The warden came later and arrested him for carrying a firearm into the park and for discharging the firearm. They found the bear later unhurt, but that changed nothing.

With a bear at least you get to identify the danger right away. With escaped convicts it is most likely that they initially come on to you in such a friendly way that you never see the danger sign and not able to bring your weapon to bear in time.

The best defense is to travel in large group if you want to go off road. One old couple in the back woods is really very vulnerable.
[/quote]

The gun stays in its case and is not loaded until I put the clip in the magazine. And it travels in the trailer while I am driving in the truck. That is legal in all of the lower 48 states. And if I get arrested for scaring off someone or something that would harm me or my family - well then, I'll accept whatever punishment comes my way. My family has a higher priority.

And crooks count on the fact that I might be afraid of getting in trouble by defending myself. (They're still looking for whoever recently killed that couple in Arizona that were in a 23' travel trailer in a NFS campground.)

But everyone is entitled to their opinion.

Mike


----------



## Carey (Mar 6, 2012)

Scoutr2 said:


> My 9mm S&W always goes along with us on trips and I keep it right beside the bed. It may not save my life, but I'll go down tryin'!
> 
> Mike


Where do you stand in the eyes of the law when you cross state line with a firearms in your vehicle/trailer?

What charge are you going to face if you survive an attack thanks to the weapon you had in your vehicle?

Many years ago there was a case of a tent camper in Yellowstone who fired couple of shots with his pistol into the air to chase an intruder bear who stuck its head inside his tent. He tried to scare the bear away by beating on pots and pants and neither the bear was scared nor it brought help from other campers nearby. The bear did not beat a retreat until he discharged his weapon.
The warden came later and arrested him for carrying a firearm into the park and for discharging the firearm. They found the bear later unhurt, but that changed nothing.

With a bear at least you get to identify the danger right away. With escaped convicts it is most likely that they initially come on to you in such a friendly way that you never see the danger sign and not able to bring your weapon to bear in time.

The best defense is to travel in large group if you want to go off road. One old couple in the back woods is really very vulnerable.
[/quote]

The gun stays in its case and is not loaded until I put the clip in the magazine. And it travels in the trailer while I am driving in the truck. That is legal in all of the lower 48 states. And if I get arrested for scaring off someone or something that would harm me or my family - well then, I'll accept whatever punishment comes my way. My family has a higher priority.

And crooks count on the fact that I might be afraid of getting in trouble by defending myself. (They're still looking for whoever recently killed that couple in Arizona that were in a 23' travel trailer in a NFS campground.)

But everyone is entitled to their opinion.

Mike
[/quote]

Well said. Now if you would post what actually happened to the guy who got arrested in Yellowstone it would be greatly appreciated. If you heard about this you know the date. Look up what happened and tell us please. Im betting it was thrown out.

Gun laws are getting easier/better with the times we are living in. Like it or not.

Carey


----------



## CamperAndy (Aug 26, 2004)

Guys please remember no politics and think twice before you post about your gun and what you will do with it. There are other forums on the Internet for those discussions.


----------



## deanintemp (Apr 3, 2007)

CamperAndy said:


> Guys please remember no politics and think twice before you post about your gun and what you will do with it. There are other forums on the Internet for those discussions.


Well said Andy...I just retracted my statement as I don't like to advertise!


----------



## Tangooutback (Apr 16, 2010)

I am not trying to talk anyone out of carrying weapons for self-defense. I am a gun enthusiast myself and strongly support the 2nd amendment. I collect WWII military arms for a hobby and let's just say that I am properly equipped with modern hardware to be able to defend myself in situation such as the LA riot following Rodney King first trial. However, after taking a class in Concealed Carry License where legal issues as well as the dynamic and aftermath following weapon deployment were discussed, I have to agree with the instructor that drawing weapon for self defense is a lot more complicated than one can imagine. The instructor himself was a 20 years LE veteran.

I am merely discussing the plus and minus of what one can possibly face if one unfortunately is in the same shoes as this couple. I have no intention to infringe on anyone else's right to self-defense.

Carey,
I read about that camper in Yellowstone quite a while back in one of the hard copy gun rags. There was not any follow up on that article to know what the ending was at the time. But, I can assure you even if that individual was eventually acquitted of all charges by a judge he still ends up selling his farm to pay legal counsel.

A fellow co-worker of mine was pulled over for running a stop sign. The cop saw an empty casing on the floor board and therefore conducted a search of his vehicle. He asked my friend if he was carrying any weapon. At that point, my friend remembered about the .45 ACP he left in the glove box. He advised the officer to that affect and also told the officer the magazine was empty, no round in chamber. My friend was cuffed on the spot and spent the night in jail. He and I had gone to the gun range the day before and shot in an IPSC match. He forgot to remove the pistol out of his vehicle when he got home. The case was eventually dismissed based on the facts that the gun was unloaded, he had no criminal record, had been fully employed all his life, the IPSC match was verified to take place the day before and I plus two other witnesses testified that he did shoot the IPSC match that day as he claimed. By the time the case was over, it cost him 15 grands in court cost and attorney fees. This was 1982 and back then 15 grands were a little over half of his annual gross income as a Medical Technologist.

No matter how innocent one is, the moment a cop slaps that cuff on one's wrists, he is a loser thanks to the fact that it takes "grease" to spin the wheel of justice (his attorney's advice)


----------



## Justman (Jul 22, 2006)

This is an extremely sad story. Not sure it was preventable. We're all pretty trusting people and criminals are quick to take advantage of that. I really hope they catch these mentally deranged folks soon and put them away for a very long time...perhaps permanently.


----------



## Scoutr2 (Aug 21, 2006)

I must say that this is a topic that nobody will ever agree on 100% and it is best left for some other venue. But it would be interesting to see how many folks do carry some sort of means of protection from man or beast. Not opinions - just yes or no.

Mike


----------



## Sweathog62 (Jul 28, 2005)

Back to the topic of the Oklahoma couple killed, the local relatives indicated that by the amount of blood found in the cab of the truck, they went down fighting. BTW-Thanks to all the Arizona people who have supported the family searching for a 3rd dog never found, and all the offerings of support. Not a good situation for anyone. I am sure more details will follow.

Brad


----------



## Patty (Mar 4, 2010)

Just to clarify, the couple were traveling to Colorado from OK and the people who are being so supportive are from Santa Rosa NM. The fugitives were from AZ. So thanks to the wonderful people from Santa Rosa NM. It is one of the positives of this terrible story, that they are reaching out and helping strangers that way.


----------



## letscamp (Jan 22, 2010)

You guys all make me laugh out loud! And yes I spelled it out instead of LOL! Because first off the whole bear story (he was a drunk at 4am by the way) is a sack of well... you know....and there are always two side to the story! Lets just say no matter what you hear, read, or do, as long as you do whats right you will be just fine.

Adding a little more all 50 states your rv/tt is a "home" and you, as long as your stationary, can treat it as such.... Not going to add anything else but, at home do you have a loaded gun hiding somewhere so when someone breaks in you can protect your family?

I really enjoy this site, but all too often many people live the life of "It will never happen to me, I live and camp in perfectvill USA."..Really?

Regardless of what you see or read, the next time your having a great time camping with your family.. ask your self this.....Would it be better to be judged by 12 than carried by 6? Only common sense can be used....

No offend to anyone,







whatever, but sometimes I have to speak my mind.

Adding to one of the original post I'd put money on it that they are already in Canada.


----------



## rdvholtwood (Sep 18, 2008)

Fugitves were caught!

Here is the story...click here....


----------



## Tangooutback (Apr 16, 2010)

letscamp said:


> Adding a little more all 50 states your rv/tt is a "home" and you, as long as your stationary, can treat it as such.... Not going to add anything else but, at home do you have a loaded gun hiding somewhere so when someone breaks in you can protect your family?


Perhaps you can enlighten us with legal aspect of this issue. I have read a lot of discussion/arguments over the definition of "home" regarding RV/TT when it comes to firearms. One school claims one is perfectly within legal right due to RV/TT being "your home" in the eyes of the law. The other school says it is all up to the discretion of the cop on scene. He can enter and search your "self-proclaimed home" without a warrant as he sees it nothing more than a vehicle.


----------



## TimbaJack (Jul 27, 2010)

rdvholtwood said:


> Fugitves were caught!
> 
> Here is the story...click here....


Glad they caught them!


----------



## deanintemp (Apr 3, 2007)

Tangooutback said:


> Adding a little more all 50 states your rv/tt is a "home" and you, as long as your stationary, can treat it as such.... Not going to add anything else but, at home do you have a loaded gun hiding somewhere so when someone breaks in you can protect your family?


Perhaps you can enlighten us with legal aspect of this issue. I have read a lot of discussion/arguments over the definition of "home" regarding RV/TT when it comes to firearms. One school claims one is perfectly within legal right due to RV/TT being "your home" in the eyes of the law. The other school says it is all up to the discretion of the cop on scene. He can enter and search your "self-proclaimed home" without a warrant as he sees it nothing more than a vehicle.
[/quote]

I am able to write off the interest as though it is a second home. You are only able to do that with self-contained units (bathroom, electricity, running water, etc). In general, pop-ups do not qualify for this deduction! My attorney (Michigan) says they are treated like a vehicle when they are hooked up to your tow-vehicle. They are treated like a home when set up and self-contained.


----------



## SouthLa26RS (Jul 10, 2006)

Protect the family with all means possible....bang....bang


----------



## Tyvekcat (Aug 28, 2007)

Way back in the dinosaur days me and a few friends use to hike Appalachian trail. Beautiful back country, sometimes we wouldn't see anyone for days. Never had any run ins with black bears, but in the 80's they were not as prevalent nor were there mention of coyote in Va. Only a couple times did I not feel comfortable out there. You know, when you run into someone that is out of place, too friendly, or just doesn't have any camping supplies with them and you're a ways from any town. I was always listening for 'banjos'.
Never went out with less than three of us,(safety in numbers) and always had 'something' to cause, pause.

So I am not taking any chances these days. Keep your head on a swivel when fueling up. Know your surroundings at all times. Generally I stay in states that have reciprocity with Virginia. Stay safe out there


----------



## svinc (Jun 1, 2010)

Since when can an officer search your trailer without a warrant? No more than he can search your vehicle without a warrant, unless he has your permission, or probable cause (bag of white powder on floor, etc.)

I was pulled over for making an illegal left on red (thought it was a one way street) a few years ago. I was 24, driving a pretty high end sports car and the officer tried every trick in his book to search my vehicle. I politely told him that unless he had a warrant I wasn't going to allow him to search my car. He threatened calling K9 out to sniff the outside of the car (which they can do) I told him that would be fine. He said he smelled marijuana smoke in my car, I told him I don't smoke marijuana, or even cigs and definitely wouldn't do it in my car, then he finally said he was going to obtain a warrant, I said that would be fine as well. Had me wait in my car for 45 minutes, before he came to the window and asked one last time "if you have nothing to hide, why won't you let me just take a quick peek" I told him I have nothing to hide but the law is pretty clear on this.

He let me off with a 'warning' It was an inconvenience sure, but since when do we have to let someone search our property because they 'want' to? If I let him search it would have been a 5 minute traffic stop, he probably still thinks I had something in my car, lol.


----------

