# Urgent



## Keith68 (Feb 18, 2011)

Last night the temps dropped to around 20 degrees. I was running propane heat at 65 throughout the night and had the hot water heater was turned on (electric). Went to take a shower in the morning and no water at all comes out when the hot water lever is turned. The cold water works fine.

I heated the trailer for about an hour at 75 and still got nothing. I dropped the trailer off at a fantastically unresponsive dealer (warranty work was scheduled which is why it wasn't skirted yet), and am waiting to hear back with no where to live.

Can anyone guess as to the problem and cost to repair? When pipes freeze what are the odds that there is no damage once it's thawed out? Snow is coming and I need to decide whether to invest time and money in full timing this winter or wave the white flag and buying some anti freeze.

Thanks in advance for any advice,

KJ


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## Gilligan (Aug 25, 2006)

Given the cold water is working fine, I have my doubts about the hot water line being frozen, but it is not an impossibility. When the hot water suddenly stops, such as your case, the more likely culprit is the check valve on the water heater outlet. They are known to fail in this manner, and it is common. It is usually (depending on the trailer model) very easy to get to and replace. A new valve is only a few dollars. In a pinch you can just remove the valve altogether and run without it until a replacement can be obtained.

Gilligan


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## Boomer (Jun 10, 2009)

Keith:

There is a chance that the hot water froze, hot water left in the cold freezes quicker than cold (not a myth).
Odds are good that you do not have any damage to the pipes. The pipes are plastic and will give a little. There is a problem if the pipes freeze, thaw, freeze, thaw etc. Each time it freezes, it stretches the plastic just that much more until they split.
Hope you don't have any problems.

Boomer


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## GlenninTexas (Aug 11, 2004)

Most likely when the water thaws you'll be fine, the next likely thing would be a connector or elbow being pushed off htthe tubing and lastly the tubing itself splitting. Definitely turn off the water source and once it warms up turn on the water just a little bit so you can check under cabinets and under the trailer for leaks.

Good luck, Glenn


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## KTMRacer (Jun 28, 2010)

Keith68 said:


> Last night the temps dropped to around 20 degrees. I was running propane heat at 65 throughout the night and had the hot water heater was turned on (electric). Went to take a shower in the morning and no water at all comes out when the hot water lever is turned. The cold water works fine.
> 
> I heated the trailer for about an hour at 75 and still got nothing. I dropped the trailer off at a fantastically unresponsive dealer (warranty work was scheduled which is why it wasn't skirted yet), and am waiting to hear back with no where to live.
> 
> ...


Since you were running the electric element if it was working, no chance the tank froze. Even with it off, I doubt it. We camp below freezing and I turn off the HW heater at night. Even with it below freezing, 25F or so, when I get up in the morning the HW is still warm, probably 80F or so. And we set the thermostat at 45F so it gets cool inside.

It is possible that a line from the HW tank to a faucet froze, did you try ALL the HW faucets or just one? Or as mentioned the HW check valve could have frozen.

But Outbacks are IMHO really only a 3 season trailer, the Artic Pac is a nice advertizing slogan, but I'd say teens to 20F at night or so is about the coldest temp I'd want to use one in.


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## Jewellfamily (Sep 25, 2010)

If it is the check valve like Gilligan said, you could pull the panel and flip the hot water heater bypass valve. If you get hot water, the check valve is bad or it is froze between the valve and bypass line. if you dont get water, your froze somewhere else in the line.


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## Keith68 (Feb 18, 2011)

Thank you to everyone for your responses. Just reading your replies gave me hope on "one of those days" where everything that could go wrong did. I don't know what the problem was, but after heating further with propane, everything is working again.

Also, I am waving the white flag. One more night and I'm off to Wal-Mart to buy anti-freeze and start apartment hunting. I would LOVE to live full time in my OB this winter just for the challenge and the knowledge that I would accumulate. However, as a full-time grad student, I just don't have the time to deal with the inevitable issues that will probably keep coming up.

Any advice on winterizing this late in the season?


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## ftwildernessguy (Oct 12, 2009)

Boomer said:


> Keith:
> 
> There is a chance that the hot water froze, hot water left in the cold freezes quicker than cold (not a myth).
> Odds are good that you do not have any damage to the pipes. The pipes are plastic and will give a little. There is a problem if the pipes freeze, thaw, freeze, thaw etc. Each time it freezes, it stretches the plastic just that much more until they split.
> ...


If you are a fan of myth busters, you may have seen the episode where they busted this myth re. Hot water freezing before cold water. The reality is, water freezes at 32 degrees F or 0 degrees C for you guys from Canada. Hot water will take longer to get down to this temp than cold water. So, it is a myth.


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## Boomer (Jun 10, 2009)

ftwildernessguy said:


> Keith:
> 
> There is a chance that the hot water froze, hot water left in the cold freezes quicker than cold (not a myth).
> Odds are good that you do not have any damage to the pipes. The pipes are plastic and will give a little. There is a problem if the pipes freeze, thaw, freeze, thaw etc. Each time it freezes, it stretches the plastic just that much more until they split.
> ...


If you are a fan of myth busters, you may have seen the episode where they busted this myth re. Hot water freezing before cold water. The reality is, water freezes at 32 degrees F or 0 degrees C for you guys from Canada. Hot water will take longer to get down to this temp than cold water. So, it is a myth.
[/quote]

I have not seen that issue of Mythbusters (but will keep my eyes open). Being a plumber up here in Canada in my past life, it was mostly hot water lines that froze / split rather than cold. I did a quick google search on this and there are more items on hot water freezing before cold water rather then vice versa.


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## muttbike (Apr 27, 2009)

In a lot of residential installations using PVC, the PVC hot water pipe is smaller than the PVC cold water pipe. Less volume, the quicker to freeze.

JR


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## CamperAndy (Aug 26, 2004)

Boomer said:


> Keith:
> 
> There is a chance that the hot water froze, hot water left in the cold freezes quicker than cold (not a myth).
> Odds are good that you do not have any damage to the pipes. The pipes are plastic and will give a little. There is a problem if the pipes freeze, thaw, freeze, thaw etc. Each time it freezes, it stretches the plastic just that much more until they split.
> ...


If you are a fan of myth busters, you may have seen the episode where they busted this myth re. Hot water freezing before cold water. The reality is, water freezes at 32 degrees F or 0 degrees C for you guys from Canada. Hot water will take longer to get down to this temp than cold water. So, it is a myth.
[/quote]

I have not seen that issue of Mythbusters (but will keep my eyes open). Being a plumber up here in Canada in my past life, it was mostly hot water lines that froze / split rather than cold. I did a quick google search on this and there are more items on hot water freezing before cold water rather then vice versa.
[/quote]

Part of the basis for this is that heating the water changes the way the water molecules line up and this affects the way it freezes. Heated water removes free oxygen and the ice will be clearer then water that is not recently boiled. I did not see the Myth Buster episode for this so I can't comment on that to much but they are normally very through so I would beleive them on the time it takes to freeze.


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## cdn campers (Oct 31, 2011)

hi all. i did that experiment at home for my kids science project a few years back. put two containers of water say 1cup ea. one with cold water and one with hot in the freezer. you will be surprised to see which one froze first.


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